Natalee Holloway: One, Two, or More Phone Calls?

This post follows up on this post as regards possible phone calls received shortly after Natalee Holloway's disappearance - at least ones I had become aware of some time ago. I've tread lightly around the subject as it was unclear what, if any calls may have taken place. Their significance was and is still unclear as far as I'm concerned and I was given the impression the subject was a sensitive one - so I said very little about it. I am only reporting this now as it appears the subject of phone calls will be coming up in the news.

I've been told but have been unable to corroborate that there were two phone calls which came into students cell phones after they left the island to return home. It was my understanding, again, unconfirmed, that they were heard as messages received on the journey home, but placed sometime during the night of Natalee's disappearance.

One call was said to have come into the phone of a male friend of Natalee's. The other was said to have come into the phone of a female student on the trip. I'm not naming them as per a previous agreement with the source of the information.

I was told by an individual who heard the call which came into the Male's cellphone that it sounded like "Aruban" voices in the background saying, "What's your name? What's your name? Reportedly, that was followed by a faint female voice which sounded like it said, "Natalee." The impression given me was that the male voice or voices on the call were intentionally trying to get the female to state her name for the purposes of the phone call. In essence, to identify the female to the receiver of the call.

I did identify another individual who is known to have heard "a" phone call into a cell phone that night. When I tried to confirm what I was told by one source, I was told that there was no female voice, only a male voice saying, "Who are you calling?" And that was it.

I must repeat, I have not been able to corroborate this information and it was never clear to me whether or not I was hearing two different interpretations of the same call ... or if the two individuals I spoke with personally had actually heard two different calls.

Hopefully some light will be shed on the situation on Thursday's Dr. Phil show - but, really, I have no idea. I'm only relating what I have been told by reliable sources, but have been unable to independently corroborate.

Comments

[Marilyn]

Posted by: berry | Nov 15, 2005 7:38:22 AM

Great post, berry! Very logical and well presented... I agree wholeheartedly!

[mchenry]

Brooke
Beth certainly does look like a grieving mother.
When your child comes up missing-I want to see pictures of you so we can all make fun of You! You are so rude! Why would Beth say for Natalle to call her on her cell phone? Natalee's cell phone was in her luggage. The lady that notified Beth used Natalee cell phone. If you honestly think Beth had something to do with Natalee's disapearance-you have a screw loose. As far as the life insurance that you think the family had on her-DAVE HOLLOWAY SAID THERE IS NO LIFE INSURANCE POLICY! I'm sure Dave has better knowledge on this than you do. Why are you so fateful?

[betsy]

After having read the recent posts concerning Beth, Dr. Phil, the possible phone calls, etc., I've gotta say something ain't right about this story. Either Beth is hiding lots (and I think she is), Dr. Phil needs to be hospitalized instead of putting others in the hospital (and I think he does), the phone calls were real or made up from the start and used by Beth and others to get people more interested in this case (anything's possible), or we all need to take a good, long vacation in ARUBA! Yep, that's the answer!

Look, if Dr. Phil had a clue and Beth really is alive or might be, Beth would look crazy and foolish if she didn't exhibit interest in what he knows, can prove, and has to say. Her reluctance (so far) to seem to buy into his new twist on the case smells a little to me. AND, I remember when Beth was HOOTING about the phone call(s) she received from Beth. Where did all that go? She shut up about that a long time ago about it and I'm wondering why?!!!!!?

[mchenry]

Betsy
Hope you have a great time on your long trip to Aruba. Better watch you back though-Aruba LE does not investigate crimes.

[betsy]

mchenry,

Doubt if I'll need the Aruba LE because I'll travel with others (always), drink responsibly and carefully, and watch out for myself. I have travelled to London, UK seven times, Nice, France twice, St. John and St. Croix, and numerous places in the US. I've never had a problem, but I've been very careful. That's what it really takes as far as I can tell. Ain't no way Natalee was being careful. Nope. Of that, I think we can be certain. I still don't understand why anyone would want to blame ALE for NOT INVESTIGATING this crime. The amount of money and time spent by the ALE is astounding. No way the same amount would ever be spent on a missing person in the US. I just don't believe it.

