NY-23: The Rubes Are Inside The Beltway, Folks

I want to challenge a paltry bit of growing conventional wisdom, as one of our alleged Inside the Beltway bright lights recently threw Thompson and Huckabee in my face regarding NY-23. He suggested that two nationally known conservatives backed the Conservative Party candidate in that race. Of course, the often duplicitous Huckabee isn't really backing anyone. He's trying to have it both ways, as is his usual MO.

But let's at least look at the facts. Perhaps we can educate these Inside the Beltway types who all too often seem to have little ability to think things out on their own. What they are good at in that regard is convincing themselves that they actually have. They generally repeat either what they've been told, or what they've been paid to repeat. But their vision is frequently far worse than that of an intelligent individual who doesn't play the Beltway charade.

Huckabee’s presidential primary foe, former Sen. Fred Thompson (R-Tenn.), has already backed Conservative Party candidate Doug Hoffman over GOPer Dede Scozzafava in the race, and now Huckabee’s efforts could bolster Hoffman too.

I won't name him. My goal is not to embarrass someone. It's to get to the meat of what a conservative at least isn't and apply some common sense to our own decision-making, unlike so many Beltway types.

Huckabee is easily dispatched. He is not a conservative. Anyone suggesting that remains blinded by those wonderful crosses they saw dancing across their TV screen in last year's Huckabee campaign ads. Fiscally, he's a populist, at best. And he actually has quite a liberal streak. Distributing income is just as much a desire with Huckabee as it is with the Left. He simply wants to use those tax dollars in a different way. On top of that, he's a Big Government guy. Anyone who thinks that dictating menus and diets has anything to do with conservatism has no idea what it is really about. That, or as I suggested, they are simply being blinded by the Light, as it were. So, enough of that BS. And that leaves us with Fred.

Ah, yes, "Good Old Fred". But what did he actually do in 2008?

What he actually did was jump in the race mostly at the last minute once his old and good friend John McCain who he had previously endorsed was going broke. I would say the best acting job of his career was his pretending he might actually run for President in 2008. But, truth be told, he didn't really pull the role off all that well, as you may rightly recall. What a pathetic and disappointing performance that whole charade turned out to be. But he did keep conservatives from rallying around Romney just long enough to allow his dear old friend John McCain to eventually raise a little bit of cash and basically re-enter the race.

And what did Fred do then? Well, he pulled the curtain back on his not fond of travel traveling show and let us all in on the joke. He dropped out. Well, not exactly. I mean, he did manage to hang around just long enough to attack Romney repeatedly in the debates while consistently giving John McCain all but a complete pass. Wow! What a dedicated conservative Fred Thompson turned out to be. And I won't even get into his having previously pushed campaign finance reform as a Senator right along with John McCain. Eventually, his acting job done, Thompson, that arch conservative, backed McCain, again. It isn't as if he hadn't ever endorsed him before, after all.

But, you pay attention to your betters, folks. Because these Inside the Beltway types, man they have the skinny on everything.

Just one last point. Before you start taking advice from those Inside the Beltway types, make sure you know upon which side their bread is buttered, or who is actually paying them, or what their own personal agendas happen to be. And don't leave out who funds the institutions and magazines some may work for, too. You might just figure out something they don't know.

Based upon my experience down here, it isn't actually hard if you're willing to think for yourself. And before you start taking advice from any of these Beltway types, be sure to look at all the angles the same way so many of our bright lights insight the Beltway seem to do before deciding anything.

You might discover a big surprise - the mopes tend to not be any better at knowing, or predicting much of anything to any degree of accuracy beyond just plain old you and me.

Comments

[happyfeet]

ok. Palin is a special case though I think. She's all kinds of singular. And at the end of the day you still have to question her judgment in signing on with Meghan's useless daddy. What was all that about?

