Jennifer Hagel-Smith Was Sleeping In Corridor

I didn't follow the George and Jennifer Smith cruise ship incident very closely, but this new story sounds just flat out weird.

A woman whose husband disappeared during their honeymoon cruise last summer was found sleeping in a corridor far from the couple's cabin the night he vanished, the cruise line said Wednesday.

The cruise line also said the FBI was investigating an alleged rape of a female passenger by the same young men last seen with Smith. The alleged sexual assault occurred three days after Smith disappeared, and was videotaped by the young men, according to Royal Caribbean.

Turkish authorities have said Smith and his wife had been drinking heavily and had been gambling at the ship's casino before his disappearance.

On the night her husband disappeared, Hagel-Smith was found at about 4:30 a.m. sleeping on the floor of a corridor on the other side of the ship, far from her cabin, according to Royal Caribbean. She was taken back to her cabin by wheelchair - a standard procedure - at 4:47 a.m. by two security guards and a female supervisor, the cruise line said.

Smith was not in the cabin and his wife said she was OK, Royal Caribbean said.

Like I said ... weird.

Comments

[R. Decker]

She may have been so drunk/ drugged that she passed out in the foyer on the other side of the ship- if that's the case- she wouldn't have known what happened to her husband. Just an opinion.

[Phoenix]

"She was taken back to her cabin by wheelchair - a standard procedure "

Gee, sounds like fun. "-a standard procedure." You know the workers on the cruise ship love this duty.

The guy is fish food, and those other guys got away with murder.

What was the name of this cruise line? Bacchanalian Buccaneers Go Boating?

[Steel]

Bozos go Boating.

[dnichols]

I had heard months ago on Scarborough Country that she was drunk and passed out somewhere else in the ship and was brought back to the room in a wheel chair. It was said that when she was brought back, her husband was already gone. Her husband had come back to the room with the three men earlier and was also very drunk. The witnesses Joe Scarborough interviewed were passengers in the adjacent staterooms who heard all the commotion going on in Smith's room, and one photographed the bloodstains on the deck below before they were cleaned up. If I remember correctly, one was a M.D. who said something violent happened in that room...he and his wife could hear someone being thrown against the walls and then heard the thump when he hit below before possibly going overboard, and he commented on the violent bloodstains that were obvious that something very serious had occurred in that room....very very sad. I cannot believe the cruise line "cleaned up" afterwards like it was a spilled drink, not human blood. I was on a Royal Caribean cruise in '95 but would be very concerned today after learning how unregulated and unpoliced they are, and that they do nothing to find missing passengers...what a crime. I hope Hagel-Smith does sue and gets some results. I can't imagine getting totally drunk on a honeymoon cruise and never seeing my husband again. How horrible.

[marci]

I followed this case a bit last summer. It was my understanding that they got drunk together and she wandered off and passed out in a lounger but I guess it was the floor from what you report. At any rate, she was supposedly not in the room when her husband met his fate.

[marci]

I think the guy next door was a former police chief from Redlands, CA. I remember this as Redlands is near me.

[chance]

I haven't followed this very much either, but wasn't there a witness statement early on that she was being very "friendly" with one of the cruise ship employees that night? A bartender or something?

[lsdoone]

From what I heard tonight on unreliable yet entertaining tv, George stayed in other cabins over the past few days while the couple was onboard.
The 'perfect honeymoon couple' seemed to drink excessively, steer clear of each other, and have more than mildly drunken fun.
None of these facts mean much on their own. However, George's boasting that he had "money in his cabin" could well have instigated his victimtood.
Sad case yet crazily logical or greedy.
Unless an Agatha Christie is afoot. In that case the butler definitely didn't do it.

[Brooke]

BOYCOTT Cruise ships........oh wait that's Twitty's thing isn't it?

[Jan]

This is not news - it was reported very early on that she had been drinking so much and was found far far away from her room - asleep. What might be interesting is if she was given something to make sure she never made it back to her room. I guess the drinking on these cruise ships is very normal since there is no worry about driving etc - everyone is encouraged to drink a lot - apparently George and Jennifer were not that big of drinkers in their real world. this is all very sad - many say they were a wonderful couple, no matter whether some of their behavior might seem odd on the ship. I do not understand why there is not more outrage over this case/ unlike Aruba/ whether it is the white boy vs white girl - the parents being more dignified - it still is very sad

[BROWNALMOSTBLACKMAN]

Die Mudder ist nicht Beth Twittface.

[gigi]

While it is a sad state of affairs as to what happend I have to say that when are people going to start being responsible for their hard partying ways. Drinking yourself into a state of oblivion is ALWAYS dangerous no matter if your 18 or 81. Also why is someone always quick to point out "oh he/she must have been drugged?" that is a total copout, if you are drinking do not let your drink out of your sight for a moment and watch the bartender our your drink. If you are still scared of that then buy your own liquor and drink in moderation in your room. I do not have a lot of sympathy for those who drink till they are fall down drunk and then blame their fate on everyone elses actions. Drinking clouds judgement so much and puts you in harms way. Thoughts?

[Jody]

I do wish we knew what the real story was. I have also heard that she passed out on a lounge chair on the deck.

George's mother described him as a party animal, so I don't think drinking is that foreign to them. I do think it is very strange that Jennifer is refusing to answer questions posed to her by George's family.

[southern girl]

yeah, but she had tears falling down her cheeks while before the House subcommittee...

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=1473357

[hugga]

The security guards and the supervisor who woke her up said she wasn't drunk, but asleep in the hallway. She was wheelchaired back to their room. She slept the whole night in the room and went to the spa about 10 am. Does that sound normal? Their is blood in the room and she doesn't notice it? And then when they found her in the spa, she asked if there was any blood outside their cabin? She also stated that her husband slept in different rooms on different nights. She smells denmarkishingly rotten.

[Kelly3]

I believe she also was in the same dress as the night before when she was found that morning in the spa. Very strange that she asked about blood. His family dosen't seem to trust her story. Just seems bizarre. She also dosen't remember who they partied with the days before. Also the cop next door to their cabin is a great witness for the timeline. He remembers everything. To bad his wife can't remember.

