Iraq and Iran: Timing Is Everything

Not too substantive, but precious nonetheless.

Nov. 26 (Bloomberg) -- Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad predicted the collapse of Israel, the U.S. and Britain, attacking what he called their ``oppressive behavior.''

``The Zionist regime is on a steep downhill towards collapse and disgrace,'' Ahmandinejad told supporters at a rally of Basiji militia forces near Tehran today. In a reference to the U.S. and U.K., he said ``the collapse and crumbling of your devilish rule has started.'' The speech was carried live on state television.

And this:

Iraqi President Jalal Talabani arrived in Tehran on Monday to meet with his Iranian counterpart amid increasing calls for Washington to enlist Iran's help in calming the escalating violence in neighboring Iraq.

Talabani is a Kurd and they have relations with Iran over anti-Iranian and anti-establishment Kurdish terror groups which give both side fits as they go back and forth between the borders. But Talabani is also the guy to handle any rapprochement, if it's in the cards. Meanwhile, Bush remains away from his desk.

To be fair, I assume he has to have it out with Maliki this week - either Sadr goes, or Maliki goes, or America goes. Funny thing is, if Sadr stays and America goes, Maliki could be on the way out. Sadr is becoming to Iraq what Nasrallah is to Lebanon. What would remain to be seen is if Sadr wanted to stay out of government and just pull the strings, or run the show himself. That would eventually make him one of the most powerful leaders in the Middle-East. Israel has to be watching all this and sweating it out. This has greater ramifications for them, than it does the US.

If we talk to Iran, as is being sold by every political huckster in the MSM, this will be a devastating defeat for America. And Bush should not be forgiven for sacrificing so many American lives to turn Iraq over to our enemies. It will be worse than Clinton's Mogadishu moment, far worse and with more profound long-term consequences for our military and national psyche.

Jules Crittenden looks for a bright side. But I haven't been impressed with what I've been seeing. The White House is playing domestic politics with a crucial International war. And the Middle-East is one of the best places in the world to get stabbed in the back, it could be even worse than France.

Comments

[yyy]

As I understand it the idea is to try and get Iran to get the Iraq shia to back off, although I can't for the life of me see why Iran would choose to do something like that since the Iraq debacle is in their best interest, so on that note, talking to them would seem pretty pointless.

On the larger scale though, despite how cool and big and strong it makes some dolts to feel by saying "I won't talk to you because you are a bad man" it is idiotic from the standpoint of diplomacy, when you remove yourself and your country from the dialog then you have no leverage at all. That is why Israel has agreed to a cease fire with Hamas...military action has NOT, predictably quelled the latest round of violence, but political action has, for the moment, done so.

As for Sadr, it may be too late, the forces he has brought together and then unleashed on Iraq are there, they exist. Killing him might prevent a Khomeni like take over, but it wouldn't stop his forces from continuing on down the same path at least in the short term.

Israel is getting just what she asked for. I don't for a second believe that Israeli intelligence did not know for a fact that there were no WMD in Iraq, no new nukes program, etc. they fed Bushy what he wanted to hear because they, like their neocon buddies, believed that a US military presence in Iraq would make Israel safer.

Hopefully, everyone has now woken up and smelled the coffee.

Israel is in the worst position she has been in in a decade and it has nothing to do with the Palestinians, Nasrallah is now a freaking national hero in Lebanon and a hero all over the ME, the mightly ISraeli military got fought to a standstill and the mightly US military is bogged down in the Iraq debacle, the dream of taking down Iran is DEAD...

[Doc]

And, from the other corner...

More fuss over Iraq. What a pity. Iraq ought to be seen as something akin to Okinawa, or the Phillipines, or Burma; a stepping stone, a piece of the puzzle. The action going on there now ought to be viewed with the same detachment as if it were a bit of light colonial policing. No way in the world should we be considering leaving there. We should be building up forces, preparatory to our demand that Iran surrender. When we finally decide to get off our duffs and continue to prosecute the war against Islam in the ME, I don't want our boys to have to fly off the Kitty Hawk; I want them to use Baghdad Int'l, convenient, and centrally located. We fought for it, it's ours, let's keep it.

