Vick Allegations Ugly And Serious

via ESPN - Michael Vick may not ever play Pro Football again even if not convicted given what the trial will do to his image. And if he's guilty of this, he'll do serious time and should. I'm guessing there will be some co-operating witnesses with this stuff and Vick's Counsel will look to discredit them. Ugly crime, ugly trial - ugly business, dogfighting.

The government's case includes evidence that Vick and his cohorts "tested" pit bulls for ferocity. If the dogs failed the test, the indictment charges, they were executed by hanging or drowning. In one case, with Vick present, the indictment says a dog was slammed to the ground until it was dead. In another incident, a dog was soaked with a hose, then electrocuted. Those aren't the sort of transgressions that lead to probation and community service. It's the kind of behavior that results in punishment, and the punishment will be jail time.

Comments

[nowingker]

Couldn't happen to a more deserving guy.

Michael Vick is going to find out that federal prosecutors do not f**k around, don't take bribes, don't get intimidated by the race card or look the other way for some seasoned tickets to the Falcons, I may be wrong but I think the Feds win over 90% of their cases...

What a sick freak, too bad the NFL can't demand all his millions back, he also sucks as a quarterback.

[southdakotaboy]

I hope they put this guy away for the maximum and take as much of his money as possible. These sick freaks also use bait dogs to train the pitbulls. For those of you who don't know what a bait dog is it is rather sick. A bait dog is ussally some smaller pet type dog, they will take it and wire it's mouth shut and then turn the pitbull loose on it until it is dead.

[nowingker]

The whole dog fighting thing gives 'sub human' a new meaning, I've read they also STEAL people's pets to use as bait...pet dogs and cats given to the fighting dogs as a reward.

Souless is all I can say. What I wonder does it say about our society that Michael Vick has 'allegedly' been running a multi state dog ring for SIX years, meaning dozens if not hundreds of people had to know about his involvement, all the time racking up millions in endorsements and millions from his ridiculous deal w/the Falcons.

What does that say about us? about Nike? about the NFL?

Anything goes as long as you can keep it quiet and make money, even eletrocuting your own dog??

[seekeronos]

No. What this man needs to have happen to him is for him to be beaten within inches of his life, and for his riches and homes and boats and all other wealth - including royalties from endorsements and other deals - to be confiscated, liquified, and assigned to the ASPCA and other animal welfare groups.

Then let him try to find work as a commoner with that under his belt.

[nowingker]

I hate myself for it, but what he really deserves is to go a few rounds with some of the pit bulls he 'trained' for fighting, if he loses, he gets the same treatment he gave them: electrocution, shooting, drowning or thrown to the floor until he's dead.

[seekeronos]

I almost said the same thing... after all, if someone acts like something worse than an animal, the least he deserves is to be treated accordingly.

However, since he has not taken a human life, I don't see the need for the death penalty. Just severe humiliation and deprivation of his wealth would make me see that justice was done.

[IslamoLlama]

Hey, don't worry. I hear Bush is a Falcon's fan, so Vick might be able to squeeze a pardon out if he makes the right political contributions.

[nowingker]

I know you like to make fun of PETA and animal rights activists, but aren't 'christians' supposed to treat all of god's creatures with respect and care?

It's one thing to contemplate people raised in the slums of Calcutta, Mexico City or Baghdad easily engaging in any number of uncivilized and barbaric acts...most people in the Third World live lives of poverty, w/few chances and little eduacation.

This guy is an American, a millionaire, a sports 'hero' who grew up in VIRGINIA, not South Africa, not the Occupied Territories not Pakistan, since the day he was able to throw a football he has never been denied anything, indeed, he's had the keys to the kingdom.

This is the result? Dog fighting for fun? Killing his own dogs?

I've said it before, I say it again: America is doomed, we have lost all sense of proportion, morality [even my secular humanism brand], values, responsibility, judgement. Everything. DOOOMED.

