Taylor Behl Case Discussion

Evidently there's some of that going on here. What amazes me in all this as an observer is how Internet technology can bring an entirely new context to the understanding of cases like the alleged murder of Taylor Behl.

Taylor, I suddenly lost through a slow a process as suddenly can be. I lost her to a once-friend of mine who may just have accidentally killed her, but who also may possibly have murdered her. She was really cool, and a sweet girl. Perhaps some of her being might not have agreed with some of the ridiculously strictly moraled people out there, but that's not really reprehensible. I'm not sure that I know anyone who can fit in with those.

Suprisingly, Ben's was a little harder of a loss to bear.

Comments

[cindi in pa]

Cino.......chill, and I know that is easier said than done. What strikes me here is the statements of girlfriends prior to Taylor that spoke of abuse at his hands. One young woman, maybe two in fear of their life. They are both things you need to consider. You are not a bad person because you were/are a friend of BF's.

My own experiencs shows, I should not judge you. And honestly, I do not. My marriage was surrounded with abuse. Some saw it, some only knew what I cared to share, even then, some did not believe. Hell, my mom still gives him birthday and christmas gifts! I have a sister and a brother who still care about him, and one brother who could care less if he ever saw him again. Seven sister inlaws that know what an ass he could be, but they still care. And, honestly, I still care myself, can't tell you why. Maybe its because I know the backround, how kind he can be and is at times.

I am sure you know the parts of Ben, he wanted you to see. But sooner or later you will have to deal with the fact, Ben had the ability, as expressed by his x girlfriends, to do harm. That is what you will have to deal with. BEN IS not a reflection on you. I hope you can find peace with this someday. I am sure you will.

[vedder]

Wow...I am stunned..

"hallowpointslug" said EVERYTHING I have been keeping inside me the last few months...I feel like I have been purged.

wow....

[smedley]

Click on the "going on here" link at the top of this thread, and you will see this from Mike Cino (hcjordan):

"I mean, for all we know, Taylor could have blackmailed Ben into engaging in asphyxiation using the threat of a statutory rape charge."

What a PUNK! He should call BF's lawyer with that theory. It's as good as my idea that evil leprechauns led by Burl Ives murdered Taylor and framed BF.

[New Creature]

Smedley- I think Cino was illustrating that there may be lots more to this story than we can imagine; things we've never even considered. I wouldn't take offense to the statement. I don't think he was being literal considering the rest of the post.

[Captain Joe]

What a scumbag. Still defending Fawley as if she were the miscreant, not him. I wonder what Janet thinks of Cino. I suspect Cino already knows what Janet thinks of Cino. That's why he didn't go to Taylor's funeral.

[vedder]

"I mean, for all we know, Taylor could have blackmailed Ben into engaging in asphyxiation using the threat of a statutory rape charge"

I read that and thought "yea, uh,ok Mike.I know you are trying to make a point but...is that REALLY something you thought could have happened?"....I cant belive he could even write something like that....

Yea Mike, Taylor was going to "blackmail" someone into choking her so she could get off..

You can tell how much he "loved" her, cant ya...

[Liz]

It was a bad example for Cino to say that about the "blackmail" scenario, but you have to look at everything else he said, too. He's in pain about this ordeal, and I'm sure he's wished that there was something he'd done to keep this tragedy from happening. Taylor is gone, Ben is in jail, and this guy is trying to come to terms with the situation--just like all of you are. He was closer to the situation than any of us--he knew Taylor and he knows Ben. I'm not saying that makes him right, but it does mean that this did touch him, and he has to recover. Maybe when he does he can give LE a little more perspective. For now, I think people should lay off him. He won't be any help to anyone if he has a chip on his shoulder---ESPECIALLY a chip on behalf of his friend Ben Fawley.

[teresa]

This guy really needs to see a shrink. First off if what I called a great friend ditched me offer a few bucks, I would not call that a friend.

This guy seems to have a problem also. He can't get BF out of his mind.

[Jonathan]

I don't think I'de have any easier a time trying to rationalize the supposition that someone who I lived with for an extended period of time might have killed another friend of mine.
Careful before you throw stones.