Of course, I don't favor much in the way of ground war when it comes to fighting the global war against Islam. We ought to declare every nation in which substantial numbers of people danced in the streets after 9/11, or who are known to be supporting violent Muslims, to be in a state of war with the US. They all must surrender. Then we do for them what we did for the Japanese: reform their societies such that they no longer teach their children that they are divinely appointed to rule the world. If they refuse, we give them 2 wks to evacuate, then lob a tactical on their capitol. Do this once, maybe twice, then they'll all capitulate. We can do this now, or after one of our cities becomes a glowing cinder. I know which one I'd pick.

[Nikolay]

"And Bush should not be forgiven for sacrificing so many American lives to turn Iraq over to our enemies."

But that was obvious from the very beginning. Most of the the opposition to Saddam that US worked with was Iran-backed. Al-Maliki never made a secret of his allegiance to Iran. It's not about a choice to be made now, it's about a choice that has been made long ago.

BTW, when Al-Maliki went to US this summer, and Democrats protested against his obvious siding with Hezbollah in the Lebanon conflict, Republicans called them "enemies of freedom" for this.

[dow]

Russia sold him some missiles and the Chinese are investing 100 billion in their oil.

Still think they won't bomb?

[Seekeronos]

Islam is without a doubt our greatest enemy since Nazism in WW2, or the Communists of the Cold War era.

Why Bush has allowed himself to be sidelined (or worse, if he has truly given up the fight) is unconscionable... even as a lame duck President, he is still Commander in Chief... he has yet 18 months to do as he sees fit to destroy the fiendish Islamists who beset that country.

Does he not realise yet that this is now the "all or nothing" zone of the war? Double, nay, triple the deployed forces if available, and pull out all of the stops.

Untie the hands of our armed forces.

Incinerate Sadr City, Immolate Fallujah, and depopulate Baghdad (either by coercion or by HEI rounds or napalm or "willy pete" munitions)...

Shoot to kill anyone who even looks askance at a US servicemember, yes, even if that means putting a bullet in the head of a terrorist "child"... there is nothing innocent or childlike about a ten-year old with a dynamite belt or an AK-47 aimed at you.

Stop playing according to the so-called "rules of war" that the Islamists carp about, but conveniently ignore as they string up contractors and civilians from bridges and lightposts.

Pile up the bodies like cords of wood, and stack them waist high. Mosques playing anti-American messages? Let them be razed to the ground and pigs' blood be spilt thereupon, so that they may never be rebuilt.

Let our politicians grow some nads, and show the Islamists that there will be no reprieve, no mercy, and no tolerance of evil as long as we occupy the land.

Public hangings and executions, and the use of field weapons (daisy cutters, fuel air explosives, and flamethrowers).

These people only understand the sword of thier idol moon god; it is high time we pulled out Sherman's playbook and put the region under the fear of Uncle Sam and the Lord God Almighty.

War Crimes? Perhaps "Preventive Genocide"? I dare say not. We are dealing with people with the mentality of brute beasts; animals without conscience or even an understanding of what it is to be human. They preach an extermination of anything not of Islam; well... the only way to kill off such a cancer is to destroy the cancerous growth before it kills you.

In waging thier *Endloesung* against the West, they have only assured thier own downfall.

The only war crime would be leaving Iraq in the hands of the Sadrists and thier ilk... for if left to thier own plans, they will bring thier satanic Jihad to our shores.

[Draegn]

Better yet, declare Iraq to be a non-entity. In it's place declare an independent nation of Kurdistan and give it full diplomatic recognition. Then let the well armed Kurds backed by US fighter/bombers engage in a little ethnic cleansing. Problem solved, and we have a nice new friendly nation.

[Doc]

Hmm...I kinda like that last idea.

[larry]

i second the 'kurdistan' idea. bush wants a solid base in the ME, friendly to the US, willing to base our troops, amenable to the "seed of democracy" concept....kurdistan fits that bill just fine.

what'll you bet baker & his traveling idiot circus reject it out of hand: just like they did last time. too obvious, you understand. not subtle enough for a canny realist like the great and powerful james.

[Seekeronos]

I'd personally prefer to see this idea given life as well.

~Howerver~

...As good as the Kurdistan idea sounds on the surface, the trick is getting Turkey to play along with it.
We would have to leverage Turkey's entry into the UN and thier existing membership in NATO alongside the masses of Islamist agitators there, against general Turkish antipathy against thier own ethnic Kurds, and the "threat" posed by a Kudish state on thier southern border.

[Seekeronos]

Erm, I meant Turkey's bid to enter the EU (not the UN).