Joran Van Der Sloot - We Who?

A reader pointed this out - it is troubling. We who? If I were picked up I would think I'd say I got in the car.

Joran: I'd left them on the beach, I'd walked to the car, we got in the car, and right then, there, I couldn't go back because... we were going home.

Comments

[GA Mom]

I agree and I also found it trubling that he almost laughed when taking about the missing shoes.

[Mike]

Would this be one of those Fruedion slip things?

[Lisa11011]

Remember where he left his shoes - at the beach near the Holiday Inn. He was picked up at the Fisherman Hut. This makes logical sense that he did not go back to the Holiday Inn to get his shoes. The Holiday Inn is off the main road of the Fishermans Hut. It is out of the way.

[Sweetie]

Wow, imagine that,did he have a mouse in his pocket? or was it his shoe??? hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[Mike]

I thought he said they where on the Merriott beach, which is where the Fishermans hut are right?

[Paulo]

There may be something to the syntax. However, given the boy is multilingual, moreover, insofar as most people get their contractions incorrect, I don’t have much of a problem with the statement.

I would like some clarification as to whether Satish picked Joran up at the Fisherman’s Huts or actually on the beach. Did he go up and wait, or did he hear the horn or see the car, or what? Having established that premise then I feel that the statement takes on far more significance.

Paulo

[GA Mom]

Dan, I am curious as to what you thought about the statement that Joran made that if Natalee were found that he would hate her?

[COLUMBO]

The usual M.O. is to leave victims there to regain conciousness-maybe she did.....now didn't he also state at one point that she became hysterical? Maybe Joran, or whoever he was with...needed to take drastic action to avert a scene. Perhaps she needed to be chased and headed into the surf to get away. That would make an awful mess of sneakers....I know I would not want them in my car.

Come to think of it, a few had suggested this last summer:

http://www.underworldtales.com/aruba.htm

http://www.mythforlife.com/qtr_2nd_05.html

[Sweetie]

Dan, I am curious as to what you thought about the statement that Joran made that if Natalee were found that he would hate her?

He knows better than that, that is why he can say that, with no emotion either. JMHO

[Eyes for Lies]

Joran van der Sloot: Honest or not?
http://eyesforlies.blogspot.com/2006/02/joran-van-der-sloot-honest-or-not.html

[Dan]

Dan, I am curious as to what you thought about the statement that Joran made that if Natalee were found that he would hate her?

Well, I do have thoughts that it fits a personality which is, shall we say, not very nice - self-centered, childish, rather cut off from feelings for others. But I can't say it is to the point of being socio-pathic, or making him a murderer. It would take more to conclude that. But obviously he seems very ego driven.

[micah]

"We" : Daddy and Joran!

Shortly after the "accident", Joran called his Dad from the McDonald's pay phone and said I snuck out tonight and something seriously bad has happened, get over here, we need you ASAP!

Joran sent Kalpoes back to the house to pick Paul up. Joran remained with the body on the beach. The Kalpoes brought Paul back to the beach. Once the four men decided what to do next, they wrapped the body in some plastic Paul brought from the Van der Sloot home and placed the body in the Kalpoe's trunk. The four men got back in the Kalpoe's car and the Kalpoes dropped off Joran, Paul, and Natalee's body SOMEWHERE and drove themselves home. Paul made Joran wait outside while he alone disposed of the body. That way Joran and Kalpoes could honestly testify (if it ever came to that), "We don't know where Natalee is". Paul and Joran walked home separately so they would not call attention to themselves. When Joran got home he called Deepak @ 3 AM to say, "I'm home now". To signal Natalee's body was taken care of... Early the next morning Deepak and Satish meticulously cleaned their car of any evidence. Paul began advising the boys about how to legally protected.

[Righty-Tighty]

Depending on whether or not someone had to get out of the car to get him...then, "WE" would have to get (back) in the car to go.

Maybe had I heard it....but I didn't. And in print, it is very easy to conclude many options.

I agree with Paulo

[jgirl]

I think that he said he would hate her if she came back, to try and look good. In his own mind, he is attempting to say, he would be angry at her
for going off on her own, and everyone getting bad publicity and rap for it.
I don't get the impression he means if she were found, but only if she left
on her own accord, which all of us know is the most unlikely scenerio of all.

[GA Mom]

If they are guilty I think that Paulus and Joran or probably just Paulus went and moved the body from wherever it may have been put. There is no way he would risk the Kalpoe brothers knowing where the body was.

[xxx]

Joran van der Sloot: Honest or not?
http://eyesforlies.blogspot.com/2006/02/joran-van-der-sloot-honest-or-not.html

__________

This is very interesting, I recommend everyone read it.

The poster makes a good point that Joran is asked what would he SAY to Natalee and he responds not with words "Why did you do this to me?" but with a strong emotion..he would HATE her.

Definitely worth the read.

[micah]

Joran has been claiming for months that he walked himself home in those early morning hours.

But NOW he claims the K's came and picked him up!

I smell a rat!

Joran is setting the Kalpoes up! If Joran was given a ride home by the Kalpoes, why would he have needed to let Deepak know he got home @ 3 AM?!

