Is America Headed Toward Revolution?

As if things weren't already bad enough when it comes to an omnipresent and increasingly oppressive Federal Government in America, now, thanks to Obama we get this.

The Obama administration formally declared Monday that carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gas emissions pose a danger to the public's health and welfare, a move that lays the groundwork for an economy-wide carbon cap even if Congress fails to enact climate legislation.

Combined with the ongoing health care reform proposals in Congress, if these policies will out, there will effectively be no private sector left in America. And even the half-true concept of individual freedom we currently enjoy, thanks to ever growing and ever encroaching government, will be all but gone.

Add in current citizen dissatisfaction due to a terrible economy that won't let up for sometime, which will only be more true if these destructive policies are enacted, and I'm honestly not sure where this all ends.

I would never have imagined, let alone predicted that there would be revolution in America in my lifetime. And I'm certainly not predicting it now.  Yet, I can imagine it for the first time and that's not reassuring at all. 

What form it may eventually take, or how broadly it may spread, I can't say. But I do sense enough remaining rebellious spirit and angry people in this country that they will not go quietly into the good night.

Assuming they do, how Americans finally stand up to this government is unforeseeable. But I'd hazard a guess that there's enough of them troubled enough to make history, even if they are unable to make a difference in the end.

Interesting times, folks, we live in interesting times. Stay tuned. If main street ever explodes, it would make the mostly student riots of the Sixties look like playground exercise.

Comments

[seekeronos]

Saw this coming nearly three years ago, and was certain of it following last year's presidential SELECTION.

It ain't to late to pack in your dry food and water tanks, as well as heritage seeds, and of course, hardware (guns) and software (ammo)

The Days of the Lord's Retribution against the Babylonian system we have become are drawing nigh.

[Ad rem]

Perhaps this is why it's getting all but impossible to find 45 ammo.....

[Reaganite Republican]

Looks to me like the revolution's already well underway, Dan-

What we're talking about now will be the counter-revolution... tending
back towards towards natural law

[Neo]

Lemmings

[Darth Venomous]

Whining accusations of treason from Roberta in 5...4...3...2...

[Neo]

In all my decades, I have never seen a Congress and White House who have completely lost their minds like now.

[lurker9876]

Same here, Neo.

I got into an argument about whether the Declaration of Independence grants the civilians the right to revolt against unjust governments. The objections from the Obama supporters are 1) This is a democratically-elected government; therefore, it is not an unjust government. and 2) the civilians don't have the right for armed revolt against unjust government.

The problem with armed revolt by the civilians is because the federal government has the means to revolt in response with stronger arms so we would lose unless the military and police side with the civilians.

As for democratically-elected governments, look at Hamas, Venezuela, and Iran. Weren't they democratically-elected governments? Yes. Were they unjust governments? Yes.

We elected them into the office BUT they are quickly transforming our government into socialism.

Philip Klien also has a good article in the American Spectator about Obama's administration where they have far more power than Congress.

Nope, there ain't checks and balances. Ah but what about Bush? Wasn't there checks and balances there? Yes but they were necessary and in our favor.

Armed revolt? What do you guys think? What did John Locke say about armed revolt? Wasn't this one of the justifications for the Second Amendment?

And lastly, Dan, what kind of a revolution are you talking about?

[Philip McDaniel]

It has begun.

[Christopher Calandro]

I'm simply preparing and waiting for the political violence to begin.

I wish I were joking, if only a little.

[Neo]

Unfortunately, the battle over the 2nd amendment lost completely the meaning of the Founding Fathers envisioned. It's not that guns are only for militias or for individuals who may join a militia, it was meant that citizens should have the means required by any militia (i.e. guns, cannons, battleships, aircraft, missiles, etc.) so that they could then be used for a militia.

[Pasadena Phil]

If my experience is indicative of what is going on in this country, I am not having many discussions these days involving Dem vs Rep or liberal vs conservative. They are mostly angry discussions about "us" vs government. People are beyond nervous. They are angry.

[unseen]

I think we will see a military coup before a revolution, myself. already the military is under 40% approval of this admin and less for congress. If they continue on I don't see it ending well

[Mike]

I have had it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They can't have my country! I will fight them to the death!!!!!!!!!!!!!This was the last straw!

[Mike]

How would we organize without the Government snooping and locking everyone up?

[Pasadena Phil]

I am surprised at you commenters who believe revolution in this country is impossible because the government can deploy more force than we can. Really? Think carefully about that. We're not talking about a small fringe group of nuts but a popular uprising. Our police would shoot "mom and pop" protesters? In this country, the police are "us" too. Do you really believe that they would shoot their families, friends and neighbors? Same with the National Guard and Army (should they go that route). This is exactly what the "Oath Keepers" movement is aimed at forcing our military and police to think seriously about. It is a message to those in government who may foolishly sense an opportunity for a forceful takeover of government. God forbid they call in UN forces because I am certain that alone would trigger a domestic uprising by itself. Even at my age, I'd be out there among them.

