In a case that's more instructive in government power and control than most anything a liberal, or civil libertarian might opine upon, Wesley Snipes received the maximum sentence, 36 months in prison for not paying his taxes.
While I personally believe too much is made of alleged civil liberty encroachments under Bush and in the so-called war on terror - there is no greater threat to freedom in a capitalist society than that of the government to tax and regulate activity.
I'm not suggesting Snipes isn't guilty, or shouldn't go to jail, but you never hear a peep from the supposed freedom loving liberals when it comes to how government taxes and spends, thereby controlling our lives, as well as our livelihoods.
You can peace march all you want, try to persecute telco's for providing information to the government, and stage all the faux torture events you want in protest of government actions.
But what's perfectly clear in America today is one thing - you don't screw with the tax man. Never let it be said that our government doesn't know from whence its power springs.
It would be wise to consider that when debating hyper-regulative responses to issues like global warming and supporting politicians who love big government. It always comes with a price. And ultimately that price is freedom, just as much as it is dollars.
In relative terms, there will be little or no liberal hand-wringing over the Snipes conviction, which causes one to wonder if they really understand freedom at all. Snipes appears to be guilty, but he WAS striking Big Brother at its heart in a way few if any anti-war protesters ever do.
And the message is clear - Big Brother knows how to deal with threats to its collective heart when they really matter.
Issues like the above are why I genuinely question the motivations of liberals today. They claim to be championing liberty. Yet nearly everything they champion calls for more taxation and regulation. One can't do both and be intellectually consistent, or honest.


"but you never hear a peep from the supposed freedom loving liberals when it comes to how government taxes and spends"
Quite the contrary.
I'm a freedom loving liberal who gets quite pissed about taxpayers funding sports stadiums. And the taxpayer funded Iraq goodwill mission is another.
I'm sure there's more but have business to take care of and can't go on.
And by the way, Dan, not a great post but your best one in a week.
Thanks.
Posted by: jharp | Thursday, April 24, 2008 at 09:29 PM
You're confused because they would be more accurately pegged as Leftists; their liberalism bears little resemblance to the classical Liberalism you think of when you hear the word, "liberal". That liberalism morphed into radical liberalism in the post-war era. As such, they are being true to their beliefs and not hypocritical when they embrace the tax man AND decry government intrusiveness.
Posted by: Emma | Thursday, April 24, 2008 at 09:45 PM
Let's not forget those other expensive lefty pet projects...Free Tibet and liberate Darfur.
Easy to imagine, quite expensive in blood and treasure to do.
Posted by: torabora | Thursday, April 24, 2008 at 11:17 PM
Like I always tell my children. "Independence springs out of the back of your wallet. A fat wallet provides more independence then a thin one." It is in government's interest to ensure it has a fat wallet and you have a thin wallet".
Posted by: Zainuddin Banatwala | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 12:12 AM
Yeah, but the guys that stomped that trucker into the ground on TV during the Rodney King riots got less time -- precisely because the liberal types made such a fuss.
Posted by: Kevin | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 12:20 AM
The income tax is administered by the government to support a private corporation--the Federal Reserve System.
The purpose of the tax is to remove as many Federal Reserve Notes as possible from circulation, to prevent them from inflating into total uselessness. They haven't been removing quite enough recently, as you may have noticed.
Posted by: Nutball Wacko | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 12:30 AM
"From whence" is redundant. I think you just mean "whence". I'm just saying . . .
Posted by: Ronald Truman | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 12:35 AM
We should all just stop paying taxes entirely. That would fix everything, and we'd finally be free. Plus, without our tax money, the government couldn't go after us.
No, it'll never happen. The liberals who don't care about Wesley's plight would probably come after us, hurling lattes and demanding payouts to cover their expenses for having to go after us. That's pretty much what government is anyway, so why bother. Might as well just pay taxes, bitch about it, and laud the brave ones like Wesley who resist the man.
