Should Deval Patrick Change The Rules?

Pretend for a moment that corrupt liberal Democrats actually give a flip about what the people think. Can you blame them? There are rarely any consequences given a dishonest media unwilling to report their corruption. Imagine if Bill Richardson were a Republican and walked, as he just did, under Bush. We'd be reading about that one for a month.

In any event, pretend they actually do care for a moment. Should Patrick change the rules with the passing of an old Senate drunk? He will, no matter what, but I think it's at least worth some discussion.

As has been noted elsewhere, this is disgusting on a number of levels. First, Kennedy was the driving force behind the current law, which was enacted for the sole reason of denying Mitt Romney the opportunity to select a replacement for Senator Kerry, should he have been elected President in 2004. Second, we are only in this current “crisis” of not having two D-MA senators during the health care fight because Kennedy decided to stay in the senate until, literally, his dying day. Third, there’s a sickening sense of entitlement among the political class here that they have to get this seat filled now; when it comes to inter-democratic politics in Massachusetts, we citizens are just along for the ride.

Comments

[Bob]

Mark, don't you have ANYTHING to do but sit around and ruminate on Obama's imminent demise? I'd say that poll results can be interesting, but this is a complicated and volatile political environment we're in right now. I'd also say that Rasmussen is getting a bad rep for being GOP shills and I wouldn't necessarily take them as the final word about what the public wants.

Here's just one example, from today's ABC News/Washington Post poll. The lead paragraph of their story reads:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/08/27/AR2009082703823.html?sub=AR

On Energy, Obama Finds Broad Support
Poll Shows Backing for Reform Efforts, But Cap-and-Trade Bill Is Harder Sell

"Most Americans approve of the way President Obama is handling energy issues and support efforts by him and Democrats in Congress to overhaul energy policy -- including the controversial cap-and-trade approach to limiting greenhouse gas emissions, according to a Washington Post-ABC News poll."

I'd also note that in their previous poll on Aug 17, a majority of 52% to 46% approved of Obama's handling of the economy. That same poll showed Obama's ratings for his handling of energy policy to be 55% to 30%.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/polls/postpoll_081909.html

I've recently read some of the questions behind Rasmussen's polls, and the bias in the questions is impossible to miss. I wouldn't want to spoil your excitement over bad poll results for Obama, but you seem to be presenting a grossly exaggerated picture, based no doubt on your own wishful thinking.

[Fishner]

Bob, your first comment on this thread is:
"Pull yourself together, you traitorous whiner. Real Americans don't talk like that."

So, you really come across as a clueless buffoon when you make your later accusation of:
"You listen to some people around here and you'd think that a person was committing a harmful act by dropping in and expressing a contrary opinion."

We get it. You and the rest of the Democrats like to dishonestly paint anyone who doesn't full-throatedly support Democrat scheming as traitorous, UnAmerican, racist Nazis.

Fortunately after only a few short months of total Democrat control of the government the majority of the country has caught on to all the lies and scheming, so shrieking about how unfair and unpatriotic it is to shine a little sunlight on what you guys are trying to pull just doesn't scare anyone off anymore.

[joyMc]

Hey Bob, just for the sake of argument, what if universal health care coverage via one payer system (gov) gets passed and it turns out to really suck in general? I mean those Canadians and Brits do complain so. Half a day just to see the doc. Many Canadians without primary MDs sitting in ERs for every minor thing. And there is that nasty business of those women being forced to give birth in hospital restrooms and taxis and such. And all those stories about how British teeth are rotting out of British heads for lack of dentists. And people resorting to home dentistry via vice grip. Then those nasty statastics about heart patients expiring while in line for surgical procedures that never come. And those bothersome stats about cancer death rates being far higher in the UK and Canada. What if that all happens here? We would not be able to just drop it all and go back to what we were doing. Once one payer is in, the private insurance companies whither and die quickly. We would be stuck in hell with higher taxes. Not to mention, this country is damn near bankrupt right now. Death panels or no death panels dude, we don't need another entitlement program the size of Jupiter right now. Just sayin.

[PA]

"you can't constitutionally change the rules of the game after the game is started."

If you have a democrat majority you simply do as you please, law be damned. Its been like that at least since the days of FDR.

[Bob]

"We get it. You and the rest of the Democrats like to dishonestly paint anyone who doesn't full-throatedly support Democrat scheming as traitorous, UnAmerican, racist Nazis."