[flyme1123]

I wonder if Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton will defend this scum

[nowingker]

Looks like, no

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/13706834/detail.html

Al may figure once in a while its best to be on the side of the majority of Americans, who don't cotton to eltrocuting dogs who won't fight, interesting that Russel Simons also signed onto the letter.

Could be some people in the black community are waking up that protecting thugs and criminals is counter productive and boomerangs right back on them, probably wishful thinking though.

[Phoenix]

You took my punishment, Nowinger. Nothing could be better except I wouldn't want him killed. Just kept in a cage and brought out periodically to fight some mean-assed dog. Feed him dog food, too.

Your last sentence: Oh, man... with my fingers crossed. I agree we're doomed when we elevate riff raff to hero status just because they can throw a ball.

[southdakotaboy]

nowingker it is one thing to disagree with PETA's claim that animals are equal to people and poking fun at some of their more harmless stunts (running of the nudes springs to mind). It is a totally different kettle of fish to tolerate dog fighting, cock fighting (still legal in Lousianna as far as I know) and Spanish style bull fighting.

[nowingker]

How great would that be? Keeping him in a cage, though I think the authentic punishment is tied to a car axel on a 5 foot chain, and eating dog food!

Mr. Vick has an intereesting dilemma. He's guilty, obviously, too much detail in the indictment, too many dates over too long a time and that's just the indictment itself, also, please note, nobody even knew it had been presented to a federal grand jury, no leaks, no grandstanding. Sounds serious to me.

So, Mikey can either (a) plead guilty to stay out of jail, get suspended or kicked out of the NFL and lose all possibility of any future endorsements or (b) plead not guilty and hope he can beat the charges, if he is acquitted he claims innocence, railroading, racism and goes on as an NFL player minus all endorsements but Nike, if he loses he goes to prison.

What to do? Dick Cheney's chief of staff, guilty/sentence to prison. Martha Stewart, billionaire? guilty/sentenced to prison, Conrad Black, guilty, the list is long and full of rich white people who more or less broke some legal rules to make money or gain power. Not a dog killer in the bunch.

Given how stupid he apparently is, he will probably risk all, go to trial, claim racism and then go to prison. We can only hope.

[Ted]

Racism some will call out but it's not gonna work because Vick is not part of the human race! He is an evil being!
Ted

[Fred Beloit]

Well, FB, don't you have anything to say?" No, I don't have a dog in this fight.

[seekeronos]

"--
I know you like to make fun of PETA and animal rights activists, but aren't 'christians' supposed to treat all of god's creatures with respect and care? It's one thing to contemplate people raised in the slums of Calcutta...
--"

I poke fun of PETA when they try to put animal rights on the same level as, or higher than, humans. Or as SBD said, that whole nude thing they've taken too. Or tossing red dye/paint onto frumpy old ladies wearing mink coats. And, so sorry, but I like my veal, chicken, deer, elk, beef, pork ribs, and fried rattlesnake and all other kinds of meat and fish. With BBQ sauce even. That in itself is enough to put me off of PETA's vegenazi approach to a lot of things.

It's sorta like those holy cows in India: You can go into a store to by some curry, and there is one of those cows mooching at the produce and dumping cow patties on the floor. And the locals won't lift a finger to shoo St. Bessie away from the greens.

While the cultic veneration of certain animals is one thing (idolatry), but when it becomes a public health issue, the rights of the human should prevail: that is why we have zoning laws in the USA regarding what kinds of animals can be kept on what kinds of property.

Concerning what the Bible says - I won't go all chapter and verse here, but the gist is that man was given _stewardship_ over the earth, and this includes the animals God created. Take care of them, use them for food, clothing, and for draft (work animals) - but to torture and abuse them is certainly not of God.

"--
...Mexico City or Baghdad easily engaging in any number of uncivilized and barbaric acts...most people in the Third World live lives of poverty, w/few chances and little education.