Posted by: Dan | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 12:51 AM
Usage note Although sometimes criticized as redundant on the grounds that “from” is implied by the word whence, the idiom from whence is old in the language, well established, and standard. Among its users are the King James Bible, Shakespeare, Dryden, and Dickens: Hilary finally settled in Paris, from whence she bombarded us with letters, postcards, and sketches.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/whence
Posted by: Ted | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 12:52 AM
The Lefty projects "Save Darfur" and "Free Tibet" willl cost nothing in blood and treasure.
Because they intend nothing whatever be done about them.
If George Bush sent Marines to Darfur, once again it would be "No blood for oil".
The Left thinks they can free Tibet and save Darfur by holding signs and wishing.
Posted by: Gabriel Hanna | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 01:01 AM
Seriously Gabriel. The way to free Tibet and save Darfur is to stop paying taxes. Why don't those lefties see that?
Posted by: Dan | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 01:06 AM
Dan,
I am not sure if I understand your post. Are you saying Liberals don't understand freedom because they accept the theory and process of taxation?
Moldy
Posted by: moldy | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 01:11 AM
"One can't do both and be intellectually consistent, or honest."
If it has taken you until 2008 to figure out that liberals are neither consistent, honest, or for 'liberty' at all, than you are a slow one...
Posted by: Liberals are Dumb | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 01:13 AM
Who ever said that Liberals today care about Liberty? They don't even know the word. They would choke on it. Liberals/Leftists/Progressives care about exerting maximum power and control. They believe in 'minorities' rising up against white males. They believe in income re-distribution. No, that's too fair actually. That would mean they at least want everyone at the same level. They want to take away 100% from some to give to others. You want a 'Liberal' paradise? Look no farther than Venezuela, Cuba, Zimbabwe. Watch Chavez, Castro, and Mugabe take control of all private property, industry and resources and give it not to the people but to those in the 'government.' Care about Wesley Snipes? If he were a Leftist, they would have t-shirts with his picture on it. Because he's a black man, they give him the courtesy of remaining quiet. If he were white they would cheer his imprisonment. If he were a Jew they would dance in the streets and use his name as an epithet of everything wrong in the world because of the Jews that control it. Liberty?
Posted by: Liberty? | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 01:25 AM
And regarding their resistance to privacy intrusion and civil liberties? That's only because it's George Bush and Republicans using it to catch terrorists (i.e. leftists). Who knows which leftists in America might be on that phone call with terrorist organizations? Might be Ayers, Obama, Carter. But, watch a Democratically controlled government use technology to invade every aspect of your life for taxation. Watch them install video cameras everywhere. Watch them track your car with a GPS to tax your driving every which way. Watch them not just monitor, but actually control your thermostat. Watch them monitor and tax you for being overweight, for smoking, for too many children, etc. Sound too Big Brother futurish? These are all current proposals.
Posted by: Liberty? | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 01:34 AM
we could end this expensive government program in Iraq and save billions on our tax dollars.
Or we could be hypocrites and be fiscal conservatives.
Posted by: LOL | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 01:38 AM
I also don't understand why I'm supposed to care and feel sorry for some rich HOLLYWOOD jerk who couldn't part with a small portion of his millions.
Posted by: LOL | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 01:40 AM
"I also don't understand why I'm supposed to care and feel sorry for some rich HOLLYWOOD jerk who couldn't part with a small portion of his millions."
Because he is black. In fact, blacker than Obama, who is himself blacker than Wright.
Under an Obama regime, non-blacks will be taxed in order to pay a fief to blacks. Any resistance to this will not be tolerated.
Posted by: Jammix | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 02:01 AM
It is no stretch at all to seeing liberals, (read Democrats), as enemies of the country and our constitution. I have taken the oath many times to protect and defend the constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic. The day may come when senior leadereship orders the arrest of some of these citizens. I know if I had gotten the order it would have been, "yes sir." The line they walk is not as thin as most would have you believe. Lincoln would have had a third of the democrats in congress in jail for treason and/or sedition. The Democrats are always reminding us of the number of our war dead. All the dead can be laid at the feet of our elected officials. How are the dead to be divided? Some are dead because they followed orders of those officials, some are dead because the enemy was assisted by some of those officials. What's the split?
