Obama Drama Update

Julian Sanchez of Reason sends this along - to a WC Payne in the 89th. pg 230

Comments

[Drew G]

Why is this site still pretending that this allegation hasn't been thoroughly refuted?
The site you emailed chose to post their response on their site.
Why have you not acknowledged their response?
Why are you still dishonoring this veteran's contribution?

From the site: http://www.89infdivww2.org/

Concerning the service of Mr. Charles Payne: C.T. Payne was a soldier in the 89th Infantry Division. He served in the 355th Infantry Regiment, Company K. The 355th Infantry Regiment was the unit to liberate Ohrdruf. Mr. Payne was there.

For those who seek to minimize the horrors of Ohrdruf since it was a 'work' camp and not a 'death' camp, we have but one word: shame. Ironically, this argument has been made to us time and time again by various Holocaust-deniers and other pro-Nazi groups. We will let the testimony of survivors and veterans speak for themselves.

[chris]

Can we question you backwardass 28%ers patriotism yet??

[WAHOO WILLIE]

Really, Obie made a gaffe. Yeah, he probably should have had a better lock on the family story if he was going to use it, but it was NOT a deliberate attempt to mislead. Let it go!!!

[jharp]

Let it go!!!

Willie,

You are a man of common sense and decency.

Don't you think an acknowledgment of a mistake and an apology are due?

And then move on?

[WAHOO WILLIE]

"Don't you think an acknowledgment of a mistake and an apology are due?"

Harpie; I have no idea what you're talking about?

[SacTownMan]

That's okay Willie, neither does he!

[WAHOO WILLIE]

"That's okay Willie, neither does he!"

SacTown, Harpie's not a bad sort just a bit confusing sometimes. I dunno if he thinks 'I' owe an apology (most people who've been here a while know I'll admit when I'm wrong)Or if someone else does. Then he sort of leaves out what this apology is for. He needs to put down the PDA and use something he can type on faster.......

[seekeronos]

Copied from this comment at Sweetness & Light Blog:

http://sweetness-light.com/archive/a-query-to-the-89th-divisions-website#comment-111557

"----
JacksonianDemocrat: Excellent analysis and source citation.

On the matter of the military service of Charlie Payne, the great-uncle of Barack Obama:

His full name is Charles Thomas Payne and he IS the uncle (the term “uncle” has in fact been used even for great-uncles in that family) who served in the Army in the 89th Infantry during WW II and suffered severe enough PTSD that, after coming back from the war, he isolated himself at home for some time.

Charles recovered, attended college and to this day is an active, mentally vital, 83 year-old resident of Chicago.

This information was obtained tonight from a phone conversation with members of the Payne family and is being posted to correct the mis-information that is swirling around the internet.

CORRECT info:
1. Charles’ middle initial is “T”, not “W”;
2. he did have what is now termed PTSD; and
3. he was so traumatized by what he encountered during the war, that he in fact did isolate himself at home for a lengthy period of time.

Charles is the second of FOUR Payne siblings:

1. Madelyn Lee
2. Charles Thomas
3. Margaret Arlene
4. Jon Virgil, (born 1937, which is why there is no listing for him in the 1930 Census of Augusta City, Butler County, Kansas. This census has been the only source offered for “Payne sibling info” oin all of the genealogical sites cited by those interested in this story.

I suspect that the listing for Charles E. Payne of Kansas is in fact the record for Charles Thomas Payne. I believe the scribe probably heard “E” instead of “T.” That type of error is frequent in census records and in military records where the info is provided orally:

Payne, Charles E. Inducted 9 June 1943, Army 37531353 Registered, order # V11125 Augusta, Butler Co. (Board # 2)

http://www.kshs.org/genealogis.....mit=SEARCH

J Straight
----"

[jharp]

Willie,

I did not mean you owed an apology. You showed good common sense and decency.

I meant Dan R. and others.

"he thinks he can actually say anything to win votes and get away with it?"

"What a buffoon he's turning out to be."

[SacTownMan]

Excellent work seeker.

You and others posting in these threads are proof positive that anything a candidate says can be vetted and the most finite details learned.

All of the back and forth about who, what, where, and how detracts from the basic premise that Barry has a serious case of "foot in mouth" disease.

He continues to make up, embelish, fabricate and just plain lie in an effort to relate to whatever his speech topic is.

There is no doubt that he is a gifted speaker. The media darling has done his homework and his "rock star" stadium speaking series gets the base out and excited. His weakness shows through whenever he deviates from his script or can't use a teleprompter. In the Democratic debates Hillary was constantly better prepared.

It his attempts to "blend in" that expose his weakness in the fall. People don't relate to him and unless he finds a way to reach out to the redneck "typical white" "clingy" folks in middle America he can't rely on the coastal states to carry him to the 270 votes he needs.

All of the non-stop gaffs, the complete lack of understanding of international politics and the impact his comments have shown a lack of common sense that is downright dangerous.

