What Costs $4 Billion Dollars And Leaks?

What, besides the CIA, costs over $4 Billion and leaks? The re-built levees around New Orleans. The leaks present the possibility that they will fail in a storm. And now billions more will likely be required and some work may need to be redone.

I wish I could get a do-over on my taxes every year.

How much would you like to bet the same will be true after that money is spent wasted, too?

Oh, and just to get in sync with the coming conventional wisdom, I blame George Bush. Obviously, he really just doesn't like black people.

Outside engineering experts who have studied the project told The Associated Press that the type of seepage spotted at the 17th Street Canal in the Lakeview neighborhood afflicts other New Orleans levees, too, and could cause some of them to collapse during a storm.

The Army Corps of Engineers has spent about $4 billion so far of the $14 billion set aside by Congress to repair and upgrade the metropolitan area's hundreds of miles of levees by 2011. Some outside experts said the leak could mean that billions more will be needed and that some of the work already completed may need to be redone.

Comments

[Fred Beloit]

Great line. Wish I had thought of it: "What, besides the CIA, costs over $4 Billion and leaks?"

[Lala]

I think the Army Corps of Engineers are made up of a bunch of losers and should be disbanded.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9900E0DC163AF930A25751C0A9639C8B63

Re ''Warnings of a Hamptons Beach Breach'' (Feb. 6):

The plethora of groins and jetties built on barrier islands by the Corps of Engineers to ''protect'' beaches, dunes and homes from storm-wave and shore-current erosion are not only ineffective -- they also actually cause more overall erosion than occurs naturally. Each groin jutting out into the west-moving shore current forces it to drop sand on the obstruction's upcurrent east side before continuing around the groin, where it erodes sand on the obstruction's downcurrent west side. This pattern continues all the way from Montauk to Coney Island.

The corps had constructed 15 groins on Westhampton Beach to offset downcurrent erosion caused by two large Shinnecock jetties farther east. With extensive sand replenishment, the groins gave some protection to houses built between them. But the current's enhanced erosion effect, after passing 15 groins without picking up sand, enabled it to erode huge amounts of beach and dune sand beyond the last groin. Storm waves were then able to destroy houses and cut breaches through Westhampton Island that had to be quickly filled. This scenario occurred many times over the years."

[Lala]

This is very telling - the ACE used land-height measurements in 1965 that were from 1929 even though they knew New Orleans was sinking.

http://skywatch-media.com/2007/03/army-corps-of-engineers-blamed-for.html

[Lala]

This is very telling - the ACE used land-height measurements in 1965 that were from 1929 even though they knew New Orleans was sinking.

http://skywatch-media.com/2007/03/army-corps-of-engineers-blamed-for.html

[IslamoLlama]

"-- Oh, and just to get in sync with the coming conventional wisdom, I blame George Bush. --"

Yikes, wouldn't it be just horrible if someone were to hold administrative officials accountable for administration. The Dem solution to the NO debacle is to elect competent bureaucrats to fill the roll of cronies and political stoogies. Toss out the Michael Browns and replace them with Red Cross administrators, ranking members of the Peace Corps... you know, people experienced in disaster recovery.

The GOP solution is to "stay the course" and ignore the rising problems or outsource services to even more expensive, even less competent cronies and political stoogies.

Why would anyone vote for a Republican if these are the two ideological options? You're not even getting the satisfaction of small government libertarianism with the GOP anymore. They're more than happy to piss away billions in "relief", the money just goes primarily to GOP allies in the state.

Remind me again of all the scandals that took place after Hurricane Fran in '96 or Hurricane Gordon in '94. The difference between disaster recovery efforts is about as stark as it comes.

[SacTownMan]

While New Orleans continues to get the attention Sacramento has the highest flood potential of any major city in America.

http://www.safca.org/floodRisk/floodThreat.html

And no Lame-O you can't blame this one on Bush. The underlying problem here is many of the levees were built by early pioneers 150 years ago and were not constructed to todays standards. Over the years they were simply patched up and more dirt added to cover them but they still have underlying structural defects that mean more future floods. It can be as simple as a rodent burrowing into the levee and causing boils or bubbles that start to eat away at the foundation.

I have seen 3 major floods in our area 2 of which were levee breech caused. Still local governments allow for more and more housing to be built in the flood prone areas. The same areas that now have thousands of new homes I remember seeing under an inland sea as a kid. The responsibility is at the local and state levels just like New Orleans but everyone just sits on their butts and waits for the federal government to fix everything.

