Spending Us Into Third World Status

This is insane. The so-called stimulus package is now up near another trillion dollars. That after trillions have already been spent.

$335 million for STD prevention? What the hell does that have to do with helping the economy??

Michelle has a more comprehensive run down and the names and numbers for Congress. Our voices in opposition need to be heard. The private sector grows the economy, government only drains it. All the Democrats are trying to do is take advantage of a bad economy and Hopey McChange fever to do what they always do - spend money and grow government in ways many Americans do not want.

This is a shameful exploitation of bad economic times in large part brought about by government intrusion and mistakes by both sides of the aisle. It's time to tell Washington we've had enough and they've already spent enough of our and our Grandchildren's money for all of our lifetimes. And if they go through with this the time in office for any of them supporting this madness won't be very long.

Kill the bill and melt the phones! ... before these corrupt idiots kill the American dream for generations to come. We have to work our way out of these hard times. Government has no effective solution. They will only make things worse.

Comments

[Lala]

There's been a breakout of STDs at "The Villages" in Florida. It seems that the retirement community has been getting frisky.

[Fred Beloit]

Quick, Lala, what the office phone number there?

[Lala]

Some friends of mine just moved there, now I know why.

http://patdollard.com/2009/01/senior-citizen-orgies-at-the-villages/

[jharp]

"$335 million for STD prevention? What the hell does that have to do with helping the economy?"

You really can't see how preventing STD's helps the economy? Seriously?

Good grief.

[Jake]

Anyone who contracts an STD should pay all medical expenses and be fined five-hundred dollars. That will take care of it.

[Fred Beloit]

If STDs strike The Villages, they strike us all.

By the way, Lala, Obama has succeeded in pleasing the Taliban some, but he still has more work to do.
http://www.weeklystandard.com/weblogs/TWSFP/2009/01/taliban_applauds_obamas_decisi.asp

[Buck Masters]

"You really can't see how preventing STD's helps the economy? Seriously?"

What? Like if your balls get so swollen you can't make it in to work? Good grief.

[Anon]

The American people have been told that the economic stimulus plan is about creating jobs and infrastructure that will enhance long term ecnomic growth.

By use of tenuous connections virtually anything can be claimed to have some kind of economic benefit.

This package is alleged to be about DIRECT job creation and DIRECT economic benefits, not third or fourth generation benefits in terms of oh if we prevent STD's it will help productivity type of reasoning.

I suspect history is going to show that the real change agent, if there was one, in terms of getting Washington pork under control was the old white guy. The fact that Obama has said NOTHING about all of these non stimulus, non job related funds being added to the bill shows exactly the kind of 'change' he supports: which is funding the pet projects of Democrats instead of Republicans. All that talk about government efficiency, getting rid of programs that don't work, just talk.

[Lala]

Here are some political cartoons from Australia (non STD, however)

http://usa-wethepeople.com/australian-cartoonsnever-seen-in-america/

[Dan]

"You really can't see how preventing STD's helps the economy?"

Okay, maybe it is good for your male prostition business. But I wasn't thinking in terms of the underground economy, j.

[kat]

Every time I read a comment from jharp, I feel like eye jist got mor stewpid.
"Good grief". Indeed.

[SacTownMan]

Hey who invited Charlie Brown to post?

So the same asshats like Dodd, Frank, Pelosi and Reed that helped cause the economic chaos now use the oppourtunity to lead this country to ruin and socialism.

Once they're done with implementing their socialist "hopey" agenda all we'll be left with is some pocket "change"!

[mark l.]

"You really can't see how preventing STD's helps the economy? Seriously?"

in some small way, it will help the economy, in some far distant future. The problem is that Obama has emphasized saving jobs and yet I'm watching states prepare to lay off hundreds of thousands workers.

Would 335 million be useful to a state seeking to save their budget via firing people?

"Executive Summary - Arnold Schwarzenegger, the Governor of California ordered a hiring freeze and a 10% layoff of all state employees to ease the budget crisis. He also ordered the states 235,000 employees to take two days a month off from work without receiving any compensation for these days taken off."

23.5 k in California.

Do you think that the 23.5k state workers would agree with spending 335 million on STD prevention?

The inherent problem with the Obama plan is that it is filled with increases in the size of federal govt, but the federal govt is the one entity that will not be laying anyone off. Iy does absolutely nothing to address a very immediate problem.

The gop should tally up the state budget shortfalls that will lead to an increase in unemployment and present the cost of providing a short term stimulus to state govts.