Posted by: Giangho | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 02:08 AM
CAN'T RESIST >>>>
http://shortcircuitz.mtv.com/music-videos/599/bush-vs.-kanye/
You don't want it from the President (Hell, no, Kanye)...
Posted by: dm60462 | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 02:48 AM
This is a bit much. No one likes taxes, but what is the alternative? Anarchy. We must have a common defense, courts, and the like. There is no question about that unless you're an anarchist. How are these to be paid for? There are many theoretical ways, but the most obvious and easily worked is a tax.
What is done with tax money is a separate issue, as is the level of taxation, but I don't believe that anyone has found a workable alternative to taxation in the history of mankind.
Complaining about the existence of a tax is nothing more than childishness.
A tax must be enforced to work. THere's really no getting around it.
Posted by: Skyler | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 05:45 AM
How often do you hear liberals screaming for Liberty?
More often them scream for "equality" or "justice", which means "using the government to force you to do what I want".
Posted by: RGriffin | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 05:45 AM
Skyler: To address your question, there are things called fees whereby you pay for the service you incurred rather than having your money dumped into a general fund so that you no longer know what you are paying for.
Posted by: Mark | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 05:58 AM
Why is it the same people who defend the right to privacy [you can do whatever you want in your bedroom ...] think nothing of requiring documentation and disclosure of our most trivial economic activities. Oh thats right- they want their 'cut'
Posted by: Rob | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 06:10 AM
Come now brave patriots. People need to pay taxes to pay for VICTORIES in Iraq. Remember, tax money= victory against evil-doers. The trooops are counting on you.
The SURGE would not be working without you!!
Posted by: bobInStamford | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 06:55 AM
As true as it is (above), the ever-increasing means of collecting taxes compound the attacks on liberty. "Let them tax the smokes" or carbon or breast implants [nothing's off of the table]. They torment honest people, push us into underground economies, proliferate crime and - once they've killed of a big enough sector (cigarettes) - bitch because tax revs are down. What to do... another tax increase to make up for the short-falls!
Posted by: djr | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 07:19 AM
As always, the power to tax is the power to destroy. I teach my young kids about taxes firsthand and in a way that hits home to them: whenever we fix them dessert I make sure to, before handing whatever it is over to them, to take a big tablespoon full away in front of them with that admonition "that's paying taxes." It never fails to provoke outrage.
As an aside, leftists/liberals in the pocket of the illegal alien brigades always decry deporting some illegal and "separating him/her from their family here in the US" - well what the hell does sending someone to jail for not paying taxes do?? Of course they're happy to see some "rich, tax cheating bastard" frog-marched off to prison for not funding their programs.
Posted by: H Tuttle | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 07:57 AM
Please, be a better journalist that the freaking mainstream media.
Wesley Snipes is not being jailed for "not paying his taxes." As it is not against the law to not pay your taxes.
Mr. Snipes is being jailed for something else: failing to report his income to the IRS.
You are free to not pay your taxes. You are not, however, free to fail to report your income. Tax payment in the United States, for individuals who are not subject to withholding, is voluntary. Says so right there on your tax return. Individuals who are subject to withholding by their employers end up paying taxes, but only because their employers are required to withhold them. So, the employee never sees the money.
But nobody in this country can be jailed for failing to pay their taxes.
Posted by: getyourfactsstraight | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 08:03 AM
This post doesn't make sense. Anybody remember "Taxation without representation"? The war of Independence was fought because of it. Not "Taxation" per se, note. The idea that you can have all the public goods we associate with government, a collective defense etc. without taxation is just stupid. And to equate low or no taxation with freedom is a non sequitur. One important sense of the word freedom is "freedom from oppressive taxation" but in a democracy that takes care of itself. Turkeys don't vote for Christmas by and large.