[the bishop]

Look I was a Giuliani supporter, I wasn't happy about what happened, I liked Fred, but they pulled him off the stage,like an old vaudeville
act, way to soon. Did I like McCain's stances on Gitmo, global warming, campaign finance. I'm sure there were other objections. The first step is not to nominate someone who the base wants to hang in effigy. the problem is of course when the other side does do it,

[Dan Riehl]

Oh my, happyfeet doesn't sound too happy. I'm crushed.

At least it's good to know some of you are so all fired up. It's unfortunate that so many of you know anything about my actual positions on these people. I grew eary of Fred's BS before he dropped out. OTOH, you people tell me how politics must be slash and burn, then imjmediately go on to tell me how I guy who didn't even want to get off his ass to campaign is the real savior of America.

Aren't you embarassed by such illogical displays? You must be, or you'd comment under your real name.

I've already expressed my many concerns with Romney. He is not my guy, or gal, and I'd just as soon see him go away and clear the stage for someone else. His inability to connect with people has always caused me to be concerned as to whether or not he is even electable at all.

As for so-called "God freaks," I have no issues with the Religious Right unless they want to mandate morals from Washington. And if they embraced even a halfway decent fiscal con, I'd be fully on board. Huckabee is just more bad news, worse news than Bush's Compassionate Conservatism.

How many NY Cons were involved enough to get local NY leaders that never would have given Dede the nod? Oh, apparently not enough. Too bad.

Most of you have no clue how to bring change to an established political party. You get bounced around like ping pong balls between the social cons, the fiscal cons, the anti immigration crews.

How many of you were all fired up over that real conservative, GWB back when he first won? Only he wasn't very conservative, now was he? Why did Reagan take GB, Sr. as his VP? Didn't he realize he was inviting in a Northeastern Republican at heart who proved to be a disaster, giving us eight years of Clinton? (Though I still like the man)

He knew. He knew what he had to do to win the whole Party. So, get over it. You have never had a "conservative" Republican Party since you have voted.We had a great Con President in Reagan and we need another one. But NY-23 is NOT going to change America. And abandoning the GOP right now is only going to give Obama a free pass to ruin this country.

If you're down for it, go for it. R fund raising should be off the charts right now. It's been lagging behind the Dems all year. That's the way to turn things around, oh year.

Keep it up and you'll get the European socialist state here you must want.

[JorgXMckie]

I've been watching the idiot Republican Establishment step on its own dick when picking candidates in Illinois since at least 1980. The real problem that I've seen it that the Establishment Republicans want both the MSM and Democrats to like them. That means they really, really want to nominate RINOs, basically. What they *really* like is to nominate (at the sub-national level, anyway) is either a wealthy person who says they're a Republican but can appeal to 'the middle' (i.e. sound like a conservative but vote like a liberal) or a elected from a lower level who had demonstrated their 'electability' by sounding like a Republican and voting like a Democrat.

Oddly enough, in Illinois this led from total dominance of the Illinois executive offices and having control of at least one house of the Legislature to being hopeless losers who can only hope the Dems shoot themselves in the foot while being pathetically grateful at being allowed to share the boodle.

Time to get rid of them all.

[happyfeet]

I'm more happier when we're not talking about those Republican ones. They're very frustrating I think. But nonono I'm not giving them my monies. Next year I'll give monies to Meghan's useless daddy's primary challenger though. And I might adopt some wayward little Republican just for humanitarian purposes, but for the most part these people nominated Meghan's useless daddy. Do I look like one of those boomerangy battered women?

No. The answer is no I do not look like one of those boomerangy battered women.

[Zimriel]

Huckabee's not a libertarian; but who are you to say he is not a Conservative? If you ask Conservatives (i.e., not Instapundit) what they really think they may shock you.

Conservatives are about local stability. They're about God (including intelligent-design), country (shouldn't be allowed to desecrate Old Glory), and not rocking the economic boat too hard (protect our industry!).