How do you bailout banks and auto companies, without even considerng bailing out the States?
obama wants the states to fail, so that he can scoop up the unemployed an put them in federal jobs. He has clearly made a choice between federal govt and state govt, and he is basically telling the states, 'screw you, you don't matter.'

[Anon]

I see your point, but I am actually very happy to see state's having to make some choices on their own bloated budgets and worthless programs that do nothing but provide fodder for speeches and jobs for hacks. Almost every state has a balanced budget amendment to the state constitution so I can't really feel sorry for all of these states--mostly blue--that relied on deferred spending and other gimmicks to keep spending and acruing new debt.

If major companies throughout the country are laying off people, wouldn't it follow logically that state and federal employees would also be facing layoffs? Good point about no federal employees even in danger of losing their jobs..guess Obama isn't ready with that program by program evaluation.

I'm sure that Obama and his team REALLY believe that this dumb stimulus is going to provide long term economic benefits and help the economy...the same way that the Bush administration REALLY believed all the dumb policies they implemented. When it fails, it will be because it wasn't big enough, LOL, or because of GOP sabatage...there is always, always an excuse for failure when it comes to government spending.

[Jake]

"He has clearly made a choice between federal govt and state govt, and he is basically telling the states, 'screw you, you don't matter."

It doesn't get much better than this to turn some heads around. Obama, Pearl Harbor Redux.

[mark l.]

"I see your point, but I am actually very happy to see state's having to make some choices on their own bloated budgets and worthless programs that do nothing but provide fodder for speeches and jobs for hacks."

The current situation presents a need for keeping employees under a state system that does have budgetary constraints, versus increasing the federal govt which functions without similar restraint.

Should the govt fund all the state's new expenditures? no. just enough to make up the 'revenue shortfall' between 07 and 08. If the state were in the position of believing that all future shortfalls would result in a bailout, it would lead to disaster.

a very rough guess on the shortfall, specific to revenue, of the state govts is going to be less than 300 billion. Considering we are willing to drop the first installemt to the autoworkers for 25 billion, the refusal of obama to address state budget shortfalls is disgusting.

[jharp]

Hey, you're panic over 335 million to keep people healthy. And to keep people from spreading their diseases to others.

Is 10 days in Iraq. To me, the health of our communities is far more important. And since my guy won, tough shit.

[mark l.]

It is rather shocking that the state governors have been silent on the matter.

Even though there are a majority of dems in the executive seats for the states, surely they can specifically address and target the spending in a far more efficent manner, with the primary purpose of reducing pending unemployment.

Should a single bill be put forth, promoting the idea that the States would oversee this stimulus, it would pass with 90% approval. What state senator or rep is going to say that Washington can spend money more wisely than their home state?

[Anon]

I don't know really if theoretical state budget restraints that aren't abided by is, in reality, any different from the non existant budget restraints for the federal government.

I would like to see all federal programs except national park service and DOD reduced by 10% across the board. They can manage it however they see fit, cut jobs, cut programs, close buildings, reduce hours. At a later time I would like to see DOD's budget if not cut, at least looked at with a critical eye to weed out billion dollar redundancies.

To me, the feds bailing out the states is just as bad as bailing out the auto industry or Kaybee Toys or any other venture that was poorly managed. Unfortunately, due to the systemic and massive mismanagement of the banking industry, something had to be done to prevent total collapse..but, what we have done isn't working, so it will be up to historians to determine if letting them fail would have been worse, better or the same.

[mark l.]

"You really can't see how preventing STD's helps the economy?"

anytime you want to explain how it will address our economic crisis over the following year, I'll listen.

[jharp]

anytime you want to explain how it will address our economic crisis over the following year, I'll listen.

Posted by: mark l. | Wednesday, January 28, 2009 at 02:11 PM

Healthy people are able to work. Unhealthy people suck the government teat.

Is that good enough for you?

[mark l.]

"I don't know really if theoretical state budget restraints that aren't abided by is, in reality, any different from the non existant budget restraints for the federal government."

i'm with you on the use of "theoretical", but I've been looking from State to State. Best case scenario is they have hiring freezes and are paying people to take early retirement(good luck with their 401k's being down 30-50%).

Most cases the layoffs are evident.

One of the hardest hit areas will be in jobs that no one cares about. ex. Prison guards? The state can avoid laying them off or producing a budget reduction, considering the high turnover rate, with just a hiring freeze. A prison that employs 200 can drop 20% easy of its workforce, with ease, in less than a year. Ditto Probation/Parole.

[mark l.]