[minnesota dad]

Looks to me like she and Joran VanderSloot would make a wonderful couple....who do you think would get rid of the other one first? party on! md

[Paulo]

I'm in...

This shotty investigation by the cruise line is bogas bulls*it. Will we ever really know what happened to Smith? Don't hold your breath. It is going to take us, yea the public sleuths, to ferret this one out.

The travesty of this mess is that it's not the first time something like this has happened, it certainly won't be the last either. The cruise line will settle with those who ask. As for Jennifer, she doesn't know how she got to the bench she was sleeping on.

Nor does she remember who or how many folks were in the lift with her when she left the bar/lounge with the exception that George was not there. She was beyond blind drunk. George was beyond stuporously wasted.

It is perfectly plausible, moreover, conceivable that this guy was so wasted that he accidently went overboard. As for the record, in my opinion that will be the final analysis.

Paulo

[Norm]

Regret that I don't have much time to follow the complicated story, but it seems to me that this is a terrible mess .... involving a honeymooner possibly was murdered (but body not found) and its attempted coverup (if any) by the ocean liner (cruise ship). I hope that the law enforcement authorities get all the cooperations and resources they needed for solving this crime, and it does not matter how long it takes, as long as the public don't give up the hope. I believe they will eventually solve it. It would be better if the authorities (US and Turkish) had prevented all occupants from getting off the ship since the beginning and initiate their investigation. Since I don't know the detail, what are some appropriate actions that were needed to be taken, the sooner the better?

[Mike H]

Attn People: You're only entitled to an opinion when it's arrived at using at least some minuscule basis in fact.

Almost everyone here has made completely thoughtless remarks accusing Jennifer of killing her husband, but it's obvious through their comments that they've heard only passing comments about George's disappearance.

Let's talk about facts ---- that for the most part are not disputed:

Key people involved:

Jennifer Ha gel-Smith and George Smith

Josh Askin - 20-year old college student from California. He was along with his family to celebrate his parents' 25th wedding anniversary. Josh and his family actually met George and Jennifer at first in Florence, they got off the boat together. Neither of the groups had tours set-up and so they shared a cab. They spent a little bit of that day together that day, which is when they first met.

The "Three Russian Boys" - two brothers and a cousin from Brooklyn, New York were vacationing with their family. Their parents had emigrated from the Soviet Union so they became known in the events that followed as the three Russian Boys. At some point during the cruise these three boys become friendly with the Smith's. FYI - The cruise line said that the FBI was investigating an alleged rape of a female passenger by the same three young men with whom Smith had last been seen. These three Russian boys were kicked off the cruise ship by the cruise line because of this incident.

Clete Hyman, the deputy police chief from Redlands, California. Chief Hyman, a 31-year police veteran with a number of homicide investigations under his belt, was in the neighboring suite next to the Smiths and is a crucial witness to the case.

Pat and Greg Lawyer - were in a cabin on the other side of the Smiths.

Let's focus on the night in question starting at 2:30am, July 5th

The following is according to statements made by Josh Akins lawyer:

Josh, the three Russian boys, and Jennifer and George spent some time in the Casino until 2:30am. At 2:30 in the morning, now July 5th, the casino is closed for the night and the honeymooners, Josh, and the three Russian boys head for the disco bar up on deck 13. Everyone’s tipsy or better, according to Josh.

They all spend about an hour in the disco bar. At 3:30 am, the barman closes down the disco lounge, the party's over. The lights go on. Time for everybody to go to their rooms.

The Russian boys and Josh Askin escort George back to his room. According to Josh, George was about 50 percent on his own power on the way back to the room. He wasn't being carried but he was being guided with some assistance of the two larger boys. Jennifer is no longer with the guys. Her whereabouts at this time are unknown.

Continuing Josh’s version of events, he and the three Russians stumbled George to his cabin on deck 9. When they see there’s no Jennifer, George changes his shirt and they all set out again to find her. It’s now about 3:45 a.m.. The posee of five heads right to the place that the young people on board know as the after-hours hook-up place. They go to the Jacuzzi in the solarium area. No Jennifer. So it’s 5, 10 minutes there are very short amount of time looking because it’s obvious there’s nobody else there. And then five, ten minutes back to the room which puts them back to the room at about 4:00 a.m.

Josh describes this time as the ending to the night. He uses George’s bathroom as the Russians tuck in their drunken friend. The other boys put him down on the bed, take his shoes off, leave the room, ‘Goodbye goodbye, let’s go we’re outta here.’ They go down to one of the Russian boys’ rooms, order an incredible amount of room service, room service shows up 4:30, 4:45—with the food. They eat. Josh is back in bed by 5:15 that morning.

There seems to be little dispute with Josh's version up until all five men enter George's roon around 4am.

The following is according to statements made by Clete Hyman. Clete Hyman, the veteran California police officer in the cabin next door had been awakened at 4 a.m. by a ruckus through the wall— that’s at odds with Josh’s account. Through the common wall, he heard 15 minutes of loud voices and commotion that make him one of the best witnesses to the mysterious events in state room no. 9062. "That’s when I heard what I described as a horrific thud," says Hyman.

Chief Hyman’s cabin was right next door to the Smiths’ on deck 9. And what he heard through their common wall from a few minutes after 4 a.m. until 4:20 or so, is a primary piece of evidence in the investigation now underway into George Smith’s disappearance.

"A little after 4 o’clock in the morning, we were awakened by what I’d call loud cheering, something like a college drinking game," says Hyman. "This happened two distinct times."

The deputy chief was awakened by what he thought were at least six loud voices, at the exact same time that — as Josh’s lawyer told the story— George and his drinking buddies had returned from a fruitless search for Jennifer who’d gone missing.

Chief Hyman, a 31-year police veteran with a number of homicide investigations under his belt, reflexively noted the time, called the ship’s security office to complain about the noisy party underway and banged on the wall, to no avail. The voices continued. They weren’t as loud as they were during the drinking games. But then after a couple of minutes we heard voices outside the door of the Smith cabin. I don’t recall hearing the door open. I assumed they were leaving the party. But that was just my impression at the time.