If people like me, (a squeaky-clean, law-abiding, taxpaying professional entrepreneur who blushes easily) conclude that with our individual liberties lost we have nothing to lose by taking to the streets, there will be bloody hell to pay. Those there is nothing you would die for, you have nothing to live for. You are wasting your freedom and will lose it. I do not plan to live nor die like a dog. That is what defines being American.

[Mike]

We have to do it in mass, across the nation in near timing. That involves some coordination that our snoops would quickly destroy. I too am a squeaky clean taxpayer. I am a former Marine (0300) current Professional Fireman, father of three beautiful kids. I stand to lose much, but i will not allow this Government to destroy my children's future. I am not anti-government, merely anti tyrant!

[Brad Heath]

We could stop this now, if we had a few brave Governors that would openly state they would not enforce the EPA regs, and the new Health Care Mandates.

They could ban together and SUE the US government and get it straight into the Supreme Courts. It wouls make great drama and I think we could win this.

[Pasadena Phil]

Correction to my last post: If there is nothing you would die for, you probably have nothing to live for either.

[SpeakEasy]

unseen, as an active duty military member of 23+ years I feel safe assuring you the US military will not try to stage a coup. What is more likely is secession of states creating enough upheaval to necessitate a new convention. If the union dissolves, even temporarily, there will those who stay and those who return to their state home of record. Let us hope for a transition but a peaceful one.

[Mike]

The supreme court helped create this mess in the first place. No state is required to aid the Federal government in enforcing Federal Laws if I remember correctly. This was supposed to be the way of defeating non-constitutional laws, not the Supreme Court.

[bruce]

We're not really a country anymore. At least not an independent country anymore. We're feminized, pacified and it's all heading to one world governmetn - the dream of leftists like Barry for decades.

There is not proud, strong USA anymore. It's over. Obsessive globalization and mass immigration has killed the USA.

Liberalism is a mental disorder.

[thirteen28]

If things keep going in the direction they are, then there damn well better be a revolution. If not, then we the people deserve what we get from these clowns running the country.

[Pasadena Phil]

We had a 2-million-strong Tea Party rally in September that was very peaceful and left DC cleaner than when they arrived. Next time, let's make it 5-million-strong and drag our government out of their offices and into the street to make sure they heard us. Of course, let's clean up after ourselves again. No need to be slobs.

[alwaysfiredup]

Didn't some russian scientist predict that we'd split up into 7 different countries by 2012? Found it, make that 2010:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123051100709638419.html

He divided them only the way a person who had no idea of this countries loyalties would divide. Idaho would of course go with Montana and Wyoming, Texas and Florida can't stand each other, and no Missourian or Nebraskan would be in cahoots with Illinois or Michigan. Personally, I think we'd divide up based on college sports conferences: Big 12, Big 10, Atlantic, Southeast, Pacific, etc.

[Philip McDaniel]

We need to be united in our goals and aims. Non-violent non compliance. Civil disobedience and the earnest encouragement of our police, guard and military to stand with us. The 'Oath Keepers' movement will be very important to us. Our elected representatives need to be brought to the understanding that we are serious, will not go away and will not be bought off. If we can use the courts and legal means to assist us then well and good. However, do not be surprised that lawyers, politicians and vested interest groups will vehemently appose us -- even to the point of violence. If so, let the first shots be theirs. We have can have the satisfaction that our stand is just, honorable and as principled as that of the founding fathers of our country.

[Mike]

Im with you!!!! lets drag the Bastard out into the streets and have them answer to us, they could not stop us if we amassed!

[Sadly]

Back in 2006 I was telling my friends that I didn't think the U.S.A. would make it until 2020 as a single, united Country. I look at what Congress is doing, and can't see anything but Pelosi and Reid as "Thelma and Louise" gunning the engine and driving the country off a cliff. The normal check on unpopular legislation is that members have to face voters in the next election. But that is no longer a real obstacle. The powers in D.C. can guarantee post-election finacial security for any politician willing to ignore the electorate. At this stage, I fear that people will come to see violence as the only solution.

[MarineMomFirst]

If we can't stop this in November 2010, then America may be lost. However, I am betting that we take our country back. I know way too many folks who voted for Obama who now have buyer's remorse.

[lurker9876]

"I am surprised at you commenters who believe revolution in this country is impossible because the government can deploy more force than we can. Really? Think carefully about that. We're not talking about a small fringe group of nuts but a popular uprising. Our police would shoot "mom and pop" protesters? In this country, the police are "us" too. Do you really believe that they would shoot their families, friends and neighbors? Same with the National Guard and Army (should they go that route). This is exactly what the "Oath Keepers" movement is aimed at forcing our military and police to think seriously about. It is a message to those in government who may foolishly sense an opportunity for a forceful takeover of government. God forbid they call in UN forces because I am certain that alone would trigger a domestic uprising by itself. Even at my age, I'd be out there among them.

