Unfortunately For Obama, He "Triked" Out

Yes, Jeremiah Wright probably does present a path to victory over Obama in the Fall. But maybe not why some think. I'd suggest it isn't because Obama is black. It's because, by half, he isn't and never has been black enough.

It's worth noting some pertinent background and history in the wake of Obama's recent speech on race. For example, that image of Obama on a tricycle at right: not quite the stuff of a disadvantaged black youth, now is it?

There are probably millions of white individuals Obama's age who can't claim to have had as refined a look, or as nice a "trike" as Obama when young. So, what exactly is this "authenticity" we here so much about?

It's suggested he tossed his Grandmother under the bus, citing her previous racial remarks. Has anyone stopped to think that she was mostly catching buses in Kansas, and then Hawaii in her time with Obama? She may, or may not have made some racial comments that had nothing to do with what we would consider black men at all.

Point being, when Obama joined Jeremiah Wright's church, he wasn't even close to being entitled to the angry young black man mantra Wright has professed for the last twenty or so years. Yes, his wife and "most important adviser" was at least closer to the mark, but even she was not quite there herself - her upbringing has been reported as standard middle class.

And where was Jeremiah Wright in the days of Dr. King? He was the correct age to have been involved, to have been down with the cause. Yet his biographies do not even mention Dr. King's name, let alone his legacy. See here and here. As the SayAnything blog suggested, Dr. King might not have looked too kindly on Wright, at all.

In a sense, there were two somewhat competing factions during the sixties-based struggle for Civil Rights, somewhat represented by Dr. King versus Malcom X. Wright seems to have aligned himself with neither, opting mostly for the opportunism of aligning himself really only with himself. In the wake of both men's assassinations in the sixties, the Civil Rights cause became muddled, with, perhaps, King's more valuable legacy getting a bit lost precisely because of people like Jeremiah Wright and black anger after King's assassination.

As for Obama, I don't believe he has ever had any real touchstone with the legitimate black struggle for Civil Rights in America. His roots were in Hawaii, Indonesia and Kansas, places nothing at all like Watts, or Camden, let alone the Southside of Chicago.

Of course he needed black authenticity to succeed as a black politician in the Southside of Chicago. But in choosing to get it through Wright's church, he was either, 1: demonstrating total ignorance of what had come before in the Civil Rights movement; 2: displaying a willful and total disregard for the genuine legacy of Dr, King - one he would now profess to want to take up, or 3: he was exhibiting poor or cynical judgment on both accounts.

Obama's candidacy isn't in jeopardy because of Jeremiah Wright, or because Obama's black. It's in jeopardy because Obama made a terrible choice by embracing Wright, most likely driven by his not being "black" enough. How utterly ironic that the first serious black candidate for president was tripped up, not because he's black, but because he's too white, by half.

Barack Obama may be many things along with being a highly talented politician ... unfortunately, when it comes to his perhaps unwanted, yet newly adopted cause, thrust upon him by his association with Wright - race ... Obama's probably never seen himself as truly authentic. And based upon his recent speech,  authentic, quite clearly, he still is not.

Ultimately, Obama strikes me as an incredibly gifted speaker who, quite naively, would like very much to be all things to all people at this stage of his career. Unfortunately for him, perhaps only those unusually desperate for anything amorphously calling itself change will vote for that.

For now, at least, somewhat like the boy on the fancy tricycle above, Barack Obama needs to go away for a bit and potentially come back in 4 - 8 years ... after he grows up.

Comments

[WAHOO WILLIE]

cleek, the link doesn't work but this one does: http://www.commondreams.org/views05/0516-21.htm
Yes, MLK did say many of the things that you quote but I wonder if you rememebr those times? I'm not going to argue the finer points of this whole Obie is the second coming of MLK debate. Like most everything else, people have made their minds and there is no need to discuss.