[GA Mom]

I thought it was a good read also.

[Justice for Natalee]

Joran VDS blog has an interesting analysis "Eyes for Lies."

[Kevad]

I have not had a chance to read all the other threads, but I did tape the interview and have listened to parts of it several times which raised some questions. He does specifically say he was dropped off "at the beach next to the Holiday Inn." He then says he took his shoes off there due to sand, and then walked down to the water. They then walked "for some time" to the north towards the Huts. It would be nice if these news reporters would ask more details like did you carry your shoes with you, how far did you walk, or how long did you walk, show me on this map where you were let off and by the beach. I understand some refer to that beach area as being associated with the Holiday Inn because the Marriott was not always there, but he then says they walked north. Were they dropped off right near the Holiday Inn or not? Could others who knew Natalee have seen them where he was dropped off? Come on news people details, details, get the details! Where did he last have his shoes? I also agree, who was the "we" did someone have to get out of the car to get him, it would be nice if logical follow-up questions were asked and answered like who is "we". It was a very good job, but as usual it raises more questions. Did they not have hours with him to go over it more and get these kinds of details?

[xxx]

The eyes for lies piece does a good job of pointing out where in the interview he seems to be hiding things...such as when he admits he and the Kalpoes met almost every day that week to talk but then pauses, and ends up saying they thought maybe they should go to police [but they didn't]...

Also does a great job of analyzing how the reasons he gives for his actions...are not logical or consistent.

[lurking]

Joran: I'd left them on the beach, I'd walked to the car, we got in the car, and right then, there, I couldn't go back because... we were going home.

I noticed this in the interview also. I took it to mean that whoever picked him up was outside of the car. He walked to the car, they got into the car.

That he would "hate" her if she showed up. If anything, it just says to me that he wasn't repeating rehersed answers or he never would have said this.

Wish I had a tape of the interview. The other part that really struck me as odd was his reactions when he was talking about the sharks. He was drawing on something there.

[GA Mom]

I thought I rmemebered a mb boy telling some reproter maybe O'Reilly that Natalee told him she was going to see sharks when she left C&C's. Anyone remember that?

[Kevad]

I had thought it possible that this comment about the sharks was perhaps similar to the joke from the TV show Happy Days where the kids who were suggesting they go make out would refer to going up to the lake to watch the submarine races.

[MoonShadow]

A reader pointed this out - it is troubling. We who? If I were picked up I would think I'd say I got in the car.

Joran: I'd left them on the beach, I'd walked to the car, we got in the car, and right then, there, I couldn't go back because... we were going home.

Friday, February 24, 2006 at 04:40 PM in Natalee Holloway | Permalink | Comments (14) | TrackBack (0)

I don't find it so troubling. He took his shoes off at the Marriott beach, they walked North to the fisherman's huts...which is where he was picked up. Why couldn't it be a simple (simpel) as...

1. Satish walked out to the beach to meet him?

2. Satish was standing outside the car when Joran got to it, so THEY got in?

3. A language difference much like how Deepak used the word "simpel" to mean nothing unusual?

I guess we won't know becasue Cuomo didn't ask the clarifying question, "What do you mean , "We?"

[Take Your Pick]

Pretty simple, Satish arrived Joran was slow, looking for his shoes. Satish doesn't know where exactly Joran is on the beach. Satish gets out of the car, leaning against it kicking stones waiting. Or gets out stretches lights a smoke and sits on the hood waiting. Or gets out to see what that rattling noise from the muffler is.

Take your pick ;-)

Joran finally ambles up the path to the car and they both get in and leave!

[notdeepak]

The fact he throws the Kalpoe's under the bus by leaving us with "maybe they know more", or "they had the means to go back there" is messed up on national TV. We all want to hang Joran, but maybe, just maybe all he is guilty of is a hookup and coverup. Kalpoes laywer, Mr Kock, didnt look all that pleased...I think the forensics were in the Kalpoes car, but that was a dead end long ago....

[xxx]

Boy oh boy this Satish is some lackey, he goes all the way home, and an hour later, Joran calls him for a ride, and what does Satish do. Well he gets right in his car, goes down to the beach and picks up Joran. He also gets out of the car for some reason, so that "we" can get back into the car.

I guess other than the fact that Satish denies this ever happened, that is as plausible as the rest of Joran's story.

[annie]

Meanwhile, while everybody is concentrating on Joran, the Kalpoes are being given a free ride!!

[GA Mom]

Why doesn't Joran have his own car. The Van Der Sloots seem to have plenty of money. And don't say he's not old enough. He's not old enough to gamble or drink either.

[Jody]

I think he was trying his best to get away from Hitler's sister's daughter as fast as he could before Natalee asked Satish to take her sightseeing again.

The boy wanted to go home. He could always buy more shoes.

[truhbetold]

uhhhh...."we" meaning whoever drove him home I would assume.......but honestly who knows....everyone in this case has lied, does lie and is lying alllllll the time including natalees own family and friends.....the circus goes on and on and on.....

[xxx]

They are all guilty, they were all present, they all know what happened.

