Are We Not Christians? Are We Not Men?

I don't know, the men part of that is a quote from something I'm too tired to recall. Ah, Devo. Thank God for Google!

Thank God?? Can I say that here?

But beyond the shameless, shallow pandering by Goode is a revealed truth; that too often Republican politicians are using this “traditional values” theme to capitalize on some unimagined fear as in the case of Goode and his phantom Muslims. We also see other individual groups like gays targeted as somehow being in conflict with traditional American values – as if these values are practiced by people solely as a result of their religion, sexual orientation, ethnic heritage, or any other qualifier that a politician seeks to use to drive a wedge between us.

Rick Moran's criticism of Virgil Goode strikes me as unusually ham-fisted for him, as well as disjointed. He starts with Debbie Schussel, perhaps as he needed more than one individual upon which to focus his moral rage. But in going off as he does, I believe he misses the most important point in the discussion of a potential growing Muslim influence in America and her politics.

Founded, to a degree by Deists, or not - American tradition and the root of her social values is Judeo-Christian belief. That is a fact and no amount of protestation is going to change it. Though certainly a large influx of, say a Muslim or Hindu population most certainly would.

That said, whether or not one wishes to conclude such change would be for the better or the worse is a different matter. But certainly everyone is welcome to an opinion on that score. And for Virgil Goode to point to that reality as a fact is very far from a crime. For those who take pleasure, or perhaps even pride in America's Judeo-Christian foundation, any change in its profound influence may justifiably be cause for their concern.

I didn't see anything from Goode that talked about outlawing Islam. I didn't see anything suggesting Muslims should not be permitted to run for office. Actually, he was pointing out the exact opposite by suggesting that a significant increase in our Muslim population would very likely lead to an increase in Muslim politicians.

A few other items seem worth pointing out - Allah touches upon one here.

Here’s the clip. “All of us [Muslims] are steadfastly opposed to the same people he’s opposed to, which is the terrorists,” says Ellison of Goode, which is a wonderful sentiment but would be a lot more wonderful coming from someone who isn’t palsy walsy with CAIR.

Again, another truth. As is the notion that many Muslims currently in this country, though certainly not all, haven't exactly taken a strong public stand against Islamo-Fascism.

Still other groups, such as the flying Imams, have opted to take a very vocal and public stance in attempting to create a certain victimology around any new American-Muslim class. Consequently, it is only logical for some to ponder whether or not America needs a large influx of immigrants intent on playing the victim card while showing a certain lack of care when it comes to assimilation.

Whether or not Rick Moran is personally comfortable with the notion of a conversation in and around Muslim immigration being had isn't really of great concern for me. But the fact that America would likely benefit from an open discussion on the matter at this particular point in her history is. And while it certainly would be un-American to be thinking of passing laws which restrict any religion, it is far from un-American for her to consider regulation of her borders with an aim toward managing her demographics, assuming that is what a majority of current Americans wish to do.

I don't know if that's the case. But I know that if we never have the conversation, then America could easily stumble into some demographic mess she would prefer to not experience. Last time I looked there are many populations we restrict as regards permanent residence into this land. We turn back many Cubans every year, for example. And if we are to have any kind of policy on immigration from the Middle East, or anywhere else for that matter, then this discussion is one we should foster and not attempt to close down.

Comments

[Scott S]

I am sure that the same people who want to keep Muslims out of America are the same ones who would burn a cross in the yard of an African-American family that moves in next door.

And ask yourself this? Aren't we trying to mold the world into our image? Does that mean the rest of the world should ban Americans from their soil? That sure would disappoint the Mormons who - by the way - put their faith in some guy named Smith AND want everyone else to do so too. My God! We need to ban Utah-folks from the rest of USA! They will corrupt our Christian society!

Jesus would be so proud of you racist jerks.

[Jon Moore]

Virgil Goode is an unrepentant, racist twat who seems torn from the pages of some bad Klan movie. It's difficult to imagine his ilk managed to slip into the 21st century, given their obvious inbreeding.