[cleek]

"I wont start out calling you a liar but how about a link to these speeches you quote?"

they were gathered from assorted "quotes" pages. some were from King's books, some from letters, some from speeches, some from sermons. just out of curiosity, i verified some of the more incendiary things i quoted. but i did that after i posted here, and i didn't save the results of my search. but feel free to look them up yourself.

here's another one:
(http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/20/AR2008032003021.html)

"God didn't call America to engage in a senseless, unjust war. . . . And we are criminals in that war. We've committed more war crimes almost than any nation in the world, and I'm going to continue to say it. And we won't stop it because of our pride and our arrogance as a nation. But God has a way of even putting nations in their place." King then predicted this response from the Almighty: "And if you don't stop your reckless course, I'll rise up and break the backbone of your power."

that one is from one of King's sermons at his church in Atlanta, 1968.

let's hear some more about how Obama should be more like King...

[Fred Beloit]

Harpo writes of Craig: "Not only was he convicted he plead guilty." Yes, Dufus, but guilty of what?

[Quaker in a Basement]

"--And where was Jeremiah Wright in the days of Dr. King? He was the correct age to have been involved, to have been down with the cause. Yet his biographies do not even mention Dr. King's name, let alone his legacy. See here and here.--"

The links you provide answer your question, Dan. He was in the Marines.

[jlo]

"The competing strains of thought and religion in black america break down along class lines, more than color lines. Wright and his ilk preach poison to the impoverished as much as anything else. And the Obama's of the world attend for different reasons, but know better. The ultimate victims of this victimilogy are the poor and un-educated. That ain't exactly Obama, in case you haven't noticed."

Soooo, if Obama had grown up poor and un-educated and virtually had no shot at ever achieving any high political office, then you would be okay with him making speeches in Philadelphia re: racism in America?

Why do leaders who reveal compassion about the plight of the under-privileged have to be (or must have been) underprivileged themselves?

By your perception, all the (relatively) privileged caucasians who went south for several summers during the civil rights era were wholly unqualified to be doing so and whose motives ought to be completely mistrusted.

This post is desperate, racist, and sickeningly cynical.

[Fred Beloit]

This one is a lulu. Standard socialism.

http://universityofthepoor.net/library/stratpapers/trumpet.htm

[Fred Beloit]

" In the last months of his life, Martin Luther King Jr. talked about the necessity of challenging the warfare state. In January 1968, he said: "I never intend to adjust myself to economic conditions that will take necessities from the many to give luxuries to the few. I never intend to adjust myself to the madness of militarism..." In March 1968, he said: "The bombs in Vietnam explode at home; they destroy the hopes and possibilities for a decent America."

http://www.commondreams.org/views05/0516-21.htm

[Fred Beloit]

And you, Jimmy, are a Boob.

[Jimmy Barlingame]

retire05 wrote: Why do I think that if we were to check your night stand we would not find a Gideon Bible but the Communist Manifesto instead?

Uh, because you're an ignorant asshole?

[WAHOO WILLIE]

"No, cleek, I never read any of those things." (either)

Though I was alive and quite old enough to understand the things he was saying as it appeared on the news. I also had relatives from the states where much of King's work was done, Ga and Ala. I was very much aware that two Americas truly existed at the time. I wont start out calling you a liar but how about a link to these speeches you quote?

[templar knight]

No, cleek, I never read any of those things. I doubt whether those particular quotes were given very much, if any, play in the media. Because that rhetoric would have undone many things MLK was trying to do. He played hard at appearing to be moderate, I doubt he would have achieved as much had some of those statements been published or broadcast to the nation. Just my thoughts.

[Fred Beloit]

cleek, thanks. We have allowed the Left and the MSM to sanctify MLK, to beatify, to sanctify, to raise to sainthood a man who said some pretty crazy s--t, standard far-Left material, along with a lot of really good stuff. The Left tried to do the same with MX using books, a movie, etc. But since, when one learns about MX one also learns the Elijah Muslims killed him, their message kept getting derailed. The
Muzzies probably should have found a white trigger man.