"Healthy people are able to work."

so are people who have STDs. Did you think that you can draw unemployment on herpes?

Those who are 'sick' will not be affected by a prevention program. I am unaware of any STD, including AIDs, that renders its host unable to work within a years time.

any experiences from your personal history with STDs you care to 'share'?

[mark l.]

"Is that good enough for you?"

be careful what you wish for jharp.

335 million is meaningless, compared to the size of the bill. Your problem will arise when unemployment does increase, and individuals who are out of work realize that a stimulus that was supposed to keep them employed failed, at least in their minds.

To them 335 million is important. Considering they will look at how much they actually need to get by, relative to the 335 million, and suddenly, a tiny amount, means everything.

The unemployed will have plenty of time to grab a hold of a radio and listen to Rush or Hannity, mostly out of boredom. These people will constantly be reminded of how govt money is being wasted, while they have no job.

335 million? means nothing to me. leave it in...it will be the metaphorical 'dirt' used to bury the dems.

[jharp]

mark l,

As usual you don't know your ass from first base.

You do not need to have full blown AIDS to be a costly burden. HIV positive people can incur many costly treatments.

You are a dumbass.

"any experiences from your personal history with STDs you care to 'share'?"

Yeah, I had the scabies when I was in college. And believe me you wouldn't have wanted to work beside me then.

What is it about you right wingers that you can't see the benefits of a healthy America?

[Anon]

I thought it had been informally agreed upon that our mentally challenged friend was going to be ignored in hopes that he take his canned, nonsensical talking points elsewhere.

Again, it doesn't take a nobel prize winning economist to understand that $300 million to combat STDs...all STDs, not just AIDS, is not going to have any kind of economic benefit other than the kind favored by liberals: wholly theoretically and unmeasurable, and that whatever the merits of fighting STDs with government money, this type of item does NOT belong in a bill that has been allegedly designed to provide immediate, measurable and direct job and economic benefits. It is a no brainer....I doubt there is a single government program that cannot be theoretically tied to some type of economic benefit...but theoretical, third hand, fourth hand, future benefits that cannot be quantified are for other bills.

[Lala]

Where's Fred, is he at the Villages real estate office?

[jharp]

"that $300 million to combat STDs...all STDs, not just AIDS, is not going to have any kind of economic benefit other than the kind favored by liberals"

And I see you haven't become any smarter, Anon.

Nah, your right. The spread of AIDS and other STD's has no effect on our economy. Are you really that friggin dense?

[Anon]

See what I mean, guys?

[Karen]

All this bill proves to me is that Obama is a LIAR. He said NO PORK and that bill is FILLED WITH PORK. He doesn't keep his word. LIAR.

Then I'm driving around listening to the radio today and some dumbass reporter was on the air suggesting that this bill was "so wonderful" and "so needed" because it would put the money where it's needed....FOR FOOD STAMPS AND FOR EXTENDED UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS!

This is the new reality where being unemployed and on food stamps is the goal of the day!

[jharp]

To them 335 million is important. Considering they will look at how much they actually need to get by, relative to the 335 million, and suddenly, a tiny amount, means everything.

The unemployed will have plenty of time to grab a hold of a radio and listen to Rush or Hannity, mostly out of boredom. These people will constantly be reminded of how govt money is being wasted, while they have no job.

335 million? means nothing to me. leave it in...it will be the metaphorical 'dirt' used to bury the dems.

Posted by: mark l. | Wednesday, January 28, 2009 at 02:56 PM

You are a tried and true wingnut. What's best for our country be damned.

Just let Hannity and Limbaugh preach to the troglodytes that the reason you don't have a job is because the federal government spent money to keep us healthy.

Sadly you do have a point. The Republican base will buy it. Or at least what is left of the Republican base. And you wonder why folks have left the GOP in droves.

[Lala]

The Wall St. Journal calls it the 40 year wish list - read it and weep

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123310466514522309.html

[jharp]

"As for that $335 million for STD prevention, that number sort of pales when you consider the direct medical cost of STDs every year, which one 2000 study found was $6.5 billion. That same study notes that, for HIV patients at least, the government already assumes a large share of the burden; one group of researchers found that 47 percent of people receiving treatment for HIV were covered by Medicare, and 20 percent were uninsured."

http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/2009/01/28/health_stimulus/index.html

[Anon]

Yeah, I was a bit confused as to how billions for more food stamps and unemployment benefits was going to stimulate the economy:)

MY advice to any Republican members of Congress is not to vote for the stimulas plan and to put forth their own version.