No, Fisher, just the ones who openly make threats about political violence and overthrowing the government. You know, the ones who pray for Obama's death. I would never begrudge anyone having their own honest political opinions, although I think it's fair to challenge people to defend those opinions. But your side can't have its way all the time. You have to share this democracy with people who you disagree with. I'm fine as long as the disagreements are civil, but when people start making threats then it's gone too far, and yes, it does get to the point where it's traitorous.

[Bob]

"Hey Bob, just for the sake of argument, what if universal health care coverage via one payer system (gov) gets passed and it turns out to really suck in general?"

Well, Joy, it's a fact that patients with government-run healthcare like Medicare and the Veterans' Administration have much higher satisfaction rates with their medical care than people with private insurance (I'll give you a link if you want to check it out for yourself). I think the biggest danger to a universal healthcare system is to try to water it down to please the medical industry lobby and their wingnut shills. We've ALREADY proven through Medicare and the VA that government-run healthcare not only works, but it's better.

The medical-insurance industry has lots of money to scare people with, and lots of Republican politicians who don't care about healthcare but want to use it as an opportunity to hurt their political enemies. That kind of political-economic power can move mountains, and the jillions of scared hysterical wingnuts are proof of its success. We can't even have an honest and rational debate now because people actually believe B.S. like "death panels." What a shame.

[Fishner]

Bob, the comment you explicitly responded to with the accusation of treason was "At some point, reasonable people are going to conclude that secession is the only way to save ourselves. What leftist's don't get is that we would rather be dead than be like them."

No one here made threats about political violence and overthrowing the government. No one here prayed for Obama's death.

You are disseminating fishy disinformation. Are you getting paid for your efforts?

[Bob]

Fishner, the post the quote came from says this:

"You know, if this kind of thing is allowed to fester, it's gonna be real hard to try to get folks to respect the government and not break out in open rebellion. Sounds crazy, doesn't it? However, the last straw is coming, but we won't know which is it until the poor beast founders. At some point, reasonable people are going to conclude that secession is the only way to save ourselves. What leftist's don't get is that we would rather be dead than be like them. So if they push us too far, then we really don't have anything left to say. This is how civil wars get started, and I honestly don't see any way to avoid it."

So you've got threats of "open rebellion" and "civil wars" in the same post as well as secession. Now of course I realize that this is being mentioned in a rhetorical sense and I'm not saying that the poster has literally committed treason. It's just free speech. But the spirit behind it is traitorous. It's actively considering actions that, if carried through with, would constitute treason.

It goes along with statements made by other right wingers on this site, the general tone of which is along these lines:

http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2009/07/suddenly-the-left-fears-protests.html?cid=6a00d83451c1db69e201157215f7de970b#comment-6a00d83451c1db69e201157215f7de970b

"We outgun you, you know, we outgun you, and the thought that we might soon decide we've had enough of you makes you crap your Underoos in abject terror."

Again, I'm not saying that I take it literally. It's only an empty threat. But it is unmistakably a threat of violence. It's what you might call eliminationist rhetoric.

So you tell me, Fishner: do you think it's appropriate to be talking about secession and making veiled (or not-so-veiled) threats of violence against fellow Americans just because the Republicans lost a few elections? Isn't this supposed to be a democracy, where one side can't reasonably expect to be in total control permanently? What if Democrats started making threats of violence and trying to delegitimize any Republican politician who won an election?

To me it's ridiculous that Americans would seriously be talking like this just because they can't have it their way all the time. It's childish and stupid, and if all sides in our country carried on like this maybe it WOULD lead to civil war.

[Fishner]

Bob, again, no one here made threats about political violence and overthrowing the government.

No one here prayed for Obama's death.

You are disseminating fishy disinformation.

Are you getting paid for your efforts?

[North Dallas Thirty]

"What if Democrats started making threats of violence and trying to delegitimize any Republican politician who won an election?"

Like they did for the past eight years with George Bush?

And as for violence, remember we're talking about Barack Obama, who thinks violence and murder in the name of "revolution" is perfectly all right.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weather_Underground_Organization#Activities_and_Suspected_Activities

[Bob]

"Bob, again, no one here made threats about political violence and overthrowing the government."

I guess there's something about this blog that only attracts congenitally dishonest wing nuts. I provided you with some examples, but if you want to pretend you didn't see it, then why the f*#k should I care.

[Rich K]

Leoperds and spots. 'I guess there's something about this blog that only attracts congenitally dishonest wing nuts.'
Pretty much tells the tale of your sincerity here bob.
Oh, and as to you thinking I actually pay heed to anything I read at a lib site I thought I made it clear with the connection to the funny papers as to where I stand on that.
This is why I drink coffee and not kool aid.