[Crickets Chirping]

I hear me....

The more research you do, the more you find that virtually all of our founders detested Xianity...even Johnny Boy Adams

"This is a Christian nation"...you might try looking up the origin of that tripe...

[Tommy "Bringing Da" Paine]

Oh yea, I forgot to mention...

"The Christian system of religion is an outrage on common sense."

Read my book "AGE OF REASON" for more gems like the above...

[Tommy "Bringin Da" Paine]

“He who is the author of a war lets loose the whole contagion of hell and opens a vein that bleeds a nation to death”

All you cons got is name calling, eh?

We can all see how you hate our founders and our western, liberal values....

Joe Buck burns yall down. Ever read the "Original Pledge"? How about the Treaty of Tripoli?

As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquillity, of Mussulmen; and, as the said States never entered into any war, or act of hostility against any Mahometan nation, it is declared by the parties, that no pretext arising from religious opinions, shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries.

Kind of dismisses any argument you cons got...

[fiskhus jim]

George Bush is NOT a Christian, either.

You can always tell a hypoctritical, blaspheming criminal by comparing his actions to his words - and, although Our Lil Georgie is at great pains to always reassure us what a good Christian he is, his actions tell a different tale.

George Bush is clearly indifferent to notions of morality and law - in fact, his glee and delight at the suffering and even death of others makes it clear that Bush is NOT a Christian, but, instea, follows some other, darker path.

[Robert's Grandma]

Robert!

How dare you speak to me that way?! What a bad boy you are and I've written you out of the will. However, I might rethink that as you did reconcile the fact that you and this 'Riehl' person share the same genes. Now summon up your inner-bonobo and have some fun sex with Jane. Be sure to keep it down so Chimba and Cheetah don't hear you. Grandpa and I always waited for the kids to go to bed before we let the vines down.

Grandma

P.S. Which one of you is 'real'? Now grow up, son.

[robert lewis]

Sorry, Grandma - whatever the Celts are - they are NOT Germanic - the Celtic langages: Welsh, Gaelic, Breton, Cornish.

"there were no people in England that weren't on the European continent first. Keep that in mind, fool."

Well - Duh - Grandma - there were also no people in Europe that weren't in Afica first, ya stupid bitch. In any case - Riehl is a Kraut name - but Lewis sure ain't. So why dontcha shut it when you don't know what your'e talking about.

[FrickinPhilistine]

Mr. Buck,

>The weirdest thing is that conservative Christians agree with strict Muslims on so much: right down the line on social freedom issues, the fundamentalists of both faiths oppose liberals.<

I had to read this twice. Unless the MSM is hiding the stories, the Christian Fundies don't stone their daughters for talking to young men. I'm wondering, though..... anyone else but Fundies oppose liberals?

[Robert's Grandma]

Robert,

I told you to hush your mouth. No one knows the origin of the Celts, son. I've copied just a bit of their history for ya here. What you need to know, fer sure, son, is that there were no people in England that weren't on the European continent first. Keep that in mind, fool.

Grandma

>The Celts first burst into recorded history in the writings of the ancient Greeks and Romans in about 500 B.C. The great city-state civilization of Greece had been established centuries before by fair-skinned Nordic invaders from the north who had subdued and enslaved the Mediterranean aborigines. Already headed down the slippery slope of racial integration with their conquered subjects, and consequent ruin, the Greeks still maintained advanced standards of life and learning. They founded trading settlements in France, Italy, and Asia Minor, and even sailed out into the Atlantic, turning north to the British Isles and beyond.

The Greeks discovered that the area of central and northwestern Europe was dominated by a huge number of tribes who, although independent and often even at war with each other, possessed a common culture and common origins. They wrote the name by which these people referred to themselves as Keltoi and counted them, along with the closely related Scythians from the steppes of southern Russia, and the Persians and Libyans, as one of the four great barbarian peoples of the world. Among various reporters, the fifth century B.C. historian Herodotus recorded that the Celtic lands stretched from the headwaters of the Danube to all but the west coast of Iberia.