But holding up those who refuse to pay tax as folk heroes is DEFINITELY not a road you want to go down. A well-funded government is essential to a well-ordered society.
Posted by: Andrew Lale | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 08:21 AM
Three years in prison for three misdemeanors? Sounds like a clear case of "Evading while black"
Posted by: T J Sawyer | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 08:47 AM
Three years in prison for three misdemeanors? Sounds like a clear case of "Evading while black"
Posted by: T J Sawyer | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 08:47 AM
Fees? Fees to pay for a legal system? Are you saying that to get justice you would have to pay a fee? Or if you get burglarized you would have to pay the police officer to catch the criminal? Gee, there's no problem with that, is there?
The level of taxation is onerous, of that there's no doubt. There is tons of room for debate on what tax money is spent on. But the only way a democratic republic can work is if we vote on taxes and consent to paying them as voted on, with appropriate safeguards for individual rights.
Even if we could maintain security and civilization without taxation, we'd still have to vote for it. No nation can exist long if individuals can pick and choose which laws they want to obey, unless those laws are immoral. Tax laws may be bad or they may be beneficial, but they are not inherently immoral. If you choose to not pay taxes, you must suffer the appropriate consequences.
Posted by: Skyler | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 08:51 AM
Huh? You idiots are voluntarily paying taxes? Wow. That's mighty generous of you.
You're not required to pay. You do realize that, right? Take a look at your tax return. Payment of taxes is voluntary in the United States. Of course, you do have to file a return reporting all of your income. You can even voluntarily pay the tax on that income if you choose.
Or not. But you must file. Otherwise, you could go to jail.
Companies are also required to withhold taxes from your paycheck. So, employers have to remit taxes to the government, but citizens do not. Citizens pay taxes voluntarily. The government can place a lien on property if you choose not to pay your taxes, so it's important for you to not own property, but as long as you don't own property, you are free to choose not to pay. (I don't own my property. Another company does. That's completely legal.)
Snipes was an idiot. He should have filed, but chose to not voluntarily pay.
That's completely legal.
Posted by: idontpaytaxes | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 09:29 AM
You write
"...I genuinely question the motivations of liberals today. They claim to be championing liberty..."
My experience of late has been a bit different. I have actually heard liberals complain, more than once, that there is far too much freedom in the U.S. The first time a person opined such to me, I was literally speechless. Now, I simply regard it as a reflection of the Stalinist/Fascist [take your pick] views of such folks.
Posted by: Henry Bowman | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 09:37 AM
Tax laws may be bad or they may be beneficial, but they are not inherently immoral.
Sorry but explain how the IRS can issue an order to confiscate your personal wealth and issue penalties before a federal trial. Explain why banks are required to report on personal transactions over $10K.
Posted by: Bandit | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 09:40 AM
"-- Snipes was an idiot. He should have filed, but chose to not voluntarily pay.
That's completely legal. --"
They can garnish your wages and they can investigate your "company" as an illegal tax shelter. If you are making money via investment, they can freeze your investments and your bank accounts. True, you could set up some sort of parallel entity - start a LLC in your name for instance - and have all the property you use declared as company assets. But then, again, you see a host of legal issues, not the least of which is the tax on the company you've just set up for yourself.
Perhaps you've lucked out and run into some particularly dim-witted IRS agents, but I wouldn't play by your little game. I'm more than happy to pay the financial price for living in the greatest country on earth. Stiffing the government on its due is about the most unpatriotic thing I can think of, particularly if you're an Iraq War Cheer Leader.
Once again, I'm blown away by how some conservatives think the US Government just operates for free. That half trillion dollars we've spent so far in Iraq is coming out of someone's pocket. Libertarians just don't understand why they should have to foot the bill like everyone else.
Seriously, if you don't like paying taxes, move to Luxenburg or the Caymen Islands or some other tax shelter nation. Why are you even in the states?
