Why We Fight

No, not in Iraq. But at home.

Why do we fight? We fight because civilization collapses when large numbers of people are lulled into believing that the safety of tradition, and the rule of a few guardians of tradition, will save them from annihilation in the face of vast changes set to destroy them. We fight because the imperfections of democracy allow room for dissent with the status quo and the directives of a few.

Comments

[Zifnab]

"With regard to Iraq, I believed in 2003 and believe now that Saddam Hussein transferred the bulk of his WMD development program to Libya a few years before the US invasion. So, whether or not ongoing investigation turns up the existence of WMD in Iraq at the time of the invasion, I think it's splitting hairs to argue that Hussein had abandoned the quest for a WMD program in Iraq by the time the US invaded. I believe that Hussein's regime needed to be ended because he would not have been content to only challenge Israel and Iran with the possession of a nuclear weapon."

So we fight because Iraq had WMDs?
Are we still running with that line, Dan? Really?
...
...
Really?

[yyy]

It's hysterical, isn't it. Even Cheney has given up on WMD!

The whole premise makes no sense...Saddam sent his WMD to Libya several years before we invaded, well then why didn't he let the UN inspectorws into the country? And why didn't he get his WMD back from Libya before we attacked him? And why, if his WMD had been in Libya for several years did no one know it.

Surely if we had known Saddam's WMD were in Libya we would have invaded Libya as well or instead of Iraq.

UNBELIEVABLE NONSENSE.

[Andrew]

Cheney? Did someone mention the vice-Decider? Who knew that he could even feel pain.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/03/20/cheney.hospital.ap/index.html

[southdakotaboy]

Those on the left always give the basest motives for those on the right. If the right was as evil as the left makes it out to be many of these commentors on this blog would be in jail or have dissapeared. The reason so many on the right distrust and dislike the left is that we see the absolute double standard that they allow. The left screams bloody murder about the right not wanting to allow gay marriage but will make excuses for radical muslims here in the US. Those same muslims that would stone every gay man and women to death. The left always talks about freedom of speach but are happy to enforce speach codes on campuses to silence those who they disagree with. When I look at the left I don't see people trying to make the world a better place, I see people who wish to destroy this country. Instead of saying that America should change why don't they take a look at all those third world crap holes and tell them to be like us.

[yyy]

I'm afraid I don't get the connection between gay marriage and radical muslims, other than the fact that the right wants to force everyone...gays, muslims, agnostics...to live by their religious morality.

I don't care if gays marry and I don't care what muslims say or do as long as they don't break any laws.

The reason you think 'the left' wishes to destroy this country is because you do not understand or appreciate the values on which this country was founded.

As far as speech codes on campuses,not sure what you are referring to. I myself am not a big fan of 'hate speech' laws or 'hate crime' laws, but universities are within their rights to establish codes of conduct whatever they may be.

I dare you to find anyone at an American university who was ousted from college for any kind of hate speech.

[LOL]

University students don't have full rights on campus. Their dorm rooms can be searched without consent or probably cause for example. And yeah what you say on campus, on some campuses, is probably not as free as what you can say off campus. I'm sorry that you just discovered this, but it's been that way for decades.

However recently many conservatives have pushed for outing liberal professors and firing them if they get too liberal for their tastes. Effectively wanting to silence their opposition. (Though I myself have never had this problem. Extremely liberal profs yes, but none of them would ever fail you for being a conservative. Then again, a key part of modern conservatism seems to be incompetence...)

[yyy]

I have to agree with the conservatives on this one, speech codes that restrict free speech in the name of diversity or political correctness are wrong. Most of them have not withstood legal scrutiny and for good reason.

My understanding is the rule for prohibited speech is still the yelling fire in the theater.

There is a difference between a truly hostile atmosphere and dumb frat party gags or individuals hurling insults. One college specifically prohibited putting up the Confederate flag on their door. Sorry, that is way, way, way over the top.

Freedom of speech is what it is, the law has to protect speech that is unpopular even hateful and discriminatory or it isn't worth the paper it is written on.

[Zifnab]

Bush graduated from Havard with a stellar GPA all in the face of the brutish horror of the intensely liberal Ivy League. Clearly, Bush's mainstream conservative values were met with nothing but praise and admiration by his Harvard professors.

[Hard Right]

Way to show your BDS, lefties.

[Hard Right]

We saw how the left loves America and supports the troops on sat.

[brad]

You mean by protesting the actions of the Cheney admin, Hard Right?
I'd say we more accurately saw how the right loathes free speech, and likes to pretend it has more support than it does.

[Hard Right]

"You mean by protesting the actions of the Cheney admin, Hard Right?
I'd say we more accurately saw how the right loathes free speech, and likes to pretend it has more support than it does."

Another delusional leftist who thinks burning an American soldier in effigy, and holding a sign that says "F--- the Troops" is supporting them. BTW, where did I say they they didn't have a right to march? Nowhere you moron.

[yyy]

Who burned an American soldier in effigy?

[brad]

You know, it's funny how poorly you take being challenged, Hard Right. I bet you're a ton of fun in person.
I said "the right" not "you". And I flat out don't believe you that a soldier was burned in effigy. Know why? The left doesn't blame the troops. That's just something you right wingers pull out of your asses to try and slander anyone who's against this war.
You know, cause you have no real responses to those opposed to an unnecessary war we were lied into. Saying we hated the troops 4 years ago, when most of these protesters weren't alive might work when preaching to the converted in online echo chambers, but in reality, people know you're full of shit.
For example, notice all the Iraq vets in Congress are Dems. Must really irk you, eh?