Another thing, if I'd experienced difficulty in any of the countries or places I've visited, ain't no way I'd expect the LE to conduct their investigation the way I WANTED THEM TO. That's just rediculous.

[Only One]

If it true about all what I was reading about those phone call and that Beth was thinking that Natalee was alive that can exlaine way Beth went along in middel of the night in the first week being in Aruba to the Alto vista church.She did asak a taxi driver to bring her to this church.I think she did not go to pray in the middel of the night.You don't know the place you saying that Aruba is a dengerous place,than what,maybe went to bring something to some one.You guys know where is the Alto Vista church,no, go and find that out you will be surprice.Beth is a case of full of surpriceses.

[Only One]

Sorry Beth is a box of surprices.

[betsy]

Only One,

I think you are right about Beth!!

[reality]

Does anyone recall the interview with Depaks mother when she said her son pulled over because Natalee was making a phone call. For some reason no one questioned that and it was just ignored. It was an interview done at her home, I think it was Greta V. (not sure), but most likely Fox news. I couldn't understand why the interviewer didn't expound on the comment.

[mchenry]

The first 48 hours are the most critical in the investigation. They start out with finding who were the last persons with the missing person. The Aruba LE let the 3 run free for 10 days. I'm sure you could destroy a lot of evidence in this length of time. What happened to the evidence that they carried out of Joran's apartment? Why was PV property and home not searched? I feel the LE in this case has a conflict in interest-they are buddies of PV. Why did the LE not do the search dives? Why did the LE not do the landfill search? Why was the landfill filled back in while ES was still working? Why was the belt not tested? Why have the last 2 bones not been tested? Why was the FBI not called to get the permission for the deep sea equiptment to be used? They obtained DNA by mucous membrane swabs from the 3 suspects. THEY DID NOT EVEN OBTAIN THIS CORRECTLY. Did they reobtain the DNA? No. They allowed the 3 suspects to lie. WHY? Joran will tell the whole story someday. LIKE WHEN? In the US the families of the missing persons are kept up to date. I do not have any respect for the Aruba LE for botching this case.Dompig even said on Tv that he thinks the 3 are guilty as hell. Natalee probably was drunk-but she did not deserve to die. The VICTIM Is NATALEE!

[INDIANAREDNECK]

Dan is reporting on what was said in cell phone calls that he has not heard that he has no evidence of except that one person has told him about them. And you people make fun of Jossy's reporting.

[mchenry]

Dutch.
Joran still has his family. They can see each other. Talk with each other. They can continue to lie because the Aruba LE allows it! Dutch, I do hope you never have a child go missing. The VICTIM IS NATALEE HOLLOWAY!

[Words]

Third, the moneys in the other account are set up to help in the search for Natalee as well as helping to support the family because of missed time at work or not working. The trustee has a legal,binding oblication (known as a fiduciary responsiblity) to oversee these funds and how they are expended. As well as the Twitty's having the same oblications Should they not be spent in accordance with specific guidlines a variety of things can happen. Lawsuits, penalities, not to mention taxing issues, fraud and the list goes on. There is no big windfall for the Twitty family from those funds.
Posted by: Scott | Nov 15, 2005 9:22:45 AM

Ahhh... but we do not know what the exact terms are, the terms may be as simple as "to cover the expenses of Natalee Holloway's family, or any other person deemed necessary" as seen fit by Beth Twitty. No time frame restrictions, no monetary ceiling, no restrictions at all other than to pay the expenses as seen fit by the "trustee". The "specific guidelines" may have been outlined not by the law, but the trustee, Beth, herself. "Helping to support the family because of missed time at work or not working." is a very broad guideline. It could cover anything that the trustee thinks it should cover without breaching her fudiciary duty.

[reality]

this case will be over when you emotional weak poeple stop donations to beth.
Beth is not looking for nat.
beth is not paying any bills !

nat. maybe suffering in south america as a sex slave, while beth is collecting money and not looking for her daughter.

Even phil is trying harder to find nat. than beth.

Its so stupid to see a group of grown ups to go from bar to bar in cancun, mexico city or caracas thinking they are going to find nat. this way. how stupid could you be ?