For a few minutes the next door cabin quieted down, male voices in normal conversation, the chief couldn’t for the most part make out words or subjects.

By Dennis Murphy,Correspondent, NBC News

Hyman: This went on for a period of time. And then we heard what sounded like arguing out on the balcony.

Murphy: Arguing?

Hyman: Yes. Several couple of male voices arguing. It wasn’t a physical confrontation. It was just like they were arguing over some type of point.

Murphy: So after you heard these voices on the balcony part of the cabin, what happened next?

Hyman: Well, then I heard a voice just repeatedly say "goodnight" and my first assumption was that someone was trying to usher these people that were arguing out of the cabin. In fact, you could hear the progression through the cabin...

Now it was about 4:15 in the morning. Chief Hyman heard the adjacent cabin door open and voices receding in the hallway.

Hyman: So, I waited for a couple of seconds and then opened the door and looked out.

Murphy: What did you see?

Hyman: I saw three younger males walking down the hallway.
Young males — but only three of them — leaving George's cabin. Then through the wall, Chief Hyman heard a single male voice moving about speaking in a conversational tone though, oddly, no one replying. Then there was more loud noise.

Hyman: It’s what I would say sounded like furniture moving. Like, again, my impression was, ‘Good! They’re cleaning up the room.’
Whoever was next door the chief says he heard them moving between the cabin and the balcony. It was now approaching 4:20.

Hyman: And then for the last, maybe, couple of minutes it appeared to be concentrated out on the balcony area. The chairs on the balcony are metal so they make a different type of sound. I heard that noise and then there was silence. It got very quiet. Heard no voice. It was just very quiet.

Murphy: Silent for how long?

Hyman: Yes. Maybe three minutes, approximately, and at that point that’s when I heard what I described as a "horrific thud."

Murphy: Tell me in detail...

Hyman: The first thought in my mind was somebody fell on the balcony because it was the last place I had heard anyone. However, I quickly dismissed that because the noise was just too loud. There was actually a reverberation to the noise. And somebody just falling you know off their feet to something on a balcony would not cause that much noise.

Unbeknownst to Clete Hyman, Pat and Greg Lawyer on the other side of the Smiths, say they had been awakened not by the noise from the cabin but by three soft male voices— two of them accented— in the hallway before the commotion all started. They heard the cabin door open.

Pat Lawyer: I figured that this young man was drunk or inebriated. And they were calmly bringing him back to his room. In my mind, there was a young person who was saying, ‘Settle down, calm down, George.’
Pat and Greg— on almost exactly the same timeline, just after 4 a.m.— didn’t hear what Clete Hyman thought was a drinking game—but they did hear that same moving about of furniture. Where the police officer read it as the room being noisily put back in order, Pat and Greg heard violence— a room they thought, was being trashed.

Greg Lawyer: And then all of a sudden there was a lot of noise coming from the cabin next door, the George Smith cabin, and what it sounded to me like is somebody was throwing things against the wall, like throwing furniture in the room against the wall or against the floor.
Pat Lawyer: I kept saying to my husband, ‘What in the world is he doing there?’ and I did use the term ‘he’. I didn’t use the term they because we did not hear any voices.

Greg Laywer: And these there were maybe a series of shuffles and bangs against the wall. And then it ended with one big thud like somebody had picked up the couch or the sofa and threw it against the wall. And then that occurred, it was maybe a stretch of like two minutes, something like that, where these thuds took place, what I call trashing the room and then it went quiet.

After the awful thud, both the deputy chief and the couple heard a knocks— two sets of raps on the Smith cabin door about 4:30 a.m.

Greg Lawyer, curious, opened the door to see two uniformed ship personnel standing outside the Smith cabin.

Greg Layer: And I looked at them and I said, ‘Hey, you guys , you better get in there because that room is trashed.’ That’s exactly what I said and then they sort of gave me the 'hi' sign. They didn’t say anything.

The cruise line confirms they were ship’s security officers responding to the noise complaint Clete Hyman made just after 4 a.m.

With the offending loud party now over, Royal Caribbean says the uniformed men left without entering the Smith cabin.

There are hundreds of cameras on the ship. The cruise line tuned over 97 tapes to the FBI. Plus the room keys are time coded with every use and entry.

Remember this fact : Jennifer Hagel-Smith was found at about 4:30 a.m. sleeping or passed out on the floor of a corridor on the other side of the ship, far from her cabin, according to Royal Caribbean. She was taken back to her cabin by wheelchair -- a standard procedure -- at 4:47 a.m. by two security guards and a female supervisor, the cruise line said. George was not in the room at this time.

So it appears obvious that George disappeared between 4am & 4:47am. My guess at this point is one or all four of the boy's had something to do with George going overboard. The location of the blood stains suggests that George's body was too far from the edge to roll off on it's own.

Yes, Jennifer was in the spa when the cruise line located her. She had a pre-scheduled spa 9:30am appointment," says Martenstein, the VP of Operations for Royal Carribean.

[webangelpb]

When will they ever learn? Why do some people have to drink themselves in to a drunken stupor?? It's ridiculous and now the family is blaming the crusie line (who may or may not be at fault), but how much responsibility rests with George and Jennifer?? On their honeymoon, why are they having a drinkfest?? Crazy.

[Mike H]

Dear Webangelpb,

Get a Clue !
How dare you blame the victims...........

George was murdered ! 100% of the responsibility lies with the murderer. The three Russian boys who were last seen with George and probably killed him, were accused of rape by another passenger, and subsequently kicked off the ship by Royal.

It's obvious you have very little knowledge of the facts in this case. Royal Caribbean has acted deplorably. That's what the family is complaining about.

Even Royal was not happy with the Captains handling of this tragic incident, that's why he was forced into early retirement. In other words - it was quit or be fired.

So what if they were drinking heavily - they were on their honeymoon asswipe.
It's doubtful that even if George was sober that he could have changed the character of the people that took his life.