Someone here mentioned "Movement Conservatives" who don't like Huckabee. Who are they? the Tea Party folks? the Paulians? bloggers?

[happyfeet]

Also no I indeed have no clue how to bring change to an established political party.

[the bishop]

Now this brings up the question of how the last successful Republican President came to be, he
arose out of a Congressional Debacle, 1974, where he spoke of distinction, 'bold colors'
was part of his speech. He challenged the establishment candidate, and lost, but built
up support, in the party ranks. When the manifest incompetence of the incumbent party
was practically self evidence.He had the answer. now who does that sound like today.

[Last Conservative In Brooklyn]

Very interesting discussion here. I agree with a number of the comments made. Specifically that the Republicans will snatch defeat from the jaws of victory in the 2010 mid-terms. You can smell it already. The RNC/NRCC is a disaster... alway's has been. Michael Steele needs to be shown the door.... pronto.

I'm amazed that the names Thompson, Huckabee and Romney are still discussed as contenders. They all have RINO written on their head. Thompson may be the best of them, but he didn't inpire much the last go around. We need to move away from 2008 with the possible exception of Palin perhaps. I'll go with Palin because she pisses everyone off and creates the most controversy. I think we need to rattle the cages here, and she does that. As one person pointed out here, you take aim at the people you fear the most..... you go girl.

Ultimately, the grass roots movements(Tea Parties) and others, Conservatives, Right Thinking Independents, the Ron Pauls, Federalists, Libertarians, Conservative Blogs and Press are all going to have to somehow meld into a more cohesive organization in order to offer a viable alternative Conservative movement to the RNC/NRCC Rino's. The right is too fractured right now it seems. I think the day's of the Regan (Genuflection - Our last "Great" President -- Mt. Rushmore still has space) big tent concept won't work within the RNC/NRCC Republican framework.

Essentially we all want the same thing in the end. Fiscal Conservatism, Lower Taxes, Smaller Government (decentralied federally with stronger state power), Strong Defense, Protected Borders, Responsive elected officals. No judical activism or mis-interpetation of the constitution.

Last thought.... she show's no signs of wanting to jump in the fray from what I read and see, but I would have thought and still think that Condi Rice would make an excellent candidate for President.... just my 2 cents.

Long Live King Michael III - Next coronation takes place Nov. 2nd in NYC. Chavez will be there to officiate the ceremony.

[davis,br]

Are you being a bit disingenuous Dan? Are you suggesting that since we've never had a "real" conservative GOP we shouldn't expect one? Or try for one? Or think it would be unpopular? Or unelectable? How can you be sure (if the latter)?

Is that the argument we're having?

I don't think so. I think its gone past that. Fire.Them.All.

I think the argument should rather be *when* has it ever been (or will it ever be) a BETTER time, what with the Democrats in disarray as their leftist illusions are exploding around them to the dismay of the not-so-erudite public who elected them, and they lose their jobs and their homes and their futures ...to *create* the conservative GOP that I believe (as demonstrated by Reagan, and the Contract w/America) would indeed be amazingly popular at the polls?

...and so finally and completely put a stake through the heart of the fascistic value systems of the irrational Left. Especially given the "awakening" of a public (demonstrated in the polls) that is beginning to clearly see what the result of giving control over the executive and legislative branches of government to the Left is doing to the future of the nation. Especially given that the Left is cooperating in its own demise with such public displays of rapaciousness and pathetic partisan lies that even the most coddled and politically blind "independent" is seeing through the spin of a media riddled with the products of Leftist evangelical dogma.

And so it seems that THIS is the time to divest ourselves of the Whigs (so to speak). Clean our own of the graft and corruption that so obviously permeates BOTH sides of the corrupt Establishment.

And *that's* what the argument should be.

...an argument that we've never seen this, is not an argument that it shouldn't be tried. Now!

I don't want to send those bastards back to Congress. Or put back-stabbing More-Of-The-Same in seats. That's not winning. That's still losing, just more slowly.