Joran did not call for a ride from either Kalpoe, get a ride from either Kalpoe and then call the other one to say he got home. It's exactly the kind of stupid lie a 17 year old desperately trying to match his story to the phone records would come up with.

They went to his house
"Something bad happened"
Two of them went to the beach/pond to dispose of Natalee.
One went home to log into the computer
Two called for a pick up.
"We" two got in the car.
The gardner saw all 3 in the car
They split up again.
Kalpoes went home.
Joran walks home.
And calls them when he arrives.

[MHinUSA]

The following is an excerpt of an interview with Greta and one of the chaperones - This person states the reason for the interview:
VAN SUSTEREN: What's she like?

PLUMMER: No. None whatsoever! None whatsoever. That's the primary reason for me coming and speaking out now is to dispel a lot of the misinformation and the lies and rumors and innuendo about how the students were acting on this trip.

VAN SUSTEREN: Were you the one who notified Beth that her daughter was missing, or at least hadn't shown up to the bus?

PLUMMER: No. We actually called back to Birmingham and talked to one of the ladies that had arranged the trip, and she called Beth.

VAN SUSTEREN: And then at that point, I assume you boarded the plane and you came home, and Beth's mother arrived sometime later, is that right?

PLUMMER: Yes, ma'am.

Does this bother anyone else out there that this chaperone sees to it that her mother is notified back in the states that the girl is missing - and then boards an airplane and LEAVES - MY GOD - the least this person could have done was stay there and maybe book another flight - I mean this kid was missing - and they all just leave!!!!!!!!!!!

[wreck]

Does this bother anyone else out there that this chaperone sees to it that her mother is notified back in the states that the girl is missing - and then boards an airplane and LEAVES - MY GOD - the least this person could have done was stay there and maybe book another flight - I mean this kid was missing - and they all just leave!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: MHinUSA | Friday, February 24, 2006 at 06:15 PM
You missed the rest of his story. He didn't leave on the first flight -- there were two. One chaperone stayed to coordinate. Very old news.

[annie]

'xxx' - You don't happen to be 'Granny Toad' by another name, do you??

[MHinUSA]

O - I guess I never heard those details of the story!
There are quite a few....
Thanks

[xxx]

Have I mentioned ad hominum attacks even once?

Why do you ask?

[GA Mom]

I would like to see the casino serveilance tape for the entire day or even better the whle week. Not little edited snips but the whole tapes from begining to end.

[Skyboxx]

Who was the MB student that Joran claimed "yelled at Natalee" to get out of the car? Was this a male, or a female? Has this student come forward to at least corroborate or dispell this point Joran made?

[xxx]

No one from MB has come forward to corroborate it, but David Koch has said this happened and that there were witness statements in ALE files and it is referenced in the civil suit, so I think we can assume that someone from Mountain Brook in some manner asked or tried to get Natalee to leave the car, but she wanted to stay.

[Skyboxx]

XXX,

Careful my friend, ad hominum attacks/comments, whether real or percieved will get you bounced. Tread lightly and enjoy the view.

[GA Mom]

Skyboxx

I thought it was girls. I saw them on some interview, but maybe there were boys in the group. They did say they asked Natalee to get out of the car and go with them. Joran said that Deepak said she could get out if she wanted too. I have trouble believing that part.

[Skyboxx]

For the record, some time ago, I mentioned that Beth Holloway Twitty was being attacked unmercifully. There were other comments, no longer allowed on this blog, but the rand ended with sooner or later BHT was to become a spokesperson, much like John Walsh for America's most wanted, but for missing teens, et al. I see last night that indeed BHT is going forward with that project.

Way ahead of my time, if I do say do myself Dan. ,

[oneyka]

To Jody:

You are so hateful and narrow minded. This creep did get away with murder, so far, and you are the devil's daughter!

[annie]

I am quite serious, and why should you think it is an attack? I am thinking of changing my name because somebody has been posting as me!!

[kate]

they never found joran's shoes. quite a few people thought nat could not have drown because they never found her shoes either. i have my doubts about them being on the beach at all.

[mary]

Lying
Being riddled with the question of "how to know someone is lying", i decided to seek advice from experts in BeingAMan forum. Those guys were a great help.

There are a number of signs you want to look for when a woman is lying :

Skin color changes - either flushes or gets pale
Eyes dart around, won't look you directly in the eye when they were doing it comfortably before, pupils dilate
Increased blinking
Touches/rubs herself
Lowers her head
Turns her body away from you when her shoulders were square to yours before
Her mouth gets dry
Breathing gets shallow or she holds her breath and rapid indicating an increased heartbeat
She starts playing with something she's holding like a drink or her purse
She crinkles up her nose or touches her face
She tightens her lips or clenches her jaw
Of course, just one of these signals can't be used as an indication of anything. You need at least 3 or more of them together or rapidly following one another.

[xxx]

It was a JOKE.

Granny used to rant about ad hominum attacks in practically every post...so I was trying, kinda cleverly, I thought...to say no, I'm not Granny because I haven't mentioned ad hominum attacks.

[kate]

Posted by: mary | Friday, February 24, 2006 at 06:45 PM

if you taped the show, hit mute and watch it again.
very interesting.