[brad]

Missing a zero there. I meant 40 years ago, referring to vietnam.

[Legalize]

"Who burned an American soldier in effigy?"

Some 17 year old brat. Wingers like Limpy think that (a) you are that guy no matter what, and (b) even if you are not that guy, the mere ffact that it happened means that all "lefties" support it, and (c) that disagreeing with the war and Bush means that you hate America. Limpy's style of "debate" is injecting as many logical fallacies as possible into any given dispute and claiming victory.

[yyy]

I can only come again with the statement that these are the most serious hypocrites I've ever seen.

Anything done by Republicans that is illegal or immoral is an isolated incident or 'bad apples' or whatever, but ANYONE who they think is a liberal does something stupid and it's all liberals, etc. etc.

I support the troops. The 'troops' didn't decide to invade Iraq and neither did the generals, its more than a little troubling that the generals appear to have completely rolled over and abdicated just about all the decision making to the neocons, though I suppose it is part of their mindset to follow orders, even ones that are clearly stupid, and not to publicly complain. They may have also under estimated the debacle and figured they could wait out the Rumsfeld era.

I also support the military, within reason. There is no denying history shows that a strong military works as a real, true, legitimate deterrent. We need a stong, well armed high tech military. I don't support crazy, trillion dollar weapons that don't work, or lowering standards to meet quotas or the terrible record DOD has regarding rape and sexual assault of female soldiers.

I don't support the invasion of Iraq. Not for the first, second or third round of reasons given. Not to free the Iraqi people, foster democracy or protect Israel. It was a very bad strategy that relied on bad data and seriously flawed assumptions and was executed so poorly it is hard to believe we are talking about the United States and not Zaire or Latvia managing the 'war'

Support the troops, not the war. It is pretty straightforward.

[Zifnab]

"Wingers like Limpy think that (a) you are that guy no matter what, and (b) even if you are not that guy, the mere ffact that it happened means that all "lefties" support it, and (c) that disagreeing with the war and Bush means that you hate America."

He also thinks he's got a .50 cal in his closet with your name on it and that one day, when the time is right, wingers across the nation will rise up in armed revolt and slaughter their liberal oppressors.

Then he calles liberals Nazis.

Cause, you know, why not.

[Hard Right]

Keep crying lefties. I've handed you your asses repeatedly. That's why you always try to bring up some other subject when you're losing.

BTW, maybe you lefties get painted with the same brush because YOU SUPPORT AND PROTECT THE PEOPLE WHO COMMIT SUCH REPUSLIVE ACTS. The Reps toss bad apples.

[Hard Right]

"..style of "debate" is injecting as many logical fallacies as possible into any given dispute..."

Actually, that's your method. Because you're unable to beat me in a debate you claim I'm "cheating" You are pathetic. Then again, you are a lawyer.

"He also thinks he's got a .50 cal in his closet with your name on it and that one day, when the time is right, wingers across the nation will rise up in armed revolt and slaughter their liberal oppressors."

No. While that would be fun, you lefties are too cowardly to push things that far.

""Wingers like Limpy think that (a) you are that guy no matter what..."

Considering your statements here you leftwing fascists are very much like him. You don't support the troops as you have proven.

"...(b) even if you are not that guy, the mere ffact that it happened means that all "lefties" support it, and (c) that disagreeing with the war and Bush means that you hate America."

Again, the words of the leftwing trash here has shown they are very much like him. Disagreeing with Bush and your comments on the war further prove you hate America and troops. You see, I hold you to what you say. You don't get to say something like our troops are torturing captives at Gitmo then pretend you support our troops. In short, pointing out the truth about you makes you mad.

[Hard Right]

EDIT: Disagreeing with Bush isn't the issue. Your comments on the war...

[Hard Right]

One last thing, there is a reason you are called leftists. It's because you are anything but liberal. Real liberals at least support America and it's military. I've yet to see any of you do so.

[yyy]

I've handed you your asses repeatedly.
---------------------------------

Oy, you really are delusional.

[Zifnab]

"Pull out and declare victory" might be the strategy you use with your wife, HR, but in a debate it tends to come across as a bit flacid and weak.

[southdakotaboy]

Well at least Zifnab we can get it up to have sex.

[Zifnab]

:-p My penis is bigger than your penis :-p
Just check me out. I'm called the "Bulldog".
http://americablog.blogspot.com/USMCPT%20PHOTO%20GALLERY.pdf

[southdakotaboy]

Now I really had alot of good come backs and puns ready to go, but I think that in the cause of good taste I will not let it fly.

[Hard Right]

YYY, legalize, and Zif, I wear your hatred with pride. BTW, since you want to go there, your father should have pulled out. I feel for your sister/mother.

Also, if you're that same POS at Bulldog Says, it's additional proof of you being a raging moron.

http://www.bulldogsays.com/

[bloodrage bob]

i'm with ol' hard right on the desirability of being hated by halfwit liberal dolts. the ones too stupid to understand just how evil they really are, just how vile the soul-killing political philosophy they espouse really is. ("we need more government control! too much freedom is dangerous, and it frightens us!") you know: like the ones infesting the comments section of this otherwise fine blog.

ted nugent said it best: "i *like it* when the weenies protest against me. it proves i'm not one of 'em."

and for you liberal peabrains still whining about saddam's wmd's, 2 questions that you'll absolutely refuse to answer:

1) your "idea" of a proper, proportionate response to 9-11?
2) why hasn't there been another 9-11 on american soil?

[Bulldog]

WTF does my site have to do with this post, Hard Right?