[teresa]

I don't think I'de have any easier a time trying to rationalize the supposition that someone who I lived with for an extended period of time might have killed another friend of mine.
Careful before you throw stones.

Posted by: Jonathan | Dec 5, 2005 3:15:34 PM

I am not casting stones. If BF could throw away a friendship because of a few dollars, I would say so long. By the way I did know a guy that killed someone and it was caught on video tape. His name was Dennis Orbe. You can look it up. They showed it on tv. He was executed for his crime. He dated someone I knew and never in a million years did I think this guy was capable of doing anything like this. I watched the tape a few times in shock and then it was ok, this is him and that is that. Cino needs to wash his hands of BF. Taylor is the innocent one here.

[nova]

The connection of the Internet to this case has not been fully explored. There are several connections that come to mind. Ben and his own websites. The live journals and myspace postings of the individuals involved.And sites such as BuringAngel,suicidegirls,onemodelplace,&vegporn I never knew existed. What else is out there? Besides the fact that T was so young and pretty and that BF was more than twice her age it was the underworld of the internet and its present uses by this young generation that struck me as interesting. I never knew people would post such intimate pictures and thoughts and feelings for all the world to see. And I am not sure that it is such a good thing to do. Seems to me that it is not a good idea at all.
The main problem is that the entire adult world is coming through these computers right into the brains of young children. Not even libraries have filters on their computers as far as I know. This is a wonderful invention but like the automobile it can be wrongly used. And I feel parents are in the dark and children are using it in ways parents dont even realize.

[Jonathan]

"This guy really needs to see a shrink."

"I am not casting stones."

There's a big difference between suggesting that someone needs to clear their head and declaring that they're mentally unstable and need to see a therapist.

"By the way I did know a guy that killed someone and it was caught on video tape."

Again, big difference between knowing the boyfriend of a friend and someone who you lived with for several months.
Oh look, another big difference, 'caught on video tape.' That is undeniable unrefutable proof. The fact that even though we have judged Ben (believe me, I was one of the first to condemn him, having had him break into my apartment and witness first hand his psychosis), the fact remains that without proof beyond a shadow of a doubt, there is still a degree of uncertainty involved in this case. As such, don't judge Cino for his ability to look at things from different perspectives. I applaud an individual who will think about things for himself rather than just take what seems most readily apparent and make it his own.

[teresa]

The main problem is that the entire adult world is coming through these computers right into the brains of young children. Not even libraries have filters on their computers as far as I know. This is a wonderful invention but like the automobile it can be wrongly used. And I feel parents are in the dark and children are using it in ways parents dont even realize.

Posted by: nova | Dec 5, 2005 3:44:32 PM

Oh, but we must trust our children. You want to know where our computer is at home? In my bedroom. They want to get to it, they have to come through me. :) No movie channels on cable either. I buy their video games and I know who their friends are. If something happens, I know I did everything I could to teach them the best I knew how. I scared the crap out of them when they were younger on strangers.

I hope I taught them that they could talk to me about any and everything. No matter how bad. That is the best we can do.

[vedder]

Photo location has been found..

[vedder]

Here is the link

http://www.nbc12.com/servlet/Satell...d=1128768541933

[abigail]

new blog about location...

[bob]