Posted by: IslamoLlama | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 09:42 AM
Somewhere in this thread someone mentions "taxation without representation". Reminds me of a line from a sitcom long ago where a British maid says to her American employers, "So, now you have representation, do you like it any better"?
Posted by: Whosonfirst | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 10:03 AM
"Seriously, if you don't like paying taxes, move to Luxenburg or the Caymen Islands or some other tax shelter nation."
Who do you think you are? What makes you think that you have the moral authority to dictate the terms and conditions of other peoples' existence like that?
*Fuck* you. I didn't take that "love it or leave it" bullshit from Spiro Agnew, and you count for even less.
And, Dan: the right isn't any more interested in freedom when it comes to this sort of thing than the left is. Get off it.
Posted by: Billy Beck | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 10:06 AM
I guess I was too subtle in my sarcasm. I find this whole post absurd, and thought that my comments captured its absurdity. The fact that several people couldn't tell I was joking only underscores my point.
Posted by: Dan | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 10:14 AM
No, Dan. You just hit a sore point.
Posted by: Chris | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 10:57 AM
Haha. 30 posts from a bunch of nutty tax protesters. I hope Janet Reno comes and burns down your compounds.
Ron Paul 08!!! Hahahaha!
Posted by: chris | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 10:58 AM
"Issues like the above are why I genuinely question the motivations of liberals today. They claim to be championing liberty. Yet nearly everything they champion calls for more taxation and regulation."
The Iraq War: A self-funding, unregulated enterprise?
Domestic Spying: A self-funding, unregulated enterprise? (Actually, the unregulated part is true.)
Pot Prohibition: A self-funding, unregulated enterprise?
I wonder, by what factor does useless spending on Iraq and the "War on Drugs" outweigh that of every "liberal" program combined? Double digits?
"I have actually heard liberals complain, more than once, that there is far too much freedom in the U.S."
Yeah, sure. I always hear liberals calling for censorship.
Wait, no, I don't. Here, I'll play this game, too!
I have actually heard conservatives complain, more that once, that taxes and spending need to be raised. This proves they are Nazi Communists. If you disagree, you're a Nazi Communist, too.
Posted by: scarshapedstar | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 10:59 AM
I don't get why he got 3 years? Politicians, other famous people get caught all the time for not paying taxes, for years and years, and they say "oh I forgot" and they pay a penalty and it's over.
Why is he paying his taxes and penalties and also going to prison? Is it because he didn't lie and say "I forgot" but instead said "screw you" to the IRS?
Posted by: plutosdad | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 11:05 AM
Haha. 30 posts from a bunch of nutty tax protesters. I hope Janet Reno comes and burns down your compounds.
Ron Paul 08!!! Hahahaha!
Posted by: chris | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 11:10 AM
I agree. Those evil, insidious, and freedom-hating liberals even snuck taxation into the constitution!! Not only that, but they gave the Congress the power to do all kinds of stuff with money!!
Art I Section 8:
"The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises, to pay the debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States; but all duties, imposts and excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;
To borrow money on the credit of the United States;
To regulate commerce with foreign nations, and among the several states, and with the Indian tribes;
To establish a uniform rule of naturalization, and uniform laws on the subject of bankruptcies throughout the United States;
To coin money, regulate the value thereof, and of foreign coin, and fix the standard of weights and measures;
To provide for the punishment of counterfeiting the securities and current coin of the United States;
To establish post offices and post roads;
To promote the progress of science and useful arts, by securing for limited times to authors and inventors the exclusive right to their respective writings and discoveries;
To constitute tribunals inferior to the Supreme Court;
To define and punish piracies and felonies committed on the high seas, and offenses against the law of nations;
To declare war, grant letters of marque and reprisal, and make rules concerning captures on land and water;
To raise and support armies, but no appropriation of money to that use shall be for a longer term than two years;
To provide and maintain a navy;
To make rules for the government and regulation of the land and naval forces;
To provide for calling forth the militia to execute the laws of the union, suppress insurrections and repel invasions;
To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the militia, and for governing such part of them as may be employed in the service of the United States, reserving to the states respectively, the appointment of the officers, and the authority of training the militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;
To exercise exclusive legislation in all cases whatsoever, over such District (not exceeding ten miles square) as may, by cession of particular states, and the acceptance of Congress, become the seat of the government of the United States, and to exercise like authority over all places purchased by the consent of the legislature of the state in which the same shall be, for the erection of forts, magazines, arsenals, dockyards, and other needful buildings;--And
To make all laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into execution the foregoing powers, and all other powers vested by this Constitution in the government of the United States, or in any department or officer thereof."