The Celts, then, were already a mighty and widespread people when they appear in recorded history. To trace their origins we must go back far into prehistory, where sometimes conflicting theories seek to make sense of the scattered evidence of archaeology.

Nora Chadwick, late professor of Anglo-Saxon at Cambridge and internationally renowned authority on the origins and customs of the Celtic peoples, in her book The Celts (1970) traces Celtic prehistory to the end of the third millennium B.C. The crucial evidence is the spread throughout east-central Europe--modern Hungary, Slovakia, the Czech Republic, and Austria--of a distinctive type of socketed axe head, often found in graves under distinctive circular barrows. Clearly weapons of war, these were first made of polished stone, but their makers were also quick to adopt the new science of bronze working which appeared in Slovakia and the Carpathians in the first half of the second millennium B.C.<

[robert lewis]

Sorry Grandma and Dan - Lewis is a Welsh (Celtic) surname

[Joe Buck]

Folks, God wasn't on the money until the 1950s. God also wasn't in the Pledge. That was all added in the McCarthy era.

Rep. Goode will take an oath swearing to uphold the Constitution. That document contains language forbidding any religious test for office. He should be asked if he plans to uphold that part of his oath.

The weirdest thing is that conservative Christians agree with strict Muslims on so much: right down the line on social freedom issues, the fundamentalists of both faiths oppose liberals.

[FrickinPhilistine]

Who cares what you call doing the right thing. Just do it.

Here's a great non-religious algorithm for values:

How do you tell the difference between good and evil? - You give it power. Your choice.

[LeftWingPharisee]

Speaking as an Orthodox Jew, let me say that "Judeo-Christian" is an oxymoron. Torah-based Judaism is very different from standard Christianity, despite Christianity adopting our Tanakh as part of their Bible. Actually, Islam is much closer to Torah-based Judaism than Christianity is.

FYI.

[Kim]

Do imigrants from Asia have Judeo-Christans values?

Does my athiest physics professor from Scotland have Judeo-Christans values?

I don't recall Jesus Christ (or unicorns for that matter) being mentioned in the Constitution.

[Phoenix]

Craig,

So, on a scale of 1-10 of supporting American values, Dan would get a 1? Maybe a 2?

Does that mean he fails being an American or just fails at being a moderate to conservative American?

[Phoenix]

What is a 'rightwing fucktard' anyway?

[craig]

"So, Craig....any chance it missed your cerebral cortex that the fact Dan lets you post this swill on his blog is an indication Dan holds dear at least one of our American values?"

I'm sorry, Phoenix, but the Constitution is not an a la carte menu. No picking and choosing. You either support all civil rights, or you don't support American values. No partial credit.

[anon]

Whenever I hear some rightwing fucktard talk about Judeo-Christian beliefs, I reach for my Uzi.

[Punditguy]

I'd like to think that benjoya's posts are satirical, but there's no telling. To all the conservatives out there: what he just said is pretty close to what we think you think.

[benjoya]

after all, the bible includes the story of our lord and savior. if the jews and muslims don't like it, then they can STFU cause the word of god reveals that jesus is the only way to heaven. i think of the hell-bound jews especially -- there are many of them in our government. if you can't swear on a book that proclaims jesus's divinity, then you're not a real american! thank you, rep. goode, for starting the purge!

[benjoya]

i think goode is right. jews and muslims should keep their faith to themselves.

[Dan Riehl]

Robert: That sounds like a Kraut name to me?

Ohhh, I better call the Council on American-Germanic Relations and file a complaint. Such hate speech froma guy with a faggy name, Bob. ; )

[Phoenix]

America hating? American blog? Dan, you wouldn't know an American value if it bit you in the ass.

Posted by: craig | Saturday, December 23, 2006 at 07:05 AM

So, Craig....any chance it missed your cerebral cortex that the fact Dan lets you post this swill on his blog is an indication Dan holds dear at least one of our American values?

[Robert's Grandma]

Robert,

Now you stop making fun of krauts. You are one, after all. Not only that, you are FRENCH.