[cleek]

have you clowns ever actually read anything MLK said ?

here are some examples:

--

Our nation was born in genocide when it embraced the doctrine that the original American, the Indian, was an inferior race.

--

The dispossessed of this nation -- the poor, both white and Negro -- live in a cruelly unjust society. They must organize a revolution against that injustice, not against the lives of the persons who are their fellow citizens, but against the structures through which the society is refusing to take means which have been called for, and which are at hand, to lift the load of poverty.

--

We need a radical reordering of our national priorities.

--

Our only hope today lies in our ability to recapture the revolutionary spirit and go out into a sometimes hostile world declaring eternal opposition to poverty, racism and militarism.

--

It is necessary to understand that Black Power is a cry of disappointment. The Black Power slogan did not spring full grown from the head of some philosophical Zeus. It was born from the wounds of despair and disappointment. It is a cry of daily hurt and persistent pain.

--

When we ask Negroes to abide by the law, let us also declare that the white man does not abide by law in the ghettos. Day in and day out he violates welfare laws to deprive the poor of their meager allotments; he flagrantly violates building codes and
regulations; his police make a mockery of law; he violates laws on equal employment and education and the provisions of civil services. The slums are the handiwork of a vicious system of the white society; Negroes live in them, but they do not make them, any more than a prisoner makes a prison.

--

The bombs in Vietnam explode at home; they destroy the hopes and possibilities for a decent America.

--

We in the West must bear in mind that the poor countries are poor primarily because we have exploited them through political or economic colonialism.

--
I am convinced that if we are to get on the right side of the world revolution, we as a nation must undergo a radical revolution of values.
A true revolution of values will soon cause us to question the fairness and justice of many of our past and present policies.
A true revolution of values will soon look uneasily on the glaring contrast between poverty and wealth. With righteous indignation, it will look across the seas and see individual capitalists of the West investing huge sums of money in Asia, Africa, and South America only to take the profits out with no concern for the social betterment of the countries, and say: "This is not just."
It will look at our alliance with the landed gentry of Latin America and say: "This is not just."
The Western arrogance of feeling that it has everything to teach others and nothing to learn from them is not just.
A true revolution of values will lay hands on the world

--

To be a Negro in America is to hope against hope.

- etc...

regardless of what you think, MLK wasn't some quiet, play-along, don't-rock-the-boat kind of guy. he was a revolutionary. Hoover called him "the most notorious liar in the country." MLK wanted radical change and was killed for asking for it. if Obama was saying any of those things today, you people would be barring your doors, drawing your blinds and loading your muskets.

[seekeronos]

"--- A pretty minor crime here on earth but something your group thinks he will burn for in the fires of hell for an eternity. ---"

Actually, "our group", if by that you mean "people who believe in the words of Jesus Christ", believe that everyone (including ourselves) were born with sin, and that apart from Christ, it is impossible to escape the eternal punishment of Hell.

It doesn't matter if you seem to be as clean as Mother Teresa or the biggest lyingest thievingest sodomite that ever walked the earth:

"For all have sinned, and fall short of the glory of God" (Romans 3:23)

[jharp]

Fred Beloit,

"Personally, I said he(Larry Craig) didn't appear to have done anything illegal. I still say the same."

Not only was he convicted he plead guilty.

Granted he was only trying to suck the penis of an undercover police officer. A pretty minor crime here on earth but something your group thinks he will burn for in the fires of hell for an eternity.

[IslamoLlama]

"-- I thought his speech was incredible! My husband is African American and I'm Jewish. We both are Republicans who were going to vote for McCain, until yesterday. --"

Traitor! Islamofascist! Fifth Columnist Scum! The GOoPers don't need you! What's one more percentage point when you're already down to 24?

[wjo]

Methinks "Dr. Valerie" is probably a plant to get this board to run on about miscegenation, anti-semitism, and other reflexive hatreds. The thinking being that conservatism is nothing but the Klan with a smiley face.

So far, don't seem to be any takers for her "boob food".