This guy is an American, a millionaire, a sports 'hero' who grew up in VIRGINIA, not South Africa, not the Occupied Territories not Pakistan, since the day he was able to throw a football he has never been denied anything, indeed, he's had the keys to the kingdom.
--"

A person's place of origin or place in the social order does not negate his responsibility to treat other creatures humanely. However, the fact that Vicks was a role model (by virtue of being a pampered football hero) - he is certainly without excuse.

"--
This is the result? Dog fighting for fun? Killing his own dogs?

I've said it before, I say it again: America is doomed, we have lost all sense of proportion, morality [even my secular humanism brand], values, responsibility, judgement. Everything. DOOOMED.
--"

In this, you are 120% correct. We are doomed because we are trapped in our own depravity. The heart of man is wicked beyond all compare:

"The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?" (Jeremiah 17:9, KJV)

This, Nowingker, is the heart of man without Christ. It has been my heart, and your heart, and all who walk this earth. And without Christ, there is little that separates us from the same sort of depravity that has overtaken Vick's life, and that of those two 15-year old girls who burned a small kitten (which Dan posted on recently).

Vicks might also want to check out verse 11 of the same chapter:

"As the partridge sitteth on eggs, and hatcheth them not; so he that getteth riches, and not by right, shall leave them in the midst of his days, and at his end shall be a fool." (Jeremiah 17:11, KJV)

[nowingker]

I don't have Christ in my heart, what prevents me from torturing animals?

I do believe we are trapped in our own depravity and I no longer believe that humans are naturally 'good'...the vast majority of us are naturally selfish, greedy, cowardly, bestial. But, I don't think we need Christ, we need the wisdom and the values that the best of humanity has produced to be drilled into the average person from childhood on to keep down the natural impulse toward violence/hate/greed and give us something to aspire to.

[seekeronos]

"--
I don't have Christ in my heart, what prevents me from torturing animals?
--"

Well, nothing really... aside from a set of morals and teachings you may have received which helps create a sense of right and wrong. But though you might treat animals with kindness and mercy, would you deny that you have sinned in some other area, in thought, or in word, or in deed?

No ammount of moral instruction and indoctrination -- or brainwashing, if you will... will guaranteed heartfelt complaiance with "the rules". The ancient nation of Israel from the Old Testament is proof of that: they had the perfect Law, they had the testimonies of the Lord, they had the Levitical Preisthood and all of the oracles of God, and yet they still fell into the same vanities and idolatries -- and worse -- as the pagan nations that surrounded them.

You see, we have had from the days of Noah and Hammurabi, from the dawn of civilization itself, to iron out those things and to have arrived at some functional utopian vision that simply cannot - will not - work as long as the wicked, evil, disgusting, depraved, utterly debased, sinful human heart is the power behind it all.

Over 6,000 years of written history, and we still cannot pull it together as a species. Even the most benign despot is still a tyrant, and at best, we are become a tyranny of the people, if we have allowed our depravity to uproot our most noble values (derived - like it or not - from Christian interpretations of Greek and Roman principles).

And even if we do manage some sort of secular humanist utopia, it will not be a one that any American would have a part in. There was a science fiction series by Larry Niven produced some years ago that posited a human world where folks were surgically and chemically altered to have nice thoughts all the time, and everyone was monitored by a sort of "thought police" - anyone who exhibited the slightest tendency toward violence was effectively lobotomized by the intelligentsia of that society.

Perhaps with science and technology being what it is, such a dreadful future might be within reach - but then again, who would be watching the watchers, to see that the masses weren't reduced to a cattle-like status of serfdom?

However, you do need Christ, both in this life, and in the life to come. We need Christ to dwell in our hearts every day to transform our wicked hearts by the renewing of His words, by the working of his Holy Spirit within us and through us, and most of all, the redemption of His precious shed blood which has cleansed us from all sins.

[bill romanowsky]

Hopefully we will start to realize that this hip hop culture is part of the downfall of america, and its not just black people, there are some stupid ass white kids that think they are black too. Just listen to their violent, jungle jive music, its disgusting crap, its promotes criminals, come on america lets wake up, F#ck the hip hop, rap culture.