Jesus H. Christ, son... keep your mouth shut.

[Robert's Grandma]

Main Entry: Nor·man
Pronunciation: 'nor-m&n
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Old French Normant, from Old Norse Northmann-, Northmathr Norseman, from northr north + mann-, mathr man; akin to Old English north north and to Old English man man
Date: 13th century
1 : a native or inhabitant of Normandy: a : one of the Scandinavian conquerors of Normandy in the 10th century b : one of the Norman-French conquerors of England in 1066
2 : NORMAN-FRENCH

[Robert's Grandma]

ROBERT
Gender: Masculine
Usage: English, French, Scandinavian, German, Czech, Polish, Russian, Slovene, Romanian
Other Scripts: ?????? (Russian)
Pronounced: RAH-burt (English), ro-BER (French), RO-bert (German), RAW-bert (Polish)   [key]
Means "bright fame", derived from the Germanic elements hrod "fame" and beraht "bright". The Normans introduced this name to Britain. It belonged to three kings of Scotland, including Robert the Bruce who restored the independence of Scotland from England in the 14th century. The author Robert Browning and poets Robert Burns and Robert Frost are famous literary bearers of this name. Also, Robert E. Lee was the commander of the Confederate army during the American Civil War.

LEWIS
Definition: Derived from the Germanic given name Lewis, meaning "reknowned, famous battle."
Surname Origin: English

Main Entry: [1]Ger·man·ic
Pronunciation: (")j&r-'ma-nik
Function: adjective
Date: 1633
1 : GERMAN
2 : of, relating to, or characteristic of the Germanic-speaking peoples
3 : of, relating to, or constituting Germanic

[robert lewis]

Riehl? That sounds like a Kraut name to me? How many World Wars did you Kraut bastards start? When did your family get here, Dan? My family got here in the early 1600's, and the last thing we waNTed was a bunch of bullet-headed Saxon idiots screwing up the Republic. Didn't those Kraut Hessians fight on the British side in the Revolutionary War? I say, make every asshole with a Kraut last name go back to the Fatherland!!!! America Uber Alles!!

[craig]

America hating? American blog? Dan, you wouldn't know an American value if it bit you in the ass.

[Dan Riehl]

What a bunch of lame asswipes. I'm not concerned with conversion because to do so would undermine our freedoms. And I never said the government was based upon religion, I said our culture is. And it was even more so before the securlar asswipes started deconstructing every valuable institution they could get their short-sighted rhetoric around.

I wouldn't abridge any American's rights because to do so would be wrong. I am a believer in the law, COnstotution and the Bill of Rights. But the freedoms we hold so dear do not extend to every resident of the world. And immigrants, be they white black red or brown, who would not be seen as a plus for America in mass can be disinvited from migrating here without violating a single canon of Constitutional law.

Now why don't you America hating bassturds crawl back under your rock. This is an American blog. I'd think you'd loath to be here and you most certainly don't deserve to be. If chit evber did get as bad in America as it is in Europe, the only plus is that the Islamo-fascists would take you sniveling, good for nothing losers out first.

[dorkafork]

"I didn't see anything suggesting Muslims should not be permitted to run for office. Actually, he was pointing out the exact opposite by suggesting that a significant increase in our Muslim population would very likely lead to an increase in Muslim politicians."

He pointed it out as a negative. How hard is that to see?

[Phoenix]

DEVO.

Dang. He's one serious dude. I'm dumping my Christmas poinsettia out and putting the pot on my head.

[robert lewis]

As one of the founders of DEVO, I resent your use of DEVO to prop up Christianity in your stupid blog. Islam is not the problem. Belief in ANY god is the problem. As long as a majority of folks on this planet believe in God, Allah, Yahweh, the Easter Bunny or the fucking tooth fairy the citizens of the planet will be doomed to the misery that ignorance and supersition bring to their wretched lives.

Riehl World, my ass.