[Fred Beloit]

Dr Valerie reminds me of William BS, the "soldier" (in the propaganda wars).

[wjo]

MLK was a great American because he sought out the best in Americans. He showed and taught that the hatefulness of segregation and racism were shameful,immoral, and unAmerican.

Obama falls very short of MLK's mark. He made a choice to embrace the politics of grievance and division. He tries to clothe it in pretty phrases, but that political creed is not broad and encompassing. It is narrow, angry and polarizing. It is also distasteful to people of goodwill.

[Dct]

I thought he was on RAP TIVA. The steroids aren't needed anymore. It's a lot more important, that's why he looked like a drooling thing and like he's dying. The last six months he improved all of it, so we have to give him some disease?

[LogicalSC]

Dr. Valerie:
I suspect you are insane and the "operation room" you are refering to has alot of padded walls to keep the "doctors" from hurting themselves.

[Dct]

I thought he was on RAP TIVA. The steroids aren't needed anymore. It's a lot more important, that's why he looked like a drooling thing and like he's dying. The last six months he improved all of it, so we have to give him some disease?

[WAHOO WILLIE]

"As for the likeness to MLK, I don't recall any remarks from the Messiah about judging someone by the content of their character."

I was going to let that one slip. While I will give Obie credit for his speaking abilities,there is no comparison on many levels to MLK, sorry. Just an opinion, but I think Dr. King would not be that happy with the results of the struggle he died for today.

[wjo]

Dr. Valerie:

When did Chicago become part of the South? Its news to us in the South.

As for the likeness to MLK, I don't recall any remarks from the Messiah about judging someone by the content of their character....but there I go being "divisive".

[WAHOO WILLIE]

"His pastors comments are typical of all black churchesin the South."

Except Wright's church is in Chicago (Southside I guess)and I'm not sure I would say the statements are "typical" if my experience were limited to one church.

[WAHOO WILLIE]

"Awsk to see a list of McCain's meds. He's been on aricept for a year."

No HiPPA law where you live there 'doctor'? Nice, reeeeal professional.

[Dr Valerie]

I thought his speech was incredible! My husband is African American and I'm Jewish. We both are Republicans who were going to vote for McCain, until yesterday. His pastors comments are typical of all black churchesin the South. Exactly like the one my husband and I attend. Hearing Mr obama was like listening to MLK! he was unbelievable. We played it over and over again in surgical waiting room and convinced most of the families that were there to vote for Obama. He's exciting in a way that Mr McCain is showing his dementia. Awsk to see a list of McCain's meds. He's been on aricept for a year. An intern in his MD's office is speaking out of school (and saving this country from a demented madman). Check it out, it should horrify any american!!

[WAHOO WILLIE]

"labeling Obama as a stealth-racist and the affirmative action candidate, after bashing him for drug use and calling him uneducated and inexperience, after smearing his wife and his pastor as racists and demeaning him for winning too many votes in the black community,"

Lest we forget, the first we heard of "not being black enough" came from Al Sharpton, "under-educated and inexperienced came from the Clinton campaign as did the "leak" about his wife telling women to eschew education for 'service' jobs. It was MO that said, and it's on video, that she had never been proud of her country until now. If you dont think Wright is a bigot, you're an idiot. I gave him a pass until I heard more from him, he's a seperatist,bigot period. The winning "too many votes" is also a Clinton complaint. Only a few of these opinions have been shared and fewer voiced by anyone on the right until the reverend thing came out.

[retire05]

IslamoLlama, please, since you seem to think that I was talking about a case that appeared before the SCOTUS, provide the case. Name such as Row vs. Wade, et al. Or are you, as ususal, trying to blow smoke through your hat?

Obviously your time spent at DailyKos is not very educational as you did not know the case I was referring to.

Why don't you try to learn instead of just being programmed?

You would make Gramsci proud.

[WAHOO WILLIE]

"It's a perfect Catch-22 that conservatives are more than happy to overlook while a Republican is in office."