"Mistah Kurtz, he dead."
So wrote Joseph Conrad. Virginia is a long way from the Congo, but I think I see the heart of darkness and it's in fRawley.
I agree with Vedder: the most intelligent, reasonable and coherent character posting on the thread referenced above is "hallowpointslug." I wish this person would post here too. I don't agree with everything he or she said, but the jest of it, the logic, is rational. Too bad though, you might as well be talking to the wind on LJ. They aren't comprehending. And perhaps they never will.
And if you don't agree with them, then you are "ridiculously strictly moraled." That's the irony of ironies. A man who doesn't step up if another man assaults a girl, or question what he steals or from whom, lecturing us on the virtue of "morals" like some modern-day Aristotle. But oh, he'll just "lose faith in people" if you disagree with him or challenge his belief systems, which are impossibly rigid---fRawley is not a bad person, we can't prove he did this." The confession? "Oh that was rigged." The murder? "It's possible she blackmailed him" They have an answer for everything, this crew. Except this: This house of cards is built on sand. And soon enough it will all come crashing down. Oh heavens, what will they do then? I'm counting the days to reality check.
And I find this one entertaining as well: "I applaud an individual who will think about things for himself rather than just take what seems most readily apparent and make it his own."
As if someone can't think for him or herself and reach the conclusion the nut is guilty as shit. Of course this comes from one who says his own apartment was burglarized by fRawley and he witnessed first-hand the "psychosis." Still he wants it on video tape, before he will believe. Like St. Thomas, he wants to stick his fingers in the wounds. Perhaps that very thing would have freed them from their mind control. To smell the stench of death at the crime scene. To see what was left of this beautiful person with a lifetime ahead of her.
I sincerely hesitate to use the religious "cult" word here, but this seems eerily similar. Ever try to tell one of Jehovah's Witnesses that the human soul (as a separate life force) or that "heaven" exists? Try it sometime. You'll get the same sort of reactions we are seeing here. And you can argue till doomsday it will make no difference.
I know about abuse too, I've experienced it firsthand, and what I learned from that experience is this: I walked away and never looked back. But it didn't take a murder for me to see who the nut was. It didn't even take arrests for assault for me to see who was crazy. Someone didn't have to pitch a car jack through a window for me to realize, gee, there's a problem here. And it didn't take years. We have these things called eyes and ears, it helps to open them. These two men, "roommates" had no strings holding them together, no kids, no marriage, no joint bank accounts, no joint credit card bills. And who's the victim here? Mike? His misery is self-made. He's a victim of himself.
But when you make mistakes, be a man and OWN IT, all this evasion and hiding and excuses is very self-preserving, but it's less than genuine. All you had to say to her was, "Be careful, BEWARE OF SKULZ, he's not right upstairs, you know?" She could have, and she may have ignored you. That would have been HER call, not yours. Now you can't sleep and wonder why. I'm sorry if you aren't understanding. Owning it is the first step towards healing thyself. You must find someone to help you through that, a doctor. fRawley is an evil person with a dead soul.
It's a shame, really, the whole sorrid affair.
"Evil prevails, when good men fail to act." That's a Chinese expression BTW, not a ridiculously strictly moraled Christian one, FYI.

[nova]

Bob: I understand what you are saying. I felt that way myself. But try to back off a little and calm down and give Cino a break. Hindsight is 20-20. He had no way of knowing this would happen.It would be nice if we all could see in the future. But we cant. By all accounts Mike had nothing to do with this. He was smart enough to get away from BF just like Erin was but it is wrong to expect him to go all around Richmond warning people about BF. In fact, how do you know that he did not indeed warn T about BF. Maybe he did. Please give Cino a break. Get off his back. Lay all your anger where it belongs. On BF. There is nothing wrong with waiting for the trial for all relevant facts to come out. Yes guilt can be spread all around and I am sure it is. You could blame any number of people for not doing more to protect this young girl. But finally it all comes down to one person and one person only and that is BF.

[vedder]

Nova
The first weekend Taylor went to check out the school...to visit and "stay" with HER FRIEND MIKE, he was not even there....

He stayed with his girlfiend that weekend.

He left his 17 year old friend alone with his 37 year old "criminal" roomate

No, it was not his fault,but....

[nova]

Vedder: Yes I remember reading that in posts long ago. That was the first time she went down to VCU and her father took her there and met BF if I remember correctly. Mike was not there as you correctly state. I think the FATHER was taken in by the youthful looks of BF and nothing rang a bell of alarm in his head at the time.
I heard from someone who knew T in Vienna that it was her father that wanted her to go to VCU not her mother who wanted her to stay closer to home.
But again I feel it is wrong to blame anyone for what happened to T except BF.
"Who knows what evil lurks in the heart of man?"
"The Shadow do".

[vedder]

Nova
Mike KNEW BF had a "thing" for really young girls...

Before the trip Janet asked Mike to "watch out for my baby"
She said,"he assured me he would.."

He left her with a 37 year old stranger.

Like I said,....Its not his fault,but....