It makes perfect sense that the constitution grants spending powers to the Congress without the capacity of the Congress to raise funds. Clearly the drafters of the spending powers of congress were amoral leftists who hated america.
OMG, look at the 16th amendment!!
"The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration."
Clearly, the 16th amendment is unconstitutional, immoral, amoral, and probably created by muslim atheist abortionist homosexuals who hate America, freedom, and family values. What's that? You mean it was pushed by then president Taft, a conservative Republican? OMG, Teddy Roosevelt too?!
Morons
Posted by: Totally Heterosexual Conservative | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 11:40 AM
To argue against taxes is futile. Taxes are the law, and as THC above so sarcastically pointed out, they are quite constitutional.
Of course, you will pay taxes one way or another; and it is in such a way that you (involuntarily) pay fees for most government services.
And it can always be worse: we can look at Europe for how bad taxation can really get. You pay an average of $3,60 for unleaded gas now. In Germany, it is on the order of $8,60 (after converting from litres to gallons and Euros to USD).
And screen door taxes in the UK; and TV taxes in the UK and Japan; and so on...
By and large, we really have it good in this country.
Facts aside, though... modern liberals really do love their socialist schemes to re-distribute everyone's income around (with a very large portion of it going into their pockets, or their earmarks for federal pork projects when they are seated in the halls of power) and especially so out of whatever sense of "white guilt" they use to keep their minority constituencies enslaved to the party line.
They also take great joy in trying to coerce everyone else into following their (mostly hare-brained) mandates, thinking that they have the right and moral (yet relativist) authority to march everyone along to the oppressive beat of their Stalinist drum.
Libertarians - and especially the small-government small "c" conservatives prefer a government that stays in its proper sphere of public defense (not assault, and especially in foreign nations), regulating interstate trade and trade with other sovereign nations. We also like our tax money to be put to use to rebuild and maintain our roads and rails, and not pay addle-brained absinthe drinkers to drop crucifixes into vials of urine and call it "art".
Some disagreement will likely ensue over the definitions of "rights" vs. privileges, where the enumerated rights to the people in the US Constitution do not include "rights to free and universal medical care" or the "right to murder unborn babies without cause".
Actually though, Life is Not Fair™, and as much as I love our United States and our Constitution, it too, shall pass from history in due course. I shall endeavour to do all within my power to see that it -- and our freedoms -- remain, and pay my taxes without complaint, as my Lord commanded me.
But when at last this Republic does pass away, and its Constitution nothing more than a cheapened piece of parchment much like the old Soviet constitution or the Red Chinese constitution -- along with whatever freedoms the liberals (or the NeoCons, who are in reality nothing much more than repackaged Trotskyites) take from us, I shall only rejoice in the liberty from the penalty of sin which Christ gave us.
For our kingdom is not of this world.
Posted by: seekeronos | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 12:29 PM
"-- Who do you think you are? What makes you think that you have the moral authority to dictate the terms and conditions of other peoples' existence like that?
*Fuck* you. I didn't take that "love it or leave it" bullshit from Spiro Agnew, and you count for even less. --"
Shit, I'm sorry but complaining about taxes makes about as much sense as complaining about gravity. You don't get something for nothing. Every government service - be it Medicare or Highways or War - costs money. That money comes from tax payers. And while you can wax on and off about the merits of the private sector versus the public trust, we will still need health care and a transportation infrastructure and a standing military.