Well, they overlooked Clinton doing it as well, so I'd say it's fair.

[cornandponemixed]

But, my dear Mr. Llama, you merely suspect that "they" are after you. From what I have seen of your comments, none one as uninteresting as you would be suspected of doing anything but shooting off his big mouth and spewing utter nonsense. Why would anyone in government want to listen to that?

[chris]

Clearly the diseased, tortured elderly candidate is poised for victory. America wants to reward the GOP for a successful war and a great economy.

Look, here are 2 McCain supporters right here

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2008/0318083forehead1.html

[IslamoLlama]

"-- Now, since the ACLU has tried to prove that normal Americans have been wiretapped, their case was so faulty that even a liberal judge had to throw it out. But if you think you have been wiretapped, please provide proof of that and then sue. --"

Wow, such bullshit. The SCOTUS shot down the ACLU's push to sue for wiretapping. But since the SCOTUS is now "a liberal judge", I'll just assume you don't know wtf you're talking about.

You can't provide "proof" that you've been wiretapped because its a "state secret". And you can't sue to have the executive branch turn over the information because you have no proof you've been wiretapped. It's a perfect Catch-22 that conservatives are more than happy to overlook while a Republican is in office.

But Hillary wants to ride in on a black helicopter and take your guns.

[whiteandblackmixed]

jharp wrote:
"Now Obama isn't qualified to be President because he had too nice of a tricycle".

So, Senator Obama's pretty little trycycle is now an indicator of not being black enough, because all black people are disadvantaged and therefore don't typically get to ride trycycles that look better than whites. God help us all. There is hope however. We could fund a trycycle study between now and November. Because of the urgency in this matter have the Bush administration once more suspend the Davis-Bacon act, give the contract to Halliburton to conduct the study and imagine how grateful the nation would be to have this critical information factor into making up their minds. Forget the war, the economy all all the other nonsense. Lets just focus on what's really important: taking down a trycycle.

[Fred Beloit]

retire05, of course the "nitwit" in my comment above is Ms nowingker, AKA IslamoLlama, lest anyone be confused.

[Fred Beloit]

This nitwit says: "...nothing would be too wicked for you to forgive... if only he were a Republican."

I don't remember anyone here defending Craig or forgiving him, for example. Personally, I said he didn't appear to have done anything illegal. I still say the same. The police seem to have gay-bashed him and the media slow-boated him hahaha. If Moe had any principles at all, she would have agreed. His constituents had the right to kick him out of office if they chose. Just like Barney (I employ my hos) Frank.

He's still there in Congress? Oh.

[retire05]

IslamoLlama, do you really have "left wing taking point" stamped on your forehead as rumored? Or are you just so programmed that you know no other way? And while ScrapIron may not be the best speller or the best typist, you certainly are not the most rational thinking person to have ever posted a response here.

May I remind you that Republicans don't seem to circle the wagons over those who they think have distanced themselves from the values we subscribe to. From David Vitter, who WAS a rising star to Larry Craig, Republicans stay away from them like a city with the plague. On the other hand, the mayor of New York just resigned from office for his association with a hooker ring only to have the new mayor admit after his swearing in that he, too, along with his wife, are guilty of infidelity. Not exactly a stellar track record for New York Governors, is it? The Democrats demanded that, although he has never been convicted on any of the charges, DeLay resign. So he did, in the best interest of the party and the nation. Meanwhile, William Jefferson, protects his freezer and his seat by saying he is being presecuted by racists.

Now, since the ACLU has tried to prove that normal Americans have been wiretapped, their case was so faulty that even a liberal judge had to throw it out. But if you think you have been wiretapped, please provide proof of that and then sue.

God, do you on the left ever get tired of being shown up for the fools you are?

Obama is, in no way, connective with the strife that has been experienced by black Americans. He was born middleclass, attended a expensive prep school in Hawaii, is the recipriant of not one, but two, degress from universities that most Americans can only dream of sending their children to, his wife has been earning a six figure income for more than four years, they live in a $1.65 million home and somehow, he is representative of most black Americans?