This isn't about someone suing Budweiser for them being an alcoholic. Compare apples to apples.

Plus where's your compassion ? Have the intelligence to backup you thoughtless comments with a logical argument.

[webangelpb]

Whoever you are, please do not e-mail me again with your non-sensical tirade. Did you read my post properly? How dare I blame the victims?? How dare you not see that the victims are also to be held responsible? The wife was so drunk that she passed out on the floor 3 floors up from her cabin. The husband was so drunk that he had to be helped in the room by others. Don't you think they deserve to accept some of the responsiblity for what happened? Please get those blinders off and look at the whole picture. How do you explain that a wife on her honeymoon wake up, not see her new husband and what does she do?.......head off to the spa.

Did I say the cruise ship was not to be blamed? I don't know maritime law, but from what I understand they did everything that they should have done. Even then, if you re-read my post properly you'll see that I'd said that they may or may not be blamed. The fact still remains though that the couple also share the blame. Everyone wants to be treated as adults and when things like this happen they should also shoulder their share of the responsibilities like adults.

You are confusing logic with lack of compassion. I was not writing to be compassionate I was stating the undisputed facts. The only display of unintelligent ramblings are coming from you...you are allowing compassion to cloud your judgment. I don't know how close you are to the families, maybe you are too close to see any different and I can understand that; but try to take a deep breath when you see comments like mine and reach deeeeeep inside yourself for that objective side of you. You'll see that I am right. The couple do share some of the responsibility for what happened. Had they been sober enough to understand what was going on around them, they'd have been better able to take care of themselves and each other. It may be hard for you to accept that, but it's the truth. Your reasoning is typical of people who refuse to accept their share of the responsibility when things go wrong, "So what if they were drinking heavily, they were on their honeymoon." Puleeeeeze!!! I know many people who go on their honeymoons and do not get so drunk they don't know and can't even think to care where each other is. This case isn't about drinking, but drinking too much is definitely a part of it. If you are going to drink, drink responsibly!!

The investigation is still going on. I don't know if the 3 Russians and the Californian teenager have anything to do with it. That wasn't my point. My only point is that the couple MUST share a part of the responsibility and I haven't seen the wife or the husband's family accepting that.

Unless you were/are a part of the investigation, I doubt you have more information than I do. And hurling insults at people whose opinions differ from yours does not strengthen your argument; in fact, it makes it even weaker. That's a old tactic often used by those who have no real rebuttal for what was said, so they have to resort to insults in the hopes of getting their opponents angry. Well, it didn't work...sorry.

ONE MORE THING, please do not e-mail me again. If you have a response to this, please post it on the site. I will be blocking your address. Thanks.

[webangelpb]

"While it is a sad state of affairs as to what happend I have to say that when are people going to start being responsible for their hard partying ways. Drinking yourself into a state of oblivion is ALWAYS dangerous no matter if your 18 or 81. Also why is someone always quick to point out "oh he/she must have been drugged?" that is a total copout, if you are drinking do not let your drink out of your sight for a moment and watch the bartender our your drink. If you are still scared of that then buy your own liquor and drink in moderation in your room. I do not have a lot of sympathy for those who drink till they are fall down drunk and then blame their fate on everyone elses actions. Drinking clouds judgement so much and puts you in harms way. Thoughts? "

My sentiments to be exact gigi.

[Christian]

I think obviously there is fal play involved. I hate to say it but from what I have read so far of Smith hanging with these animals that raped a girl or had possible drunken intercourse with her which is just as bad . I feel that Smith is not Suzy clean hands. She knows more and is either a good liar or has a major mental block. There is most definitely something there, between those three Russian guys and the very pretty Mrs. Smith. I don’t care what the poly says. Smith may very well be completely innocent but my NYC street sense tells me that there’s allot more that she knows. I will tell you what I think happen.

I think they were at the bar and all hanging out having fun, they all got a bit too drunk and those Russian guys sprouted major erections for Smith. I think these guys were smart and played them against each other successfully breaking them apart. He may have gone back to his cabin leaving the girl at the bar because he was embarrassed of her public flirting and was humiliated. One or two of the Russian guys may have followed while the girl walked to the salon with one of the guys or was followed by them. Smith and one or two of the men in question hung out drank more in a lonely spot smoked some pot or drank or what ever. Then I feel one or two of the men may have had consensual or non consensual intercourse with her. Then left her there making sure she was dressed maybe even going as far as cleaning her off. Then I think they may have gone to the guy and actually bragged of the encounter enraging him or knowing he had allot of money rolled him like a drunk and threw him over with him fighting for his life.

[Christian]

I think obviously there is fal play involved. I hate to say it but from what I have read so far of Smith hanging with these animals that raped a girl or had possible drunken intercourse with her which is just as bad . I feel that Smith is not Suzy clean hands. She knows more and is either a good liar or has a major mental block. There is most definitely something there, between those three Russian guys and the very pretty Mrs. Smith. I don’t care what the poly says. Smith may very well be completely innocent but my NYC street sense tells me that there’s allot more that she knows. I will tell you what I think happen.

I think they were at the bar and all hanging out having fun, they all got a bit too drunk and those Russian guys sprouted major erections for Smith. I think these guys were smart and played them against each other successfully breaking them apart. He may have gone back to his cabin leaving the girl at the bar because he was embarrassed of her public flirting and was humiliated. One or two of the Russian guys may have followed while the girl walked to the salon with one of the guys or was followed by them. Smith and one or two of the men in question hung out drank more in a lonely spot smoked some pot or drank or what ever. Then I feel one or two of the men may have had consensual or non consensual intercourse with her. Then left her there making sure she was dressed maybe even going as far as cleaning her off. Then I think they may have gone to the guy and actually bragged of the encounter enraging him or knowing he had allot of money rolled him like a drunk and threw him over with him fighting for his life.

[Sandra]

Does anyone know where I can find the photo of the blood stain on the overhang?

[George]

Where is Captain Stubbing when you need him!!

[webangelpb]

I don't know if you're the same person who'd e-mailed me before, but if you're not please do not e-mail me again. I'm blocking this address too.