If people like me, (a squeaky-clean, law-abiding, taxpaying professional entrepreneur who blushes easily) conclude that with our individual liberties lost we have nothing to lose by taking to the streets, there will be bloody hell to pay. Those there is nothing you would die for, you have nothing to live for. You are wasting your freedom and will lose it. I do not plan to live nor die like a dog. That is what defines being American."

It wasn't me but that some liberal poster actually made this comment. I was shocked when she said that there is no way the civilians can do an armed revolt against the federal government because they are stronger than we are.

Ok, what exactly can the Oath Keepers do for us? I heard about it. And what did its leader say about the military obeying an illegal order from a US President?

That they are not required to obey any order they deemed it illegal?

[mag]

I remember in Romanina that dictator Nicoli C...... I sorry I can not remember the spelling of his name. He was as strong as the army behind him. When he gave orders for his soliders to start killing their own families they turned on him. And they ended up executing him and his wife.
So any gov't is only as strong as the army/police behind them. Everyone always said it could never happen here, but...I don't know most people are not liking the way this country is going
I think if our army/police had to take sides I don't think it would be with the gov't....certainly not this administration.

[lurker9876]

I see that more and more Americans are willing to vote for a Tea Party or 3rd party candidate. And I still see some liberals that refuse to acknowledge that they made a mistake in voting for Obama. These are the ones that refuse to recognize the symptoms of progressivism. They still have hope and change in Obama.

[Pasadena Phil]

Lurker: I hope you don't think I was directing my comment at you. I browsed the comments and saw yet again, as I have seen often on other blogs and threads, that sentiment that we cannot have a successful revolution in this country so I responded at no one in particular.

As to your question: "What can the Oath Keepers do for us?", simple. Everyone who has served in the US military and/or as a law enforcement officer in this country had to take the oath to defend the constitution to protect the country from enemies foreign and domestic. We all take oaths that we never expect be called to honor to the ultimate. That oath binds anyone who took it for life, not only as they serve. By willingly going on record to retake the oath, they are assuring us that we American citizens can count on the honor of our military and law-enforcement personnel to be with us when our domestic enemies force us to fight. It also sends a very clear warning to the oppressors that they cannot count on the Oath Takers to help them oppress the people. It is the American way of assuring each other that we are not Nazis, that will not someday have to claim that "we were following orders". We don't follow those kinds of orders in America.

The power of that message depends on its credibility. What I've said already on this thread could someday get me in front of a firing squad. I accept that risk. If we all do, we will be believed.

Remember "I am Spartacus!!!"?

[Pasadena Phil]

One more thing and I'm gone. I highly recommend a documentary about the Estonian resistance to the Soviet Union called "The Singing Revolution".

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B001CQS7M4/?tag=googhydr-20&hvadid=2966452875&ref=pd_sl_26ioc8bp6z_b

Only a heart of stone can watch this without being moved. If we can only be half as united and resolute as the Estonians were in their hopeless situation, we'll be fine.

[Old Trooper]

It is coming but things are just nor bad enough for it just yet.
And speakeasy, when retired and active duty service members receive
illegal orders, they will not act on them. Believe that.

[bruce]

I honestly am beginning to think more and more that we’re not really a country anymore. At least not a strong, independent country anymore. It’s all about world government, inter-dependence, “leveling” and “spreading the wealth”.

Obama is the dream of leftists everywhere.

[lurker9876]

Thanks Pasadena Phil. I thought you were directing it me until you explained it later. And thanks for the explanation about the Oath Keepers.

You guys watch Glenn Beck show today? About Robert Kramer and his wife who said that public option will wipe out the private insurance industry.

Do go and watch it.

Old Trooper, what will it take for things to get bad enough for a serious revolution?

[lurker9876]

And how will oath keepers, both retired and active duty service members, know which orders are illegal or not?

[DaveinPhoenix]

Liberal scum have divided America for decades: Black against white, old against young, rich against poor, responsible against irresponsible, man against women. The revolution started along time ago. I'll be supporting the side which the military supports - common sense.

[Pasadena Phil]

Lurker said:

"And how will oath keepers, both retired and active duty service members, know which orders are illegal or not?"