Combined with his far left liberal agenda, his racist religous preacher, terrorist couple associations, communist father, under the bus "typical white" grandma comments continue to create a great amount of concern about his qualifications for POTUS.

[jharp]

"All of the non-stop gaffs, the complete lack of understanding of international politics and the impact his comments have shown a lack of common sense that is downright dangerous."

Excellent description of George Bush.

[southern Values]

Sac – you forgot he’s a Muslim

[SacTownMan]

No my grit eating friend he is a "Black Liberation Theology" trained Christian!

[seekeronos]

"--- It his attempts to "blend in" that expose his weakness in the fall. ---"

This seems to be a common technique of any skillful politician. Hillary (and especially Bill) may not have been especially outstanding orators, but they know how to "blend in" and "identify" with their audiences.

Hillary did it with her accent-pandering and her policy wonkishness, Bill did it even better with his "everyman" act.

While Hillary certainly had her negatives (yikes, is Obama that much of a sure thing that I am speaking of her in the past tense...? It sure looks like it!) Obama's negatives are further reaching and while he has that deep baritone voice and a stentorian delivery, it is his inability to mask his convenient slips of gaffe when ad-libbing off the script that makes people want to second guess him.

And McCain? I hate to repeat the meme that he is a retread of Bush, but actually he is worse - twice the RINO that Bush ever was, and as a "maverick" even more likely to tell the electorate to go "stuff it" when he feels like "being a maverick".

Hopefully such "maverick moments" don't happen too many times, least of all when he is in easy reach of the "nuclear football".

May God have mercy upon us all, regardless of who wins, unless the Lord puts it into the hearts of Americans to vote for a solid, Old Right, Christian, Constitutionalist, paleoconservative man like Chuck Baldwin for President this year.

[Mr DeBakey]

"People don't relate to him"
vs
"his "rock star" stadium speaking series gets the base out and excited."

Holy contradiction Batman!
And in one paragraph too!

[SarahW]

Drew, the issue is with Obama's fudging of a detail - including a specific camp that was impossible. None of the possible explanations for O.'s substitution is very flattering to Obama. It's not a "transpostion" - and *HE* owes his uncle and apology for dragging his service into politics, getting it wrong, and getting it wrong so badly that people have reason to question all the other details of the story.

[IslamoLlama]

"-- Drew, the issue is with Obama's fudging of a detail - including a specific camp that was impossible. None of the possible explanations for O.'s substitution is very flattering to Obama. It's not a "transpostion" - and *HE* owes his uncle and apology for dragging his service into politics, getting it wrong, and getting it wrong so badly that people have reason to question all the other details of the story. --"

You're full of shit, you know that? Absolutely choke full of it.

And not because of the stupidity - ranging from "Buchenwald wasn't so bad!" to getting bitch slapped by WW2 vets. Not because of the sheer brute hypocrisy - Dan's first pick for GOP Nominee made the claim that his father marched with MLK and you guys couldn't rationalize that fast enough. Not because of this pathetic attempt at character assassination as wingnuts parse every other syllable Obama utters in some vain attempt to make him less charismatic as even they admit he is.

No. You're full of shit because you continue to insist an issue like this even matters. If Barack Obama claimed his great uncle fought through Southern Italy when he'd instead landed at Normandy, if he'd implied that his great uncle saw fighting at Bunker Hill when it was actually combat in Paris... who the fuck cares?

How will this affect his tax policy? What impact does this have on environmental concerns? Will this positively or negatively impact the price of gas? The stock market? The deployment of troops in Iraq? Health care proposals?

You guys have - literally - nothing. Your quiver is empty. This is the best you have to throw at a one term Senator from Illinois when you're fielding a vetted media darling with a legislative record a mile long? Boo hoo! He mixed up Buchenwald and Auschwitz! Unfit to serve! Unfit to serve!

Fucking pathetic. Your guy can't keep straight Sunni and Shia, and you come to us with this? Get real.

[funnyshite]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_H11x6bMu4Y&e

[Roy Mustang]

Yes, shame on you Obama. You had to say your uncle liberated Auschwitz because Ohrdruf wasn't good enough for you. Shame!

[narciso]

So he is referred to as Waldo Dunham, Charles T. Payne, according to the division website; W.C. Payne, according to an historical account;
was he with the OSS; is that why there he is known by so many names. Ohrduf was an awful place; although Ahmadinejad, Nasrallah, and a whole passel of Salafi clerics would deny it
ever existed. Abu Ghraib was a vile place, seconded only to the "Palace at the End". Obama's argument seems to be if they hadn't declared war on us, there would have been no need for military operations.

[LOL]

so obama confused aushwitz but bush said we'd be greeted as liberators?

hmm... nice priorities you dimwits have

[IslamoLlama]

"-- Obama's argument seems to be if they hadn't declared war on us, there would have been no need for military operations. --"

I don't mean to reach, but when you say "they hadn't declared war on us" do you mean "[Iraq] hadn't declared war on [the US]"? Cause if you did... hehehe... omg, what an epic wingnut fail. I think this is even below the Dan Reihl level of hacktacular stupidity.