As for your asinine comments, which do nothing to rebut my "right wing views", I won't respond. You're on your own there. As I've said to the person who sent me the previous e-mail, it shows that you have nothing to counter what I'd said. Until you do, I won't be responding to anymore of your comments.

Oh, by the way, since when did drinking responsibly become puritanical?

>>>>>
[quote]Dean Gruginski grugind@yahoo.com wrote:
people shouldn't have to behave in a puritanical manner consistant with your right wing views to be unmolested by criminals...what poor logic is that you moron.[/quote]

[JOE]

I guess if I were investigating this case, the first thing I would do is check the security tapes. Let's see, this incident happened in July? I guess with the limited resources of the F.B.I. it would take over six months to find the part of those tapes that should clearly show what happened to Mr. Smith that night. Sure!
Now I'm no conspiracy nut, but this just plain smells. Just imagine an improbable scenario for a moment.
Let's suppose the "Russian boys" could possibly have some connection to Russia. Certainly the F.B.I. would have no interest in them, right? Now suppose Mr. Smith ended up partying with these "gentlemen" and being that they were less than career operatives, combined with a large helping of alcohol they got to bragging about their "profession". Now I don't know how it works in the real world, I would think that this would create a bit of a problem for our "Russian boys".
How quick would you be to identify some of your own kind in a potential murder case?
Hmmmmm, makes you wonder don't it?

[Bozo]

Jennifer Hagel Smith obviously was involved with her husband's death. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a fool.

[Bozo]

Sorry, I meant to add this to the above post:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/01/06/AR2006010601586.html

Jennifer Hagel Smith was observed kicking her husband, the night of his death, "A man who disappeared from his honeymoon cruise last summer argued in the ship's bar with his wife, who kicked him in the groin hours before he vanished, two witnesses said Friday.

The witnesses told The Associated Press the FBI has interviewed them about the July 5 disappearance of George Allen Smith IV of Greenwich. "I was very surprised by their behavior, that a honeymoon couple would act that way," said Margarita Chaves, a 29-year-old teacher from Phoenix.

Jennifer Hagel-Smith denies this ever happened spewing, "That's not something I would do to my husband."

But her denial is a flat-out-lie.

This is because Jennifer denied having any memory of that night, "Hagel-Smith and her attorney say she was unconscious and has no recollection of what happened."

Well if she denies any memory of that night then how can she deny what she did or did not do? Impossible.

Furthermore... When pressed about where she woke up that night (as taken from MSNBC's Scarborough report) Jennifer remains cryptic and sufficiently vague; even to the point of challenging her objectors:

SCARBOROUGH: So, we get through the night. You wake up in the morning. And there are two different stories about where you woke up. And, again, one said you woke up in the room. The other said you woke up three flights up. Can you tell us where you woke up?

HAGEL SMITH: It's nothing scandalous. I can say that, if that's what people are wondering. It's not scandalous.

SCARBOROUGH: Yes, but you can understand why they would ask the question.

HAGEL SMITH: Right. Of course.

SCARBOROUGH: You're on your honeymoon.

HAGEL SMITH: Of course.

SCARBOROUGH: Yes.

HAGEL SMITH: Sometimes the answer, the truth is more basic or more simple than people like to think it is. So, people can, you know, read into that as they will.

Clearly she is a liar and probably, a murderer.

BTW, how was poor Jennifer granted an audience at a joint House Subcommittee on National Security, Emerging Threats and International Relations and Subcommittee on Criminal Justice, Drug Policy and Human Resources hearing on December 13th. I can't even get the Government to pave the damn roads in my town yet they have time for this nonsense? WTF.

[webangelpb]

(QUOTE)BTW, how was poor Jennifer granted an audience at a joint House Subcommittee on National Security, Emerging Threats and International Relations and Subcommittee on Criminal Justice, Drug Policy and Human Resources hearing on December 13th. I can't even get the Government to pave the damn roads in my town yet they have time for this nonsense? WTF. [QUOTE]

I find this interesting too and within such a short period of time. Amazing. If only we all could have the same access, wouldn't it be great?

[SafeCruise]

Our prayers are with all families that have suffered any
type of loss during a cruise.

Now posted at safecruise.blogspot.com:
Coming in 2006: PROJECT SAFE CRUISE
Project Safe Cruise will consist of a one week cruise in 2006 that will showcase the type of security and safety system that could be put in place by cruise lines to insure the safety and security of all passengers and crew and at the same time preserve evidence of crimes and/or accidents. We must focus on a postive solution that will benefit all parties involved and prevent future tragedies. If you are interested in learning more and perhaps joining the cruise or if you represent the press or would like to sponsor or help plan the cruise please leave contact information in the comments section or send an email to safecruise@hotmail.com.

On May 12, 2005, we were passengers on the Carnival Destiny traveling between Barbados and Aruba when an elderly couple disappeared without a trace. The crew searched all cabins on the ship the next morning around 3:00 AM, There was no investigation that we were made aware of and the only information Carnival would give us was that they turned the ship around 8 hours after the people were found missing and we searched for them in the water for a couple hours. We had enough time to stop in St. Maarten but not Aruba. We saw and heard from no law enforcement. Three days later when we got off the ship in San Juan all passengers were given a flyer to report anything they knew to the FBI. We did not know if there was foul play or an accident. If you were on that cruise please post a message. If you have had similar experiences involving poor or non-existent safety and security procedures on a cruise please post a message at http://safecruise.blogspot.com/

We sent a letter to congressman Stupac and Senator Levin on 7/29/05 asking that Congress take action to improve safety and security procedures for customers of travel companies in the Caribbean and South America. The entertainment director on our cruise bragged that the US Health Department had examined the kitchens and food service on the ship a few days earlier, yet we see no involvement by US authorities when two people disappear. We saw no involvement by any type of law enforcement for the final 3 days of our cruise until leaving the ship on 5/15/05 when we were all given flyers about the missing couple.

It is not the number of deaths as much as it is the fact that Americans pay the cruise companies billions of dollars each year and they do not provide adequate security or safety. In fact they engage in cover-ups and should be prosecuted for aiding and abetting criminals, being accessories after the fact, destroying evidence, and contaminating crime scenes.