I don't tend to like Rush, but he's right, if the stimulus plan is all it is cracked up to be and is going to save/fix the economy, and everyone knows Obama already has the votes to pass it with just Dems...then if he is RIGHT and the GOP is WRONG it will destroy the GOP for the next generation.

If the GOP supports it, and it has bi partisan cover then he will take all the credit anyway and if it fails he will point to the GOP supporting and say...just like Bush did about WMD...that "everyone" agreed with him....

This is a trap for Republicans, if they can't see it then they do deserve to die as a party.

[jharp]

"another part of the legislation that provides for healthcare funding, specifically $335 million for STD education and prevention programs."

"First of all, the money that goes to these programs will mean new jobs. There are the additional people who'll be needed for administration, of course, as well as additional doctors and researchers. There will also be, to borrow a phrase, a trickle-down effect: Money for vaccinating uninsured children, for instance, means more vaccinations will be produced, which means there'll be more jobs producing and distributing the vaccines."

http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/2009/01/28/health_stimulus/index.html

Why do you hate having healthy children even when it creates jobs?

[Anon]

LALA,

Wow is all I can say, it is much, much worse than I could have ever imagined. $80 billion in earned income credits to people who don't pay taxes???????? $262 billion in wealth transfer for people already on the dole?????

This will literally destroy the private sector and the U.S. economy in no uncertain terms, within our lifetimes.

[jharp]

"This is a trap for Republicans"

Nonsense. It's what most economists recommend to keep us from a depression.

Nobel Prize winning economist Paul Krugman is one.

Did you ever think Obama might just want to do what is best for the country. I know it's hard with Hannity, Limbaugh, Savage, O'Reilly, Beck, Fox News, and the like denigrating him all the way.

Seriously, turn that garbage off and read. We'll all be better off.

[Lala]

Anon,

What the heck do you think this is?

$2.4 billion for carbon-capture demonstration projects.

[Anon]

I'm actually okay with spending a few billion to see if carbon trading will work, I'm okay w/more global warming researching.

But, a QUARTER of the economic stimulus package basically going to people who are already living off the government? You have got to be kidding me.

Not even a hundred billion going to the highly touted infrastructure projects?

Nothing for high speed rail, arguably the only infrastructure investment that will really translate into long term and permanent economic benefits?

You know, the Bush years convinced me that the country had become too stupid to really govern itself via a democracy, so, while it pains me to see the decline in the U.S. come at such a rapid pace, it doesn't much surprise me. But, this is like a knife in the heart of American capitalism...I don't know how the private sector can ever recover..not that it isn't largely the fault of the private sector to begin with..it wasn't the Democrats that invented securitized mortgages or credit default swaps or other derivatives...it was the capitalists themselves.

So, maybe we deserve this, nanny state writ large, a top down government controlled economy.

I really don't even care anymore, if this stimulus bill gets passed after all of Obama's promises about ending pork and earmarks, then we deserve it.

I all can be concerned with at this point is how to protect myself economically and try and prevent the government from taxing me to death and how I, too, can get on the government gravy train.

[templar knight]

"$80 billion in earned income credits to people who don't pay taxes??????? $262 billion in wealth transfer for people already on the dole????"

Anon, you finally got to the meat and bones of this whole exercise in Democratic thuggery. It's the mob in Rome. The Democratics intend to destroy the United States as we know it, and turn it into their vision of a socialist/communist/fascist utopia. It's sickening.

[Anon]

I'm always shocked at brazen lying, no matter who does it, I was shocked at the brazen lying from the Bush Administration and I am shocked at the brazen lying that has already come from the Obama Administration.

This stimulus plan is a joke.

It is nothing but a wish list of funding for every liberal program under the sun, it has very little to do with the economy or creating jobs in the private sector. Even the few actual jobs it might create aren't going to happen in the next year, it is impossible unless they just start hiring people for programs and jobs that have no descriptions or plans attached to them.

But, it looks like Obama is going to nationalize the banking sector, so it might be a moot point. It will be command and control all the way.

[SacTownMan]

I hate to say I told you so but... I told you so!!!

The sheep in this country have allowed a group with extremist views to gain control of the House and Senate and now the free wheeling "let er rip" spending that was discussed here by so many is now becoming a reality.

Republican's need to vote against this pork spending and get back to the fundimentals of less govt. and free markets.

In two years there will be such a backlash against the leftist's that Palin will march right in.

Everyone will remember Barry just like Jimmy, a one term and out failure with the moonbats jumping out of Starbucks windows across the country!