[Devil's Advocate]

Who cares anyway about Goode's rantings? He is obviously a backward, shit-assed, degenerate, moron. He represents a constituency that is inbred therefore mentally impaired, stupid, ignorant, and degenerate.

Democracy has its pitfalls. The fact that people elected an ignorant moron like Goode is a perfect example.

[Sirkowski]

Well you sure as hell ain't a man, that's for sure.

A real man wouldn't be afraid to speak his mind and expose his true views. A real man wouldn't hide his racist and bigoted views behind a wishy-washy call for discussion.

Let's talk about it over a cup of coffee. Very effeminate.

[Devil's Advocate]

"...it's really about a redneck's ramblings."

Amen. You said it all. Goode is a dumb bigot.

Note that Ellison has responded to the xenophobic rants of Prager, Moore, and Goode, with grace and restraint, i.e., class.

[Punditguy]

"As if muslim conversions could ever come within an order of magnitude of the amount of muslims we let immigrate now."

Way to ignore the argument, along with the dozen other arguments that were made. If, like Goode, you fear that the total number of muslims in the United States will increase, why would you allow the number to increase at all?

[pjgoober]

Punditguy makes an asinine statement:
"1) If he's worried about Muslims in the U.S., is he also going to outlaw conversion? If not, then does he really care about the number of Muslims in the U.S.?"

As if muslim conversions could ever come within an order of magnitude of the amount of muslims we let immigrate now.

[Steel]

...I think that history pretty much proves that immigrants, regardless of where they come from or what they believe, adopt American mores and American values. And the nation does tend to secularize the assimilated...

Twice, this was not the case. Once preceding the Muslim conquest of much of the so-called 'modern' world over a thousand years ago and again, NOW.

Muslims are NOT assimilating in Europe.

They are burning it down.

Blowing it up.

And plotting even more mayhem.

However, while proponents of Islam were fairly tolerant in the first 'caliphate', they've shown no signs of being so this time, if they are successful.

Anyone who believes that Islam, as a majority, will tolerate anything other than Islam, is godamned fool and totally ignoring the evidence, the actual words and the violence to be found on the front pages of any newspaper, in any country on any day.

[jay k.]

the most important thing to keep in mind about goode and his statement is that, like so many conservative arguments, it ignores the facts.
how valid is your view if it depends upon factual errors and omissions, lies, hyperbole, and half-truths?
and what does it say about anyone who supports that (those) arguments?

[Phoenix]

I live in the shadow of Monticello and was once a member of WASH - Washington Area Secular Humanists. I quit when many in the group started caviling about removing ‘God’ from money and when they planned a protest march in DC. During the time I attended the weekly seminars, I was a privileged attendee to the varied speeches of religious leaders and atheists and physicists - to name a few. The one that impressed me the most was a long talk from a professor of the University of Virginia who spoke about Jefferson and Madison’s friendship. There was much talk between Jefferson and Madison about deism and how to incorporate it into the future documents of this nation without offending anyone or having that deism ‘offend’ the new world. Their use of the word ‘providence’ left the belief or not of an all-knowing god up to the individual.

While is may be argued whether or not they were atheists, most who study them carefully believe they were both non-believers. But this is what they did for this country:

This country will base its morality upon sympathy for other people and for other living beings. Despite subjective interpretations of what that morality is composed of, it will be bounded by absolutes. That is: to protect innocents, especially children; to help those in need; to strive for a fair and just society where basic freedoms are protected; to seek a betterment of mankind and a nullification of the agents of injustice, prejudice, oppression, intolerance, and evil in the world; and to continue scientific efforts to understand the nature of the world and of ourselves for such knowledge is the only truth. And perhaps the most important: To recognize that sympathy for our fellowman is the noblest of human endeavor.

Belief in God or not, it is religion that challenges what we know as absolutes.
It would be foolish to ignore any attempts to modify, codify, or to nullify those absolutes.

[Charlie (Colorado)]

Founded, to a degree by Deists, or not - American tradition and the root of her social values is Judeo-Christian belief. That is a fact and no amount of protestation is going to change it.