[bob]

Nova, I respect your view, but on this one I have to stand firm in my opinion:
EVIL PREVAILS, WHEN GOOD MEN FAIL TO ACT.
I say mike's a good man, he just failed to act.
There have been several inquiries on his LJ, to the effect, "did you warn Taylor?" and he conveniently ignored that question. Consistently. Fact of the matter is, he could and probably will soon say, "yes I warned her." How are we to know? Only he and Taylor know for sure. Just why does it take take two months to answer the question? I beleive he has a conscience. Life you can evade, death you cannot.
Again, a good man, just a little confused. Maybe fRawley's Manchurian Candidate.

[nova]

Bob: Also keep in mind Cino is very young. He was/is just a young boy. These kids try to act like adults but they are still kids. Dont expect him to act and think like a full grown adult. Most all of the people posting on this Journal are older people. How many of them can remember what it is like to be 18 or 20 or 22? I saw and did(and did not do) many foolish things at those ages. I never felt I could control the destiny of other people. Warning T would have been great. I agree. I think Cino was unaware of the true nature of BF. He couldnt see it. Did not understand it when he saw it. Cino is still just a kid try and remember that.
On another subject. He mentions several people lining up to write books on this case. I am sure there are also those in line waiting to sign up those involved for their book and movie deals.
Many true crime writers and tv shows will be looking at this and working on it. I would guess all those who might be witnesses cannot sell their stories until after the trial if they intend to testify. Thats a good thing.

[bob]

I understand your view NOVA and respect it, but 22 is not a young boy anymore in my opinion. Also, he is quite articulate and I suspect has above-average intelligence, is college educated. In other words, he was smart enough to know better. Smart enough to perceive what he was seeing. Smart enough to have the full benefit of 20/20 hindsight, and still he says, "Ben's was a little harder of loss to bear."
That's just plain silly, a silly thing to say at this point in time, knowing all that we know now. I am done moving backwards.
And don't forget, he knows more, seen more than we know about. I will not abdicate responsiblity. That's a real problem. For whatever reason, as a society we have arrived at an age where no one is responsible for anything.

Obviously all this deliberation will not change what happened. It's too late for Taylor.

But this is my hope: Maybe someone reading this feels something isn't quite right with someone in their life. Maybe a friend is in trouble. Maybe it's drugs, maybe it's a threat of suicide, maybe it's an outside threat from someone like fRawley. Maybe these words will trigger their mind to act, to step up and speak, do something to try to help someone they truly care about who is in harm's way. Is chivalry dead?
All it takes people, is one phone call to a clergyman, a teacher, a parent, a grandparent, brother, sister. You may not succeed. But you will feel a lot lighter knowing you tried.
Was it Socrates who wrote that you can tell a lot about a society by looking at how the men treat the women?
What if Janet got a call from somebody, a friend, even anonymous call? Would we be here now?
Doesn't the Talmud say "Whoever saves one life, saves the world entire?"

He who saves one life, saves the world entire.

[k]

Bob,
Cino commented today on another thread:
http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2005/12/taylor_behl_cha.html#comments

just thought you might find this interesting.

[bob]

K,
A touch of anger there, I see. And just as I suspected, quite intelligent---or he has an attorney giving him good counsel. He's right--a newspaper or magazine would never use anything from his LJ unless confirming with him first. And he hit exactly on the reason. There's no way to confirm that's what's being posted at HcJordan is even by him---someone could have posted stuff there using his user ID.
As far as the other point, the "ethics" , it doesn't wash. It was posted publicly, there's no liability issue. It's his personal opinion and he's entitled to it. Remember when Pat Robertson said "we oughta take out and assassinate terrorists" or something to that effect and it created a little firestorm because he was a Christian evangelist, yada, yada, yada? Well, that all came out of one TV interview and every news market in the country went hog wild and no one asked "permission." Course journalists could see for themselves he said it. The Internet is a different animal but the same theory applies.
I guess he will testify before the Grand Jury. I wonder if the prosecution will subpoena him to testify about the violence fRawley showed towards women. From some posts I got the feeling he may have witnessed things that the prosecution might be VERY interested in. Wouldn't that be ironic?