So let's try putting a stake through the heart of the Beast. In the *American* way of electoral politics. By appealing to conservative values (and I regard *conservative* values AS *American* values).

I'm not fond of what the "strategists" of the Party have wrought the past eight years. I don't think they were remotely conservative, or Reaganistic, or patriots, or anything but greedy self-aggrandazing elitists who lie and steal and seek to merely enrich themselves at the public trough and are no different in essence from the Democrats and thier prositutes in the MSM.

Pigs.

I'm sick of it. All of it.

[Josh Painter]

Honestly, Dan. As someone who respects you, I find it sad that you've bought into the meme that Fred was a willing stalking horse for McCain. I researched Fred more extensively than anyone I know of, and I found that he got into the race because a number of prominent Republicans and a grassroots "Draft Fred" movement convinced him that there was no true conservative in the race who could win, and they wouldn't take "no" for an answer.

This meme, and the "lack of fire in the belly" meme, all seem to have originated with Romney supporters. In addition, Romney backers put up a website named "Phony Fred" and kneecapped the man from Tennessee in every way imaginable.

No, Fred doesn't have the Palin charisma. He relates best to people face to face. His candidacy may have been doomed from the start, and he's not without his flaws. But to say that he got into the race just to help his friend McCain is a insult to Thomapson's integrity ands sell the man too short.

- JP

[Dan Riehl]

"Or unelectable?"

No, I think a reasonable but solid con would be eminently electable. I've consistently argued for more Con pols in the NE to give people a choice, though I do worry that the demographics have gotten out of control. Try to sell a social con in NJ. Good luck with that.

The problems with this country run far deeper than politics. From the schools to the culture, to the family, we have lost our mooring. Can it be regained? Perhaps, but that's a bottom up effort, not a top down one - though leadership at the top is critical and we lack it right now so far as I can tell.

Sadly, I don't see a leader capable for that role just now. Maybe it's Palin, maybe not. The jury is still out imo. It certainly is not our current political class, or R leaders.

But NY-23 is not going to change all that. And more than anything, I fear a Right-side split will lead to the end of the real American dream. Some wrong calculations could open the door to an even larger floodgate of liberalism thanks to the anti-traditional-America WH we have along with the Congress.

I am so concerned, the last thing I want to see is a tragically divided R Party right now. I simply don't think the timing is right, even though it may look like the oppoortunity is there. With opportunity comes risk.

And I fear we may risk our American heritage by fueling more divisiveness across the Right just now. A unified R Party with a great number of pick-ups in 2010 and a solid Right-side nominee in 2012 is my preference. But that nominee has to be working to groom a more Con organization right now. I don't believe that's what Fred or Huck is about and Palin hasn't showed up. Romney has taken a pass. Probably the smart play, but, as I said, don't read that into my saying he is my guy. He isn't.

If he is the best we have in 2012. Oh well. But for now, I don't feel that way at all. I've been waiting for a good national leader as long as most. Where is he, or she? I wish the frick I know. We could end up with Pawlenty if we aren't careful.

[Dan Riehl]

JP - I have ne reason to believe Fred wants to be a player in 2012, so I'm not arguing the point. I think Romney Co. was involved in crppling Palin and I'm damned upset about it. So, please don't misinterpret what I am saying as regards Romney.

[happyfeet]

Ok now I'm confused about Thompson. Not that it really matters. This little country was betrayed by her media I think. This is endgame. Lindsey Graham has signaled that Republicans will sell out this little country a lot enthusiastically. It's over. At this point it's just a math problem. A 1.4 trillion dollar deficit is not "unsustainable" to where we need to work on it or something ... it's ruinous. Hyperinflation and social instability and a dirty socialist press saying it's all for the good of the benighted American sheeple. I think most people know the America of our hopes and dreams is lying drunk in a dirty socialist gutter.

Loser Nation.