No, Dan, it's not a fact. What is a fact is that the Founders were explicitly rejecting Judeo-Christian tradition in terms of government: no Divine Right of Kings, no religious tests for office. Nor were the Dissenters just Deists: John Adams, for example, was a Unitarian and rejected the doctrine of the Holy Trinity. What is a fact is that the Founders paid much more attention to the Roman Republic in the organization of the government's institutions (three equal branches with different responsibilities might strike you familiar, as might the name of the upper house of Congress) than they did to the Juedo-Christian tradition of governance --- except, perhaps, for bad examples of tyranny, authoritarian rule, and suppression of dissent.

As common as it is to insist that the US was essentially Christian, it's not a fact.

[Archie Levine]

I've seen some interviews with Goode and am disturbed by the fact that in the interview he pretty much says exactly, word for word, parts of the letter...that starts to seem like this letter wasn't sent as an "accident" to the head of the Sierra Club in his district, but more like it was a calculated stunt (ala Karl Rove) to generate exactly this kind of publicity and make him look a like a victim at the hands of the liberal press who are exploiting the letter sent in "error" to the radial left-wing ideologue who promptly and gleefully turned it into a media frenzy.

It really is very clever, you know, give the Devil his due. Much more effective than if Goode had the courage to call a press conference where he read the text of the letter all on his own instead of responding to a "leak." This trick is an oldie but a Goode-ie.

I really miss America...and not the one that Donald Trump gave a second chance to.

[Fade]

No, We ARE NOT CHRISTIANS. The world is NOT just 6,000 years old. Mary Wasn't a Virgin when she had Jesus. Noah didn't build an ark that carried 2 of every species of the planet on it. There ain't no heaven and you aren't priveleged. Get over it. ARE WE NOT AMERICANS? Yes we are. Freedom FROM Religion is a blessed blessed thing. And remember to celebrate the real reason for the season: Yule.

[Dan Riehl]

"While I see your point, I think that history pretty much proves that immigrants, regardless of where they come from or what they believe, adopt American mores and American values"

I wouldn't be too quick to assume history proves that at all. There was a great deal of similarity between the groups which have assimilated here. The vast majority sprang from the same Judeo-Christian tradition.

Also, Blacks have struggled more than other groups to assimilate as a whole. We assume it is because of the nature of their having gotten here through slavery and also because of the predjudice to which they were wrongfully exposed, even after having been freed. While there is no denying or excusing that to which they were exposed, there's also no way to be certain that cultural differences haven't contributed to their challenge in assimilating. The vast majority of Blacks have assimilated just as any other group, unfortunately there's a significant subset which seems to have not.

More important than all that, the profound consequences for Europe resulting from a lack of desire by many Muslims to assimilate there is now a part of history, too. Ignoring it would be foolish, if not dangerous for America.

Frankly I find many of the people protesting all this to be disingenuous, at best. I doubt many would advocate a totally open door policy when it comes to immigration from the Middle East. We already discriminate in our immigration policy and always have. The issue isn't really "will we," it is "to what extent?"

[Darweesh Qaimari]

Bless you this New Year from the city of Jerusalem, the city of Jesus Christ, although I am a Muslim youth, but this did not prevent the celebration of the new year and the birth of Jesus Christ-peace be upon him, I wish prosperity and happiness of all the inhabitants of the land and freedom for people in the occupied Palestinian territories.

[Punditguy]

Let's see if this dum libral can follow the chain of events.

1) I vote for, and help elect, the first Muslim member of congress. I voted for an American, a guy originally from Detroit, who converted to Islam in college.

2) A bigot in Virginia says that we have to shut off immigration for Muslims, or else we might elect more Americans originally from Detroit.

3) A blogger decides that this is a legitimate topic for discussion.

Fine. Let's discuss. As much as you'd like to make this a high-minded debate about immigration policy and social responsibility, it's really about a redneck's ramblings.

Here's what Goode said.

"When I raise my hand to take the oath on swearing-in day, I will have the Bible in my other hand. I do not subscribe to using the Koran in any way."