Questions for Congressman Shays and the subcommittee::

I went to the web site for his subcommittee and there is nothing on the schedule about the Cruise hearings. When will private citizens be provided with a way to comment or submit evidence. It seems that MSNBC or the sub-committee should make it easier for average joe's to have there voices heard. They are also welcome to use my website or email address. The comments could be submitted to the sub-committee for consideration.

Don't we have air marshall that fly on international flights? Couldn't we have sea marshals that ride on cruise ships and have authority negotiated with the cruise companies to investigate safety and security incidents? They could be funded by fees paid by the cruise companies.

Alabama's governor has called for a nationwide travel boycott of Aruba because of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. List of 42 Cases of Persons Overboard on Cruise Ships since 2000 Now Posted at Cruisejunkie.com. Cases between 1995 and 2000 are also listed. Maybe we should be boycotting the cruise lines, especially Carnival who has had the most incidents.

Someone seems to be getting away with murder. If I ran a bar and called 911 to report that a gentleman fell against the wall in the back of the bar, split his head open and died, do you think I could ask them just to send over a hearse and take the body to the morgue? I do not think so, but that is what the cruise line is getting a way with. I will go to jail for tampering with a possible crime scene. Even if it were an accident, I might be liable and I am not the one to make such a judgment. The cruise company seems guilty of aiding and abetting criminals. They are an accessory before and after the fact and should be prosecuted as such. It they are preventing countless crimes and accidents from being solved they are also permitting criminals to go free and commit additional crimes and they are avoiding liability for lax safety and security measures. We must demand through our Congressman that charges be filed against the Cruise lines. They are liable if the destroyed evidence and the crime cannot be investigated. Even if there was no crime they are liable because of safety problems. The only pressure these large corporations might respond to is money. Perhaps if they were sued and forced to refund the fares paid by all passengers on cruises where people disappeared, they might think twice about not following the law. A class action similar to the one filed against the tobacco companies might be in order. They continued to disregard the law and put the health and safety of thousands of passengers at risk and then they conspired to cover it up. A small portion of the proceeds could go as refunds to passengers and to compensate family members of the missing. The balance could go to establish a reporting, monitoring, and compliance mechanism to make them report all crimes and accidents involving passengers and crew members and follow all laws pertaining to preserving crime scenes and evidence and allowing real law enforcement agencies to investigate.

On a previous show Joe stated that Cruise ships should be required to be flagged in the United States if they have American Ports of call. Unfortunately, this will never happen. They don’t even pay taxes. Will Carnival provide better safety and security for those housed on board the ships contracted by FEMA for six months than they do for regular cruises? It might be worth interviewing some of the people staying on board for several months. Carnival, which is headquartered in Miami but incorporated for tax purposes in Panama, paid just $3 million in income tax benefits on $1.9 billion in pretax income last year, according to company documents. This is the same as if I made $100,000 last year and only had to pay $75.00 in taxes. "That's not even a tip," said Robert S. McIntyre of Citizens for Tax Justice. U.S. companies in general pay an effective income tax rate of about 25 percent, analysts say. That would have left Carnival with a $475 million tax bill. No wander the FBI does not want to investigate incidents on Carnival ships. If Carnival paid the $475 million in taxes they should pay, the FBI could afford to have an agent on each cruise to monitor safety and security. (Personally, I believe that state, local, and Federal government agencies should not give any contracts for Hurricane repairs or anything else or do business with any companies that have headquarters outside the United States and funnel their profits off shore to avoid taxes)
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9507503
Maybe we should charge them increased fees for each American passenger and use the funds to put a safety and security program in place. Congress should act to assure the safety of all passengers in the future by requiring background checks for some passengers and all crewmembers. Perhaps an "Amber" type alert for everyone on the ship and nearby ships within minutes of someone going overboard. Perhaps a sea Marshall program like the air Marshall program. Vacationing and retired civilian and military law enforcement personnel could have free cruises to help monitor and investigate security and safety problems. They should have authority to deal directly with the FBI or other government agency.

Joe Scarborough had excellent quests on his show. However, the people who do know what actually happened on the ship before, during, and after Mr. Smith's disappearance would be the crew members, including stewards, bartenders, waiters, etc. There’s is always at least a half dozen crewmembers and stewards working each floor at any one time. They watch everyone as they come and go, know their habits and patterns and have access to the cabins. Waiters always know what is going on between guests in a restaurant, bartenders always know intimate details about bar patrons, and hotel staffs always know what is going in the hotel. We could now prove it but we were sure that the stewards were looking through our closets and drawers during our cruise as things would be out of place. We could not find anything specific missing. What kind of background checks are done for crewmembers? The government should also ask for and analyze statistics on the number of crimes and accidents that happen to crewmembers. If the crew is not safe in the under belly of the ship then the passengers will not be safe either. I will bet you that the crewmembers working on the ship when Mr. Smith disappeared have since been fired and their records destroyed. Since 6 people have disappeared from Carnival ships in the last year, I think it would be appropriate to cross check and compare the list of crewmembers and passengers between the ships involved. It is just not those directly involved in the disappearances that are affected. Every passenger on each ship had their vacation ruined by the cruise line ability to ignore common law enforcement and safety procedures. We spend three more days on the sip after the couple disappeared on May 12, and we did not feel safe and we felt a little guilty that not more was done to help them and their families.

[Linda]

I think things are pretty obvious. Jennifer was dead drunk!..they found her on the opposite side of the ship!...she was flirting with these other guys. I think tempers flaired between the guys, he either fell, was pushed or killed and throw overboard. I don't think it was premeditated; an accident. It's absurd to she her speaking on talk shows like she was this perfect wife who doesn't party.
If she hadn't gotten drunk and passed out, i'm sure George would be alive today.
She is So transparent; and blaiming the cruise line...FOR WHAT?..are they supposed to have cameras in all the rooms to see whats going on.
A bunch of Drunks...they only have themselves to blaime. She should be embarressed.