[Anon]

Sarah Palin is never going to be president, she is too divisive and her reputation has already been shredded by the media and it is clear they will continue the personal attacks and smear articles for as along as she is on the national stage. A good portion of the population has now been brainswashed that she is stupid & racist. A truly brilliant book or a serious grassroots organization might turn the tide, but I don't think she's capable of either.

I don't think you really understand how far the American people have fallen...the "public" responds to three things: fear, scandal and greed. That's it.

Obama has learned the lessons of the Bush Administration well, he's using fear against the Republicans, but this fear is much closer to home than 'terrorists' it is fear of losing everything you've worked your entire life for coupled with greed, that you too, can benefit from his policies. Don't be too sure that this won't get him re elected, especially with a media that is in full hero worship mode.

1

[templar knight]

Maybe, STM, but bear in mind that the $4.4 billion going to Leftist groups like ACORN is to buy and reward thugs. And the Democrats are hiring these thugs for a reason, and that reason has to do with remaining in power. At this juncture there is literally no telling what these people will resort to. Arm yourselves now. Buy ammo now. Do not wait any longer. Your very life, and the life of the Republic will depend on it. Mark my words.

[Anon]

Hmm, that my be a little reactionary, Templar. Obama wants to go down as a great president, he already thinks he's as good as Lincoln, JFK and FDR, he is already modeling himself after these guys....so, I'm not sure a naked power grab that would include taking people's guns away and having an army of 'neighborhood organizers' aka thugs take over is something he would do.

But, it is hard to say, he is so arrogant that he might nationalize anything and everything in the deluded belief that he can "fix it"...I had him pegged as a one termer/Jimmy Carter type in the beginning, but that was before the economic collapse gave him all this leverage.

But, what do I know, I had John McCain pegged as a good campaigner and campaign strategist...so you see how that turned out:)

[jharp]

George Bush kinda left you guys in a tough spot. Do you ever wonder if the wingnuts would stood up against his horrid policies that maybe you wouldn't find yourselves so powerless now?

I, for one, will openly oppose any Obama policies I disagree with.

It's just this ain't one of them.

And Palin becoming President? Unbelievable to me that anyone with a higher than sixth grade education could fathom such an event.

[Andrew_M_Garland]

http://easyopinions.blogspot.com/2008/08/econ-201-myth-of-economic-multiplier.html
The Myth of the Economic Multiplier

Most government plans are explained as producing 3-4 times more benefit than what is spent. Obama's team is using a conservative 1.5 for the extra effects of the $850 billion stimulus plan. This is the "multiplier" effect of that money moving around doing so much good.

Unfortunately, it is a convenient myth. Government money moves wealth from everyone else to the people who received the money, just once. The multiplier is 1, and the effect is what it has always been. It is good to get government money, and not so good to be a worker or taxpayer who isn't politically connected.

[Lala]

We're on the road to ruin -

"PRESIDENT HUSSEIN'S BILLIONS FOR PORK, WILL SLASH DEFENSE

12,656* Islamic attacks across the world since 911 and the plant is going to slash defense? The only reason we could suffer reactionary tactics of leftards and Islamic apologists was because of our superior firepower and war posture.

These actions wil not happen in a vacuum. There will be repecussions from President Hussein's seditious acts.

As we speak, the $825 billion socialist "stimulus" package is being considered by the House. 32 new government programs. Obama's payback to his thugs and gangstas and the fixers he owes. Free markets correct themselves, the government only makes things worse. Government is the problem. DOING NOTHING IS THE BEST PLAN - the invisible hand of the economy. "

http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2009/01/president-husseins-billions-for-pork-cuts-for-defense.html

[templar knight]

"..that may be a little reactionary.."

Is your money earning anything now? Buying high-quality firearms has proven to be a very good investment over the years. And I can tell you from personal experience that I have firearms used in WWII(2 M-1 Carbines) that are in very good condition. I bought both of them several years ago for less than a hundred dollars each. They are worth at least 10 times that now, perhaps more. I'm not suggesting you buy tens of thousands of dollars in firearms, but that you buy a minimum of what you might need to defend yourself and your family.

That would be a minimum of a 12 gauge shotgun with a short barrel, an AK style rifle, and a handgun, perhaps a .357 mag. or .38 special. You could take $2500 and get what you need.

[templar knight]

Back to the topic at hand, not one single Republican voted for the stimulus bill that passed the House this evening. We may have an opposition party after all. Hooray! It's about time the Republicans showed a little backbone. The thugs and crooks who benefit from this bill will be identified as what they are, without any cover given for them by Republicans.