[Lala]

April 14, 2006
FEMA Rising
Natural Disasters
Hatched by Dafydd

The Inspector General of the Department of Homeland Security, Richard L. Skinner, has released a long-awaited report on the federal response to Hurricane Katrina; and while the report found a number of areas where FEMA needs improvement, it also completely undermines the major Democratic attacks against the Bush administration.

http://biglizards.net/blog/archives/2006/04/fema_rising.html

[IslamoLlama]

"-- And no Lame-O you can't blame this one on Bush. The underlying problem here is many of the levees were built by early pioneers 150 years ago and were not constructed to todays standards. Over the years they were simply patched up and more dirt added to cover them but they still have underlying structural defects that mean more future floods. It can be as simple as a rodent burrowing into the levee and causing boils or bubbles that start to eat away at the foundation.

I have seen 3 major floods in our area 2 of which were levee breech caused. Still local governments allow for more and more housing to be built in the flood prone areas. The same areas that now have thousands of new homes I remember seeing under an inland sea as a kid. The responsibility is at the local and state levels just like New Orleans but everyone just sits on their butts and waits for the federal government to fix everything. --"

The Netherlands is one giant floodplain. Rather than telling everyone to move to France, the Dutch have developed a large, complex, advanced levee system to handle heavy rains and flooding.

New Orleans just happens to be one of the biggest port cities in the US. If you noticed oil prices go up right after Katrina, that was in part because oil tankers weren't able to dock and unload in one of the biggest port cities in the US. Telling everyone in NO to go live somewhere else would be like telling the entire population of Manhattan to move off their island.

Local and state administrators, particularly in cash poor low-tax Louisiana, don't have the money to upgrade the levees. If we wanted to preserve our oil traffic and maintain the labor workforce necessary to facilitate all forms of shipping and trading that move through one of the biggest port cities in the US, it might be in the federal government's interest to help fund the levee system. Or Louisiana could just start taxing the hell out of shipping traffic, driving up prices at the retail level. Either way, we're not going to just get rid of one of the biggest port cities in the US because it is flood prone. If we did, we'd have to get rid of Houston, the fourth largest city in the US.

The GOP solution - do nothing and let the impoverished citizenry figure out how to survive - is dumb. The city isn't going away just because it isn't geographically ideal.

[IslamoLlama]

"-- The Inspector General of the Department of Homeland Security, Richard L. Skinner, has released a long-awaited report --"

Gasp. The DHS releases a report claiming FEMA - a branch within its own service - wasn't a problem.

Who are you going to believe? An internal audit by a brand new branch of government staffed entirely with GOP cronies, or your lying eyes?

This is the same Richard Skinner, mind you, that wanted to allocate more DHS security money to Indiana than New York, because Indiana was more at risk of terror attacks.
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5552554

"-- Rep. Caroline Maloney is a Democrat from New York, a state that has been fighting recent cuts in federal Homeland Security funds. She notes that the database shows her state with only two percent of the nation's banking and financial assets, somewhere between North Dakota and Missouri.

"It also lists Washington state with nearly twice as many national monuments than the District of Columbia," Maloney said. "It appears not to have any standards or definitions of what should be on this list." --"

Yeah, I trust this Skinner guy. He seems sharp.

[Lala]

Does Carolyn Maloney have a home in the Hamptons? Which politician plays bingo in Kentucky?

n 2005, Kentucky won a $36,300 grant from the Department of Homeland Security to protect bingo halls from terrorist infiltration, and last year, the federal government granted $46,908 in homeland security funds to protect a limo and bus service that transports New Yorkers to the affluent Hamptons region in Long Island.

http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewPolitics.asp?Page=/Politics/archive/200702/POL20070223b.html

[Lala]

What do air-conditioned garbage trucks have to do with Homeland Security you ask?

http://www.nypost.com/news/regionalnews/... - Newark, NJ has used homeland security money to purchase 10 new air conditioned garbage trucks.

Newark used federal Department of Homeland Security funds to help pay for 10 top-of-the-line, air-conditioned garbage trucks — and a group of state lawmakers think that stinks.
Newark unveiled its new garbage trucks last month — and boasted that the financing had partly come from "Homeland Security grants."

Republican lawmakers yesterday blasted the city for "misuse" of federal money.

"It goes to the heart of credibility," said Assemblyman Joseph Pennacchio, who noted New Jersey officials have been lobbying for more anti-terror funds.

"You can't say we're buying garbage trucks on one hand and we're not getting enough Homeland Security money on the other."

Not to mention that it's illegal to buy garbage trucks with a Homeland Security grant, says the department.

"There's an approved list of equipment that can be bought with Homeland Security funding, and garbage trucks are not on that list," said the department's spokesman, Marc Short.

New Jersey has long complained about being shortchanged in homeland security funding, yet they found the time and effort to put in for purchasing 10 new garbage trucks.