[Ophra's Show today.]

I truly believe they were targeted. I think it was a well thought out plan to pirate their money in open seas. I think they were both drugged so they could be physically separated without either one of them alarming the authorities. I also think the cruise lines was very insensitive. They took her off the liner to talk with the police. The liner then left her stranded in a foreign country for two days. She had to stay another day wbecause she had to wire home for air fare money. A week later the cruise line Company sent her the bill for what she and George owed on the trip. Can you imagine getting a bill? On the Ophra show Jennifer mentioned this to the cruise line executive representing the cruise liner company. Unreal!

[Terry]

I watched the Oprah show and have seen other TV and news media reports. My take? Jennifer's self-righteous attitude is so over-the-top I can only conclude that she is acting and trying to deflect questioning away from her own behavior that night. I feel certain there's more to her story that she prefers the public not know. The fact that's she's not even come clean with her In-Laws speaks volumes. Amnesia I don't buy at all - unless there was a date rape drug like GBH - maybe...that's possible - but why wouldn't she have had herself tested the minute she realized she couldn't remember anything and that her husband was missing? Why didn't authorities insist on it? Was she ever medically examined (beyond the Turkish strip search)? Anybody know? Whatever the case, her judgment sorely lacks and her attitude reeks of sanctimoniousness...and she's surely no saint.

[Heather]

I also watched the Oprah Show today, I do believe that Jennifer had nothing to do with this. I believe that for whatever reason George was murdered. As for Jennifer being passed out in a corridor on the same floor with no memory of the events that evening I believe she was drugged. As someone that has been drugged before and woke up in a place I knew nothing about passed out on the bathroom floor I too did not remember anything from that evening. For some reason these two inoccent people were targeted for something that obviosly went arye and they had to kill George. Could it be that they were possibly trying to do something to Drugged Jennifer and George caught them? Just a thought

[Karen]

My thoughts exactly. I think they drugged her & were having sex with her when george walked in.

[Margaret Smith]

I think, after reading and seeing as much evidence that is available, that both the bride and groom were drugged. Apparently, the people involved had spent some time together before the crucial night. I think the Russian men were involved along with possibly the casino worker and the young man from California - 5 men in all. I think the men drugged Jennifer and one took her to the far side of the ship (maybe the casino worker) and the other 4 took George back to the room. There was only one man left in the room with George (the other one probably attending to Jennifer, and the 3 others were seen leaving in the hallway and later ordered room service). Maybe he threw George over the balcony thinking he would fall overboard but instead George landed on the awning. Then someone realized that they could be caught and decided to jump down (thus the big thud of a man landing on the awning) and push George into the water. Jennifer wakes up, not remembering anything, and goes back to her room probably thinking George is either out jogging, having breakfast or whatever. She probably welcomes the time alone so she can try to figure out what happened. Maybe she was even raped by the men considering that they were thrown off the ship 3 days later because of a rape charge with another passenger. At any rate, they seemed to know a lot about liquor because some reports mention that they were drinking an exotic, banned liquor that was said to induce hallicinations.
I saw the Oprah show and I don't believe Jennifer knows anything and is just now coming out of enough shock to fight back against the rumors about her being involved.
I'd be willing to bet that this murder was all about a robbery gone bad.

[webangelpb]

I've watched and read a lot of reports about this case as well and I have to say while I don't think Jennifer had anything to do with the death of her husband, she definitely is not the saint she tries to portray. Whether she was drugged or just plain drunk has yet to be established, but I haven't seen any report that said she made it back to her room herself. She was found by the crew and taken back to her cabin in a wheelchair. The question foremost in my mind is Why would a woman, on her honeymoon, wake up after a night of drinking, not being able to remember much, not seeing her husband around, go off to the spa without first finding out if he's alright? Did she also forget that she was on her honeymoon and that she had a husband? How is it that she remembered her appointment at the spa? She is also not saying (or not allowed to say) what she said to the crew members when they found her. I'd really like to know if she'd asked about him. Hmmmmmm....interesting.

[Rich V]

I too saw the Oprah show and there was something about Jennifer that was extremely suspicious. She kept deflecting the blame and was more concerned about the way Royal Caribean treated her after the fact. She was demanding a face to face apology from the cruise line president who was also on the show. (The President was an excellent spokesman) But Jennifer seemed to beg for sympathy from the audience, Oprah, or anyone who would listen. She certainly is not the innocent victim that she wants everyone to believe. She definetly had something to do with the murder but I'm not sure in what capacity. How come nobody is talking about the whereabouts of these Russian boys. Are they in custody? Have they been exonerated? Have they even been questioned? Message to Jennifer--Come clean with EVERYTHING you know so George's parents can get some closure. Your actions are similar to someone else who was in your shoes..........Scott Peterson

[TOM]

I AGREE WITH THOSE WHO THINK SUSPICIOUSLY OF MRS. SMITH. SOMETHING IS NOT RIGHT WITH THE WHOLE THING. WHILE TELLING HER STORY SHE RARELY MENTIONED GEORGE'S NAME. HER MAIN CONCERN WAS WHAT WAS THE CRUISE LINE GOING TO DO FOR HER. I THINK SHE WOULD BE HAPPY IF SHE GOT A FREE CRUISE. IS THAT AWFUL OR WHAT? I BELEIVE SHE HAD SEX WITH SOME OF THOSE MEN ALSO. GEORGE WALKED IN AND THAT WAS THE END OF HIM. THEN SHE PLANTED HERSELF IN SOME FAR OFF CORRIDOR ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE SHIP, AS IF TO BE CONSIDERED " NOT INVOLVED " MY ASS!!!!!

[TOM]

I WOULDN'T COMPARE HER TO SCOTT PETERSON. THAT'S A LIITLE DRASTIC. THE ONLY THING THE TWO STORIES HAVE IN COMMON IS A DEAD SPOUSE. THEY ARE COMPLETELY DIFFERENT. I'M NOT SAYING SHE IS COMPLETELY INNOCENT BUT I DON'T THINK SHE IS NEARLY AS VICIOUS. JUST MAYBE JUST AS STUPID.