[nova]

Bob: Another thought. Cino may have been very afraid of BF. Other people too. Maybe they didnt want to face a mad BF.

[teresa]

Hey Bob,
with the gag order, I wonder if Cino should be posting about BF and Taylor at all. If he lived with him, I am sure the defense will call him to say what a loving person BF was.

I say if you don't want your post copied and paste, DON'T make it public.

[bob]

Well Teresa he says he's not going to testify. Not exactly sure how to interpret that. They don't need him for case? Time will tell.

Nova I considered that angle, but now that fRawley is in jail they are "safe" to badmouth him if they wanted to, but they are not doing that.
Cino keeps saying that taylor was not the lilly white virgin everyone believes. There was some talk of her and her mother not geting along all the time or as swimmingly as everyrone thinks, who are we to know? Teens and parents disagree sometimes it's part of life. But he said fRawley and her had no 'relationship," just friends that had sex a few times. this is all on his LJ I am not making it up.

[Sara]

Ok folks, The only reason Mike Cino keeps writing about this in his journal is because he is an outcast loser who loves that everyone is clicking on his webpage and giving him attention for the first time in his life. Quit going to his livejournal and giving him what he wants. If any of you met him in person, you really wouldn't value his opinon anyway. Trust me, you wouldn't even hire this guy to mow your lawn. He's going no where and neither are his friends (BF). See where he is in 10 years, probably working in a record store telling anyone who will listen about the Taylor Behl case.

[nova]

Sara: What is so bad about working in a record store? I know a young man who graduated from VCU sometime ago and he works in a record store. He is also an artist. He studied painting at VCU. What did you study?

[sara]

The fact you would even ask what's wrong with a college educated person working in a record store makes me think you're probably a waste on society as well. Not that it matters but I work in the financial industry. I'm just saying I grew up in NOVA and I know a little something about Mike Cino. If the fact he's trying so hard to get his 15 minutes of fame off of the death of one of his friends isn't enough to illistrate his selfworth you could look at the fact he was living with a near 40 year-old loser in college. He doesn't exactly hang out in with "upper crust" of society. He just writes all these strange rants on the internet about "giving Ben the benefit of the doubt" because he's trying to hide the fact he doesn't really have anything important to say or contribute.

[nova]

Sara: Such harsh words. What did Mike ever do to you? Guys like record stores. And some guys make big money selling old LP records and even new CDS whether you know it or not.
I am a 65 year old retired guy. I am not a waste on society. I put in my time and paid my dues. Not every one wants to work in the financial industry.
Mike,E,and R are going to get their 15 minutes of fame when the trial starts whether they want it or not. And whether you want it or not. Maybe they did not ask for this attention. Have you ever thought of that? Come on give these kids a break. They arent perfect like you are but they are doing the best they can. They are also "art school students". That means they are different from you. And different from other people. Cant you tolerate a little difference in people. You come across as harsh and judgemental. Why are you so angry about this? Of all the people I've read you are the most critical of Mike. I just dont get it. Is he your son? Or brother? Are you his keeper? What is so great about working in the financial industry. I consider that very boring.

[Sara]

HA! Just what I thought! Mike is posting like he's not Mike Cino on these sites! Very, very sad...

[nova]

Sara: The above was written by me and I am not Mike. Why dont you come over to Mike's LJ and we can really duke it out?
Who are you and why are you so angry at Mike? What has he done to you? And why wont you post comments on his LJ? That is where the action is now.
I will tell you I am a 65 year old man. I live in northern Virginia. I have been married to the same woman for 40 years. I have two grown children who are doing well. One is a lawyer in NYC. And the female runs an art gallery in Chicago at a University.
How old are you? You dont seem very mature.
I got started on this because I too mourned for Taylor and grieved for her and her Mother. But as time goes on I feel Mike and his friends are getting a raw deal. I dont see how they can be blamed for what happened to Taylor. That is just one person. BF. He confessed. As far as we know no one else was involved. If you dislike M,and E,and R. just because they knew and were friends with BF at one time that is not fair. Or if you dont like their lifestyle that is their business not yours.
Come on over to Mike's Live Journal and lets get it on. I would like to see Mike defend himself against you. Have a Happy New Year. JBS