I think that's the long and the short of it. A dirty socialist debt-ridden fascist nightmare.

[Dan Riehl]

"I think that's the long and the short of it. A dirty socialist debt-ridden fascist nightmare."

I'd probably leave out fascist for now, but I do fear I am too close to agreeing with you for comfort.

As terrible as it sounds, one of my rationales for not supporting the bail-outs, was that it was designed to prop up a failing system. I fear only huge challenge has the ability to genuinely turn this country around.

And why I am in no way thrilled at the thought of America having to endure that, I am unconvinced anything short of a significant challenge presents the possiblity of truly righting the ship.

[M. Simon]

Romney Care.

I Sarah'cudda

[M. Simon]

Evidently html is not allowed so:

I heart Sarah'cudda

[M. Simon]

Dan,

The Right side has to split in order to get a coherent message. "Less than the Democrats" is not selling well.

Heck. I'm not even buying it. I agree that the socon deal is going no where. I mean really "I'm a socialist who believes in Jesus, that makes me a Republican." Do libertarians (the heart and soul of conservatism) have anything in common with that attitude?

“If you analyze it I believe the very heart and soul of conservatism is libertarianism.” - Ronald Reagan Reason Magazine July 1975

Me? I'm sick and tired of socon socialism. And RINO socialism.

[happyfeet]

I think it's awful, and with our supremely complacent and complicit dirty socialist media all bets are off. I'm gonna learn to speak Australian I think.

[Last Conservative In Brooklyn]

I can't do this all night... I gotta eat dinner and watch the Yankee game. The thread is really deteriorating into pesemissm regarding the Republican Party, and for good reason... its depressing to read.

I never posted on a conservative blog before, but I was motivated because of the subject title regarding the NY-23 district race. Since I live in Brooklyn and NYS as such, I tend to watch these things a little closer. I'm waiting for the Republican party to do something right in this state, and this NY-23 situation just burns me. To add insult to injury, I recived the Republican Census form today for for my District (13). I gave them an earfull on the form. We lost our Conservitive seat here last year to a moderate democrat (Mike McMahon) when Vito Fosella decided to do his "Lost Weekend" impression. Aside from that incident and his carousing, he was a good Conservative Represantative despite the hypocritcal appearance. The RNC is doing nothing in this district to put up a challanger to McMaohn for next year's mid-term. It's a travesty. It's like their gonna concede the seat. It was the only friggin conservative district in NYC that had any Republican representation in congress.

And now we are going to mess up NY-23 by putting Schivatz (Italian word for crap) out there to represent us. This seat has been held in this district by Republicans for like 100 years from what I have read..... and now were gonna mess this up.

If cooler heads would prevail to some extent as I belive Dan is suggesting, then we would rally around the party faithful and put a hurt on the Democrats in 2010 with an eye towards strong positioning for the 2012 presidential race. That makes sense and is the more pragmatic approach, but people like myself are really pissed off at the party right now. The RNC/NCRR is part of the problem... not the solution. I'm not giving them one dime. I'll donate to candidates I choose directly. My money already went to get Lindsey and Olympia re-elected... what a waste.

We are bogged down talking about Romney, Thompson, Hucklebee.... it's insane. It may just be that we have to continue to shoot ourselves in the foot until the pain becomes so unbearable that there is real meaningfull backlash and support of a true conservative party representation.

We really need a Regan redux, and that's the challange for us right now. He was one of a kind. I nominate Bob Grant..... Mr. Gigante along with Condi.

[Jim from Cleveland]

The GOP doesn't have a candidate who can win in 2012.

Every two weeks, I get a solicitation for money from the GOP. I enclose this note in the prepaid envelope:

To the clueless party: I was a Reagan Republican. I am now an ex-Republican. You can keep your compassionate dopes and straight-talkin' Johnnies and all the other RINOs. And you can take me off your mailing list.

The GOP in its current state will be out of power for the forseeable future.