[melinda]

i saw the Oprah show yesterday. The way Jennifer acted and spoke, she doesn't look like someone who just lost a husband in a very tragic accident. She smells fishy... and skanky..

[cromwell]

There are certian crucial details missing from all of the stories that I have read:

1. Did they win money in the casino?
2. What was the lifeboat situation: it is reported that the bloodstain was on the lifeboat awning -- were all the lifeboats there?
3. It is reported that there were 3 unaccounted passengers on the morning of July 5. Jennifer was found in the spa. George was not found. The third?? They will not release details about the third.

If they won money in the casino, then it is perfectly plausible that the two were drugged -- it is also reported that they were drinking Absinthe: that would do it -- then separated, then a robbery occurred. Robbery explains the trashing of the room, slamming things around, maybe in an attempt to open locked items, etc.

I saw the picture of the stain on the Oprah web site and it appears that the body was dragged or rolled off the awning. Could be that the murderer -- yes, I'm assuming murder -- rolled him into the open ocean and took off in a lifeboat?? With the casino winnings. This is a big speculation, but the conspicuous absence of the three details above makes me wonder about how important they are for the case.

In all, though Jennifer's behavior is odd -- not appearing to care about the whereabouts of her husband -- this is explainable by Absinthe. They had just been to Greece and Absinthe is available there. Absinthe will rock your world, make you hallucinate, make you black out. It's nasty stuff. Personally, I don't suspect her of any foul play.

(I grew up in her home town and I am familiar with her family. It's difficult to imagine that she's involved.)

[anon]

She said on Oprah that she doesn't remember what she was drinking that night. This seems weird to me. Almost anybody who's been to college can tell you exactly what they were drinking before they blacked out. Usually because they wake up the next morning with a monster hangover and say, "Dude, I'll never drink that (insert alchohol here) again." Granted if drugs were involved, this is a totally different ball game.

BUT, if she was passed out drunk/drugged/whatever in a hallway at 4:30 am... how did she feel like getting up and going to a spa appointment at 8 am (I believe she said 8 am on Oprah)? Seems very illogical to me. Hangovers like that will make everything down to your toenails ache - you don't just bounce back from them after 3 hours sleep and get up to go to the spa.

And about that drinking thing - Doesn't the ship keep a tab of every single drink they bought that night? When I've been on RC Cruises, you can't pay cash for anything - you have to put every single drink on your ship's card (also your room key) and then pay your tab at the end of the vacation. No one has mentioned what their bar tab was for that night. Seems like an easy enough thing to check, especially if they sent her a bill a few weeks after she got home.

And finally, my last question... I cannot IMAGINE getting on an airplane and going home after losing my husband of 8 days without an answer to his disappearance. I would be fighting tooth and nail to stop that ship, get help, bring in the calvary, whatever it took. Not just get on a plane and give up.

This whole story is bizarre and it's keeping me up at night. Ugh.

[Clary]

I saw the Oprah show and also can't stop thinking about this story. I don’t know much about this expect from what I saw on the show and what I’ve read from the posts.

I don't remember anyone on the show mentioning anything about 3 Russian boys, and if they did, they did not elaborate on this at all, which seems odd. I don't know if maybe no mention of or hardly any mention of these 3 Russian boys on the show has anything to do with the FBI investigation and for that reason not much on these 3 boys was said. You'd think that those boys allegedly raping a girl would at least be mentioned since the couple was supposedly hanging out with them.

I agree with a lot of the posts saying that Jennifer’s behavior on the show was a bit odd. She mentioned on the show that her relationship with George wasn’t like that, that she trusted him so him sleeping else where was not something she would give much thought to. So waking up and not seeing him there was not strange. However, like so many other people have mentioned on the posts. Who wakes up and goes to the spa after drinking as much as she did? I’m assuming she drank a lot since she supposedly blacked out. I have 3 glasses of wine and the next day my head hurts. OK, so maybe she drank a lot and felt crappy and went to the spa to relax, get a massage, but she was able to wake up so early after such a night of drinking, and with the same cloths on? If she was drugged, wouldn’t she feel a bit off the next day, or as if something was not right? Wouldn’t she wonder, “I can’t remember anything, I wonder what happened last night, where is George?” WHY OH WHY DIDN’T OPRAH ASK THESE QUESTIONS???? They weren’t there to interrogate her either, but these are just obvious questions that come to ones mind and the fact that Gayle kept saying, “I believe her, I believer her”, was so annoying. It’s not that I think she murdered him, but I do think she knows more then what she’s letting on.

Yes the cruise line was insensitive (sending her a bill afterwards) and as Oprah mentioned didn’t do enough, or as much as Jennifer and her family would have liked for them to do in a situation like that. However, I also feel that she should have taken some responsibility as well for what happened, and I don’t believe she did, or maybe shown some type of regret for drinking as much (unless she was drugged, which we don’t know).

I have a question for anyone that can answer. After being drugged, are your symptoms the same as a hangover, do you feel disoriented, can the drug still be found in your system??? I have heard of stories where girls wake up the next day and feel as if they had been drugged, that supposedly it’s a totally different feeling then having a hangover. No one on the show asked Jennifer how she felt after waking up. Did her head hurt? Was she nauseous? Did she feel hung over?

Also, if something like this happens, like Oprah mentioned, wouldn’t this bring you and your spouse’s family closer???? Yet in her case, for whatever reason, maybe because they know she knows more then she is telling, it did the opposite.

[Trish]

Am I the only one that finds the report of his sleeping in other cabins on previous nights really fishy? THEY WERE ON THEIR HONEYMOON! Who goes of sleeping in other cabins on their honeymoon? This I hope is seriously being looked into.

[dizney1]

a newlywed man sleeping in other strangers rooms on their honeymoon???? and she thought nothing of that??? she is found passed out in a hallway and dumped off at her room, wakes up in the am, and heads out to a spa appointment in the same dress as the night before??????? what???? she isn't looking for her newlywed husband, AND she does not notice any blood stains in her cabin???? WHAT IS THAT?????