What he is representative of though, is Chicago style politics. And that ain't purty. And if anyone tries to point that out, they are labeled racist and dismissed as right wing whackos by you and your ilk.

You will damn anyone who speaks against the race baiting, hate mongering Rev. Wright yet seem to have no problem attaching labels to the Republican candidate. I don't think that you meant the adjectives "oldest, whitest, manliest, most senile SOB" as a compliment.

Why do I think that if we were to check your night stand we would not find a Gideon Bible but the Communist Manifesto instead?

[Fred Beloit]

By God this slobbering ape IslamoLlama is none other than the dear-departed nowingker. I'd stake my life on it. Note the use of the severely silly moniker and the outrageously distorted perception of reality on display.

"If Barack Obama was a Republican you wouldn't have two bad things to say about him. He could sleep with prostitutes, verbally molest underage boys, break every law under the sun - from snorting cocaine with Bush to draft dodging with Cheney, from wiretapping your phones and reading your emails to handing out billions of dollars in contracts to industrial buddies without them ever having to make a bid, murder, torture, pillage, skip Church on Easter Sunday - nothing would be too wicked for you to forgive... if only he were a Republican."

[Fred Beloit]

"I do appreciate how, after repeatedly labeling Obama as a stealth-racist and the affirmative action candidate, after bashing him for drug use and calling him uneducated and inexperience, after smearing his wife and his pastor as racists and demeaning him for winning too many votes in the black community, you can turn around and proclaim, "Why does Obama always have to make it about race?" when he addresses your concerns."

You forgot something, though, Moe. You forgot to fill in some names in connection with the accused second person plurals you have so generously provided. I did recognize one by implication, a Ms Ferraro(D) by name:"...labeling Obama as...the affirmative action candidate..." You will bite any hand, bear any burden, to muck up a simple issue and smear an entire class of people. Nice going.

[wjo]

It is an article of faith among the Left that the only way conservatives win elections is marketing to the lowest common denominator. Conservatives are said to talk in "code words" to appeal to latent racism in America. No electoral victory is legitimate. Conservativism is only successful where it creates false consciousness and people are opiated from knowing their class interests.

In the speech, Obama has basically said that the "Reagan coalition" was racist and ergo, illegitimate. This follows along the Charlie Rangel line that cutting taxes is racist.

Of course, the balm for racism is more government. That is how the "racial stalemate" ends. The statists get to "win". We all get to be united behind the great Savior who shall heal us through an enlarged Department of Education.

Bunk, but red meat to those Leftists who still believe that government can transform the "system". It will do nothing to reform the hearts of those who hate.

[Fred Beloit]

Thanks, Moe. The long lists of baseless charges must be back in fashion. You will soon receive an A from your professor of Classical Propaganda Techniques 102 for your paper titled "The Stale and the Worn, Always Effective (Sans Footnotes)". Congratulations.

[IslamoLlama]

Spelling not your strongest suite, eh Scrapiron?

I do appreciate how, after repeatedly labeling Obama as a stealth-racist and the affirmative action candidate, after bashing him for drug use and calling him uneducated and inexperience, after smearing his wife and his pastor as racists and demeaning him for winning too many votes in the black community, you can turn around and proclaim, "Why does Obama always have to make it about race?" when he addresses your concerns.

What an absolute load of bull. This has nothing to do with his race. Or his class. Or his policies. This has everything to do with the little (D) after his name. This is politics, in its most raw and meaningless form. Gingrich style tribal hate.

If Barack Obama was a Republican you wouldn't have two bad things to say about him. He could sleep with prostitutes, verbally molest underage boys, break every law under the sun - from snorting cocaine with Bush to draft dodging with Cheney, from wiretapping your phones and reading your emails to handing out billions of dollars in contracts to industrial buddies without them ever having to make a bid, murder, torture, pillage, skip Church on Easter Sunday - nothing would be too wicked for you to forgive... if only he were a Republican.