If our military is ordered to deploy domestically. There is a law called the Posse Comitatus Act

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act

that severely limits when and how our military can be deployed domestically. It is allowed in national security emergencies or natural catastrophes but I am not a lawyer so I can't speak to the issue of what constitutes an appropriate emergency. I am counting on the existence of a broad-based popular anger that affects everyone to help our Oath Keepers to determine for themselves that they are being asked to participate in an illegal act of government oppression. Officers are allowed (expected actually) to challenge orders they don't understand and/or have conscientious objections to. A dictatorial putsch would take on a Nixonian "Saturday Night Massacre" flavor if officer after officer refused to obey a particular order to engage in aggressive military maneuvers in Pasadena, for example, just because people were protesting in the streets. Maybe you military officers out there reading this can weigh on this.

Were situation to present itself, I suppose it would be like pornography: I know it when I see it. So will they.

[Pasadena Phil]

Here's an excellent link explaining the history of the principle of Posse Comitatus:

http://www.llrx.com/features/posse.htm

[Pasadena Phil]

We should be watching Congress very carefully for any attempts to amend the Posse Comitatus Act. Read this:

[I]t is interesting to note that no one has ever been convicted of violating 18 USC 1385, and when needed Congress has been quick to create statutory exceptions as permitted by the Act. The Act has therefore succeeded in putting forth an ideal, but has fallen woefully short in creating a practical, legal impediment to the use of the military for civil law enforcement. It could even be argued that the Act has only served to legitimize the military role of a posse comitatus by providing Congress with the ability to create its own exceptions whenever the need arises.

[MarkJ]

Just two observation:

1. If a military coup occurs in this country, it won't be imposed on the American public. Nope, it will be DEMANDED.

2. The rationale for military coups has been, as often as not, the need to restore constitutional order rather than abrogate it.

Is a coup likely? Not sure. However, if you'd told the average citizen in 1860 that, within five years, there'd be a civil war that would lay waste to much of the South, free 4 million black slaves, and result in 600,000 dead Northern and Southern soldiers....they'd have laughed you out of the room.

[ajacksonian]

Do remember that when the Russian Army returned from the Front in 1917 the Generals fully expected to be able to put down the Revolution.

The soldiers joined the Revolution.

As Machiavelli recommended, a military force that is made up of those who live in a region are its best defenders and can always be trusted to defend their homeland. Any US General attempting to Cross the Rubicon will find himself isolated just like the Russian Generals did in 1917. Machiavelli's recommendation also means that a Prince attempting to take power with such an army faces severe problems... he would do better with Mercenaries for that. Conscript armies tend to not want to fight their brothers and sisters, and volunteer ones sure as hell won't.

Only would secession cause that and the way we have shifted our culture means we no longer have the old allegiances to the States... although that still isn't gone in some areas from the Ozarks through Appalachia all the way up even into the Northeast. The central portion in TN could be called the Land of Browning. That is the dichotomy we are seeing, the old one that goes back to before the Founding: urban vs rural. Not State vs. State or even regions but the old rift that caused the Confederal Government to finally need a new Convention. We are one, fine Shays away from that today. The tinder has been dried by decades of 'bipartisanship' shifting power and money to DC for the elites. And the old rift returns. If you live beyond an interstate bypass, you are in one part of the country, and if inside one you are in another world. Cities can't live without the countryside... and that is where the rift will start just as it did in 1784-86. And the Lands of Browning will be known.

If you need ammo, try ammoengine.com or ammonow.com as you can get real good deals on 45. And 12ga is damned cheap.

[lurker9876]

Ah...that's why the militia is made up of civilians on voluntary basis.

Thanks, Pasadena Phil for the info on Posse Comitatus. I had forgotten about that act.

[lurker9876]

Seems that certain philosophers, such as John Locke, and the Founding Fathers predicted this and planned this loophole.

[lurker9876]

"Is a coup likely? Not sure. However, if you'd told the average citizen in 1860 that, within five years, there'd be a civil war that would lay waste to much of the South, free 4 million black slaves, and result in 600,000 dead Northern and Southern soldiers....they'd have laughed you out of the room."

I think most Americans would prefer to die free than live in chains under progressivism.

[Darth Venomous]

"Personally, I think we'd divide up based on college sports conferences: Big 12, Big 10, Atlantic, Southeast, Pacific, etc."

That'll just get us united again.

See, we'll be declaring war on the BCS, and... :-)

[MJ]

You people are hilarious. Armed revolution in America? It's time to get out the history books and turn to 1865. You ever hear of Sherman's March to the Sea? So go ahead and keep planning your armed resistance, in the end you'll lose everything.

[archer52]

http://truthandcommonsense.com/2009/12/07/climategate-will-the-governments-push-past-the-false-science-and-still-wreck-your-life-you-betcha%e2%99%a0/

From my website. I am beginning to believe the left and the elites are crossing a line none of us wanted to see crossed. It is for all the money this time, and how we respond may set the direction of the world for a hundred years.

[lurker9876]

MJ, like I said...most Americans would rather die FREE. Means that they would rather lose everything to be FREE.