Seriously. Why would he subscribe to using the Koran in any way? He's not Muslim. What he's saying, though, is that nobody should use the Koran for that purpose. First of all, what business is it of his, and second, why shouldn't a person hold their own sacred book while taking such an oath? What purpose would it serve if Ellison held a bible?

"If American citizens don't take up and adopt the Virgil Goode position on immigration, there will likely be many more Muslims elected to office and demanding the use of the Koran."

"Demanding" -- fascinating choice of words. Is there not the freedom in this country to worship as one pleases? Ellison doesn't have to "demand" anything. Plus, how would changing immigration policy have stopped Ellison from being elected?

"We need to stop illegal immigration totally and reduce legal immigration and end the diversity visas policy pushed hard by President Clinton and allowing many persons from the Middle East to come to this country."

I totally agree that we need to stop illegal immigration -- maybe Goode should have a nice talk with GWB about that. As for diversity visas, check out the countries where the applicants came from (http://travel.state.gov/visa/immigrants/types/types_1317.html). Add up the numbers from Saudi Arabia, Iran, Iraq, Syria, Jordan, Kuwait and UAE and you get about 1,600 folks. Wow. That's certainly a dangerous voting bloc.

We want people from these countries to come here and experience life on this side of the fence. There's some evidence that it's helped moderate the anti-American views held in the region. Take Iranian youth, for example (http://abcnews.go.com/Nightline/International/story?id=646586&page=1).

"I fear that in the next century we will have many more Muslims in the United States if we do not adopt the strict immigration policies that I believe are necessary to preserve the values and beliefs traditional to the United States of America and to prevent our resources from being swamped."

1) If he's worried about Muslims in the U.S., is he also going to outlaw conversion? If not, then does he really care about the number of Muslims in the U.S.?

2) Which values and beliefs is he worried about?

3) What resources are swamped by Muslim immigrants?

"The Ten Commandments and 'In God We Trust' are on the wall in my office. A Muslim student came by the office and asked why I did not have anything on my wall about the Koran. My response was clear, 'As long as I have the honor of representing the citizens of the 5th District of Virginia in the United States House of Representatives, The Koran is not going to be on the wall of my office.'"

What's so clear about that statement? Is he going to have the Koran on the wall of his office when he is no longer representing the citizens of the 5th District of Virginia in the United States House of Representatives? Plus, I seriously doubt that this exchange actually happened.

I don't want to censor the guy, and he's entitled to whatever he wants to believe. He just also happens to be a complete moron.

[Thomas Paine in the neck]

An important point to note. Two influential philosophers, Hume and Locke created the actual basis for our founders. The Constitution reflects their influence directly and rather thoroughly. Hume was a renowned critic of organized religion during the Scottish Enlightenment
In order to argue Jewish/Christian influence you would have to be very specific in your citations. Enlightenment influence is all over the document. Concepts such as being "created equal" and "life liberty and the pursuit of happiness" were revolutionary since they were not specifically tied to a theological worldview.
In relation to Mr Goode in needs to be iterated that there can be no "religious test" for office holders. There is also no swearing in done on any religious text in the public ceremony.
What Mr Goode represents is a common thread in American political life. Fear of the immigrant. The Puritans considered the Quakers heretics and it has gone on from there.

[jim]

Yes. Goode is absolutely entitled to his bigoted, prejudicial, ignorant and borderline racist opinion which shames all Americans before the entire world.

It is absolutely his Constitutionally protected right to grandstand for his own personal gain by inflaming fearful Americans against a law-abiding man who is elected with the full will of the voters.

And even the fact that this blatant act of defying the wills and intentions of our nation's founding fathers displays an utter lack of the Christian mercy, goodwill, charity and love that Goode himself has, as a reverend, sworn his life, at least in word, to support - even this doesn't mean that he should be required to go the frak home and hide there.

I can't help feeling that it would be nice though.

[Jesus]

This is my first (and last) visit to this website. I'm shocked by the anger and venom of someone supposedly supporting religious values.