Were it Colin Powell running, or Condi Rice, we would never hear the end of how racist and hateful left-wing Americans have become in their refusal to support the Republican pick for President. Where it Kay Baley Huchinson or Liddy Dole, the endless waves of accusation of left wing misogyny would deafen the public. Thankfully, the GOP won't have to stoop to that level of hypocrisy this election cycle because they've selected the oldest, whitest, manliest, most senile SOB they could find. Instead, they get to call black people racists and label white women lesbian femi-nazis for one more year.

[syn]

What a sweet picture of a happy child. I think Obama has a good soul and perhaps if he had been influenced as a young man by such mentors as Thomas Sowell or Clarence Thomas then he might not be left in the position of justifying racism in order to promote socialism.

Hey it took 9/11 and 40 years for me to discover one who David Mamet himself considers one of America's greatest philosophers so maybe Obama still has time.

Obama is a good man however, his mistake was buying into horrid totalitarian ideals.

Obama is the result of what a collectivist Harvard Law School degree does to people.

[IslamoLlama]

Here, Dan.
Look. Funny.
http://www.theonion.com/content/news/black_guy_asks_nation_for_change
Learn it. Love it. Live it.

Then maybe you can try your comic styling again.

[Scrapiron]

Thousands of words in a speach to say, 'Revrund Wright is a racist, anti-american a-hole and I learned it from him'. Actually if you check the Revrund Wrights education background it confirms the connection of Hussein and the Revrund to Islam. Major study in advanced degree concentrated on Islam... Now you can understand the hate whitey speach.

[jharp]

This blog is really something else.

Now Obama isn't qualified to be President because he had too nice of a tricycle.

Someone need to put the bong away and keep in put away.

[WAHOO WILLIE]

"They're as diverse as white churches. Are you suggesting they are all like Wright's?"

No I am certainly not suggesting that anymore than I would suggest that *all* blacks secretly hate whites. In fact, the speech from Wright and from this preacher Limbo has cuts of are quite different. I was pointing out how surprised many people seem to be about the political speech that goes on in some "black" churches. We are getting only the fire brand rhetoric and having it edited to make a point that is not quite accurate.I mentioned that Limbo edits oout what the Harlem preacher actually says about Clinton and incorrectly calls the man a Clinton supporter. Thus my statement to "Listen closely my fellow honkies, you may end up learning a thing or two."

[Dan Riehl]

"getting educated"

Not sure what you're talking about WW. There were black churches in my neighborhood growing up. They're as diverse as white churches. Are you suggesting they are all like Wright's? Because you would be wrong. The competing strains of thought and religion in black america break down along class lines, more than color lines. Wright and his ilk preach poison to the impoverished as much as anything else. And the Obama's of the world attend for different reasons, but know better. The ultimate victims of this victimilogy are the poor and un-educated. That ain't exactly Obama, in case you haven't noticed. You'd think he himself would be preaching hope from Wright's pulpit, but so far as we know, he's never done that. Allowing Wright to be something of a barker for the Obama show in CHicago.

[WAHOO WILLIE]

Wow, some of you crackers are really getting educated about the goings on in The Black Church aren't you? Flippin' hilarious haw many white folks thought 'church' was like a Cuba Gooding movie where the happy colored folk sing and dance. Limbo has some cuts from a Harlem preacher who has little nice to say about Obie and his "white trash mother". He has little good to say about Clinton too but Limbo edited most of that out so to claim that the rev is a Clintonista. Listen closely my fellow honkies, you may end up learning a thing or two.

[Hope Muntz]

Disagree. This is his American Idol moment. It's now or never for him. Polticians, if I may paraphrase Woody Allen, are like sharks--when they stop moving forward, they die. In Philly yesterday Obama banged his head on the glass wall of the tank. Unfair, sure--but Obama didn't have to run as a black candidate--he had options lots of African-Americans don't have. As you pointed out.