[Scrapiron]

As long as there is a democrat in the FBI/CIA/NSA, and democrats in congress are allowed access to documents effecting the safety of the citizens of this country there will be massive leaks. The NYSlimes will spread them for the American Communist Party (aka Democrats)

As long as any union is involved with construction the bridges will fall and the dams/levees will leak, and democrat politicians will get richer from kickbacks.

That's just the way life is in the left lane.

[JP]

I spent 20 years in the N.O. metro. Worked at Louis Armstrong Airport(one of the good things they did was rename the place).
The 9th Ward residents sued for a new levee and were rebuked. The Rep for that area want new locks for the Barges that were no longer using the Industrial Canal, so damaged/aged levee or no, they gots them a nice new set of locks (look at arial photos of the 9th Ward breech and see them).
The 17th Street Canal was just finished when I escaped to Texas. Even as other portions were being built, locals were complaining about water seepage.
They were ignored. Katrina came.
Oops.
So they built new ones. . . peak Strom surge for Kat was 29 feet. The levees are. . . . 27'.
Math doesn't seem to be needed for a job at the Corp of Engineers (I know a few people who work there). The local Levee Board is notoriously corrupt(in a area noted for corrupt politicians, it stood out on several occasions). The locals keep electing the same batch of crooks (Nagin was a political outsider who got in by promising to ride that corruption into the ground...he is the best mayor N.O. has had in years and years. No. He isn't worth spit. The others were just that much worse).
Nothing about this surprises me.
Jindal needs to be cloned, and elected to Mayor of N.O, and Baton Rouge, Sheriff of Most of the Parishes, as well as Parish President of most as well, and all polling places need a big guy with a Clue by Four standing outside of it.

[Lala]

Rationality has had little to do with it so far. As "60 Minutes" reporter Steve Kroft found out, the nation's capital is just as lackadaisical with its homeland security funds as the Santa Clara, Calif., sheriff's department, which purchased four Segways to transport its bomb squad in the event of a terrorist attack on Silicon Valley. They won't get very far at 12.5 mph.

Similar outrages can be found closer to home. According to Citizens Against Government Waste, $208,100 in port security grants went to a private yacht company that operates luxury dinner cruises in Washington, Boston and Chicago. What are they protecting, the contents of the bar? Kroft also reported that some of D.C.'s homeland security money was spent on leather jackets, a computerized car towing service, developing a rap song on emergency preparedness and sending city sanitation workers to a Dale Carnegie class.

And all of this is just the way business is done in Congress. Rationality doesn't matter or count in how the money is split. Making sure that your home district gets a cut, no matter how relevant or necessary is, is the paramount issue.

Thus, money is spent on the items listed above. Meanwhile, locales that really need security bolstered have to fight for every last nickel.

-- posted by Lawhawk http://www.suite101.com/discussion.cfm/middle_east_politics/98453#message_14

[Worst President Ever]

Considering where New Orleans is, levees there are probably always going to leak to some degree. The question is whether or not they'll hold up to another Katrina.

By the way, Iraq cost around $12 billion last month. And next month. And next month...

[IslamoLlama]

"-- Jindal needs to be cloned, and elected to Mayor of N.O, and Baton Rouge, Sheriff of Most of the Parishes, as well as Parish President of most as well, and all polling places need a big guy with a Clue by Four standing outside of it. --"

Hey, if he can pull his weight, god bless him. After watching David Vitter's abortion-obsessed legislative record, I'm not overly raptured by Louisiana Republicans who harp on the issue.

The Louisiana political system really needs a good flushing out, like Chicago and New York get on a routine basis. It would be great if the US Justice Department was competent and truth worthy enough to conduct said investigations but...

Seriously, why isn't William Jefferson in jail for corruption? Why isn't David Vitter on trial for soliciting prostitution? What a fucking train wreck! It's times like this when you want to pull your hair out in frustration.

[IslamoLlama]

"-- And all of this is just the way business is done in Congress. Rationality doesn't matter or count in how the money is split. Making sure that your home district gets a cut, no matter how relevant or necessary is, is the paramount issue.

Thus, money is spent on the items listed above. Meanwhile, locales that really need security bolstered have to fight for every last nickel. --"

Abuh? Say what? Don't we have a Department of Homeland Security specifically to micromanage the funds and the resources? Where was this responsible politicking back in 2002 when the damn thing was formed? Republicans could have easily laid the groundwork for sane, safe, rational appropriations system for DHS. Instead it was the same "to the victor goes the spoils" bullshit as the years before.