If you don't want health care or highways or soldiers, move to a country that doesn't provide them. But if you're on the public doll, and we all are in one way or another, quit your endless bitching about paying the bills. I can see you having this conversation with the electric company - "How dare you cut off my power! I have the right to an endless supply of free energy as provided by someone other than me."
You live in a community, a democracy. That means everyone gets to dictate how everyone else lives. That's reality, and it doesn't exactly go away when you remove the superstructure of government. Get rid of the police and the justice system and the legislature. You will still have neighbors. They'll still have an impact on your life - directly or indirectly - and there is nothing you can do about it. But this constant whining about living in civilization is nauseating. Uou whole heartedly insist that you - alone - could do better than the rest of the country combined, if only people wouldn't make you cough up a few grand a year for public services.
If you don't want to live in civilization, then leave. No one is keeping you here. If you want to bicker about policy, that's one thing. But asking to simply cash out and sit on your ass makes you look like a spoiled child. Do you want your taxes back in US Dollars or should we just give you 40 acres and a mule? Once you've declared yourself a sovereign tax-free nation unto yourself, will you be bitching when your sovereign next door neighbor beats you up and takes your stuff? Do you plan on substance farming for a living and never leaving your little plot of land? Good god, better not plan to breed, cause then reality will really start taking a 2x4 to your head. Outside this little anarchist's utopia you've built for yourself, will you be bothering the rest of us socialist hippies? I hope not.
Posted by: IslamoLlama | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 12:33 PM
Hey, Harpo, Mr. Ever, Moe, you need to read Mr. Convervative's post on the Constitution (above). It reminds you idiots who in the government is really responsible for the economy, stupid, and most every other government function. It is the Congress, not Bush. Thanks for showing these liberal pinheads up, Mr. Conservative.
Posted by: Fred Beloit | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 12:43 PM
First of all which definition of "freedom" are you referring to: exemption from external control and regulation; the power to determine without restraint; or political /national independence?? Depending on which you definition you choose the answer is very different.
Regardless, total freedom from any restraint , control or regulation equals chaos.For example with "total freedomn" we'd become a nation where if someone didn't like something his neighbor did, just shoot him.
Furthermore, without taxation what would fund the military? And would you be willing to have zero control over imported food and medicines? Probably not. Fees? ummmm... ok, I'll pay $3 for this pill, $20 to inspect my hamburger....
The fact of the matter is that in a SOCIETY ,a body of individuals living as members of a community, total personal freedom is unattainable and in my opinion, undesirable.
Posted by: Ed | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 12:47 PM
This argument *against* taxes is really an argument *for* a system of medieval feudalism. That's what conservatives want. Think indentured servitude, company stores, and debtors prisons are bad things? They sound pretty good to elitist conservatives, because after all, with such a system they will get paid, and fuck everyone else. It's a perfect system for such elites. For example, they profit from wars and all that come with them, while everyone BUT them pays the costs; create the department of homeland security - the most bloated, ineffective government agency on record, not to actually provide homeland security, but to think up ways of handing out sweet contracts to and from the elites; commit unlawful acts with the assistance of corporate telecoms and then push for deregulation and telecom immunity as rewards, and as a means of further covering up those unlawful acts; hire your pals to provide "security" in Iraq and cloak them in immuninty as well; etc. etc.
These are standard *socialize the risk - privatize the profts* models, consistent with conservative "governance" since the Reagan era. The model doesn't change - merely the means of looting the treasury and sending the U.S. back to the dark ages must evolve. The Iraq war is their greatest success in the sense that there is a never-ending source of money provided by a cowardly congress, and they will never have to pay one red cent in support of it.
Posted by: Totally Heterosexual Conservative | Friday, April 25, 2008 at 12:51 PM