Look, no one likes this massive waste, but I'm sick of hearing "Democrats did it too/worse!" as an excuse for John Boehner or Tom Coburn or Dick Cheney to indulge in the exact same bullshit. I've yet to support an incumbent at the federal level since 2000, precisely because of this waste. I've campaigned for Republicans in my area who support smart spending and whom I trust. But the GOP walked into power in 1994 on the promise of fixing bullshit like this and 14 years later - six spent with all three branches of government under GOP majorities - and nothing has changed. The DHS is Bush's baby. Built on his watch, by his Congressmen and bureaucrats, using his rules. Don't come back crying now because you don't like how the money is being spent. New Jersey and Washington aren't getting any pork that Illinois and Iowa aren't racking in too. If you think these DHS expenditures shouldn't be there, that's one thing. If you think these DHS expenditures justify wasteful spending in other swing states during election years, that's another.

[Lala]

Join Porkbusters - started by Glenn Reynolds and N.Z. Bear

http://technorati.com/tag/porkbusters

[Lala]

http://www.cagw.org/site/PageServer?pagename=reports_pigbook2008

citizens against government waste - Murtha leads the pack of porkers

[joeb]

Overheard at Jenna's wedding: "Daddy you've got to do something about global warming the ice sculpture is melting". Actually the Washington Post said that was a line from David Letterman.

[Michael Boelter]

For $4,000,000,000.00 you would think they could just haul in dirt and fill the damn city level to the plus 30 foot mark. You could even jack up the remaining houses to that level for that kind of money.

[seekeronos]

If there was any sanity and accountability with the government, the DHS and the FEMA among many other wasteful and unneeded departments and agencies would be disbanded.

[WAHOO WILLIE]

"DHS and the FEMA among many other wasteful and unneeded departments and agencies would be disbanded."

Y'all is so funny looking at how da guvmint works from the outside. DHS is/always was a joke because basically they are FEMA on crank. Now, FEMA has been around a whole bunch longer than GW and the evil Ninjas and is a worthwhile project. However when a prez appoints a horse farmer to lead it, it can't help but suck. I wont bother trying to educate people blinded by BDS to all that FEMA has done. I will say that current oversight of grant monies has been....lacking. One fire dept actually got a grant to buy a trailer to haul their lawn mower racing team from place to place. Honestly, rural areas should have been gfranted more funding to upgrade non-NFPA compliant equipment, instead of cities like NYC getting big chunks for crap they didn't need. Sorry porkbusters, but da congressmens dont drag FEMA money home....Da EM peeples line up to beg for it directly from Da FEMA. We need da FEMA because stuff happens all de time that local and state resources just cannot handle....period. They just need decent leadership, not lawyers and horse groomers. DHS should be a couple offices within FEMA.
Now USACE......Talk about wasting your money. You folks have NO idea! Back when, the DoD department I worked for built a fire station. You, me, Boob,Llama hell, even chrissy could have built the thing for 90-95 thousand. USACE started out with 50,000 charge to the ARMY for the plans. (It was off the shelf, they adjusted plans to hardent the building) On move in day the project was 350,000. That6's waste folks.

[Lala]

I'm up early and watching CNBC. They have David Walker on, former US Comptroller (I think). He says Medicare is underfunded by 34 trillion dollars. Very interesting guy but I have to go out, maybe they have a transcript.

[seekeronos]

I've always believed that accountability begins much closer to home.

Rather than have a superabundance of federal agencies and bureaus as has been our custom, I think that budget control should begin at a reasonable level.

To start with, disbanding DHS (the scary "Homeland Police Regime" which makes a smashingly great show of inconveniencing travelers and making sure you see all the pretty hardware they've bought, and the colour-coded "Safety Rainbow of Terror" would be a fine start.

FEMA: Reduce them to a funds distribution centre and a thinktank for managing emergencies. They get to do all sorts of actuarial studies and apportion their receipts under strict conditions back to the states, who implement the disaster plans (this is needed particularly in the Tornado Belt and Hurricane Belt where single storms tend to affect a region of states). FEMA's basic role would be to play "traffic cop" with the various state level emergency management agencies.

We could also drastically reduce the involvement and scope of the federal government in many other areas, and stick by the Constitution's distribution of enumerated powers to the Federal government, and non-enumerated powers residing with the many states.

Setting a maximum budget ceiling that lowers itself instead of raising itself (reducing it back to $1T USD would be a great start) and transitioning to real money based on metallic standards as opposed to a fiat currency determined by a private corporation (the Federal Reserve) to help reign in inflation and unnecessary and unconstitutional wars would go a long way to reducing governmental excess and increasing personal liberties and trust in our social contract with government.

[vanderleun]

Is it wrong to pray that the levees fail? Is it?