MEXICO CITY OR CARACAS OR COLOMBIA OR SAUDI ARABIA IS SO BIG SO LARGE , ITS SO SAD TO SEE A COUPLE OF GUYS IN THEIR 60 -65 ASKING FOR GIRLS TO SEE IF THEY WILL BRING UP NAT. HOW STUPID COULD YOU BE ??

BY THE TIME THESE GUYS TURN 120 YEARS OF AGE THEY DIDNOT PASS ALL THE PLACES YOU FIND PROSTITUTES ONLY MEXICO CITY.

NOTHING NEW IN THE CIRCUS SHOW ,

JUST WITH A PIECE OF.........REALITY ....!!!

[mem]

If it true about all what I was reading about those phone call and that Beth was thinking that Natalee was alive that can exlaine way Beth went along in middel of the night in the first week being in Aruba to the Alto vista church.She did asak a taxi driver to bring her to this church.I think she did not go to pray in the middel of the night.You don't know the place you saying that Aruba is a dengerous place,than what,maybe went to bring something to some one.You guys know where is the Alto Vista church,no, go and find that out you will be surprice.Beth is a case of full of surpriceses.

Posted by: Only One | Nov 15, 2005 4:43:44 PM

-------------------

Only one:

That was something that always have bother me, why was she there, and when she came back in the car she was laughing and very happy!!

[007]

we all know by now , that beth is no angel, maybe a witch and is involved in something.!
One thing we also know for sure, its all about money!!!
YOU WILL SEE JUST BEFORE CHRISTMAS NAT WILL POP UP , WITH AN INCREDIBLE, ABDUCTION STORY, TO MAKE BOOKS AND FILMS.

SO THE DONATION FUND ACCOUNT THAT RUNS IN TO OVER 5 MILLIONS FROM YOU EMOTIONAL WEAK PEOPLE WILL FILL THAN EVEN MORE !!

AND TO COMPLETE THE CIRCLE OF STUPIDITY MOST OF
YOU GUYS WILL GO AND SEE THE MOVIE TOO !!

JAMES, INVESTIGATING

[hockeygirl]

JAMES OO7---

You sully the name. I, for one, would appreciate a picture of Nat sitting next to Good 'Ol St. Nick on his sleigh as he drops her into her mother's chimney in Alabama. And then a picture of you, a la 007, making love to Natalee and her mother in front of the fireplace while drinking a martini-shaken, not stirred. Perhaps Christmas cards? Make sure you send some to Joran et al. so they can share in the fun.

Unfortunately, the world is not full of sugar and spice and evrything nice -- or -- justice for all. Here's a bit of reality: a response from the Dutch Ministry of Justice to my letter via email to the Ministry:

Thank you for your letter, in which you ask my attention for the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. As I understand from your letter,
this incident has shocked you, and many others with you. I have received many letters in which people express their concern about the criminal investigation in this case.

First of all, I deeply regret the disappearance of Miss Holloway and I sympathize with her family. I sincerely hope this case will be solved
very soon. In reply to your letter I must inform you that I cannot be of direct service to you. Although Aruba is part of The Kingdom of the
Netherlands, I have, according to the Charter for the Kingdom of the Netherlands (Statuut van het Koninkrijk der Nederlanden) no jurisdiction in individual criminal cases on Aruban territory. The Aruban Minister of Justice [Randy Croes]is responsible for the criminal investigation and prosecution of criminal offences in Aruba. I am therefore unable to express an opinion regarding this case. Consequently, I have handed over your letter to the Aruban Minister of Justice.

Yours sincerely
For the Minister of Justice
Chief of the Legal and Policy-Support Department
R.R. Joesoef Djamil

Hmmm, well this just seems to get us back to where we started-good 'ol Croes. I sent Mr. Djamil another email asking how Aruban judges and the Minister are overseen, disciplined and removed since they are appointed by the Queen. So far, no response....In Mr. Djamil's world, it's like putting the fox in charge of the hen house. But who's in charge of the fox?!..........

It appears that foxes oversee a very strange system of justice in Aruba; one where normal theories and rules of evidence do not apply.
Normally, "EVIDENCE" consists of testimony, facts, documents and physical evidence. For example: 3 boys seen driving vic away from bar= fact (evidence); vic seen stumbling drunk when left bar and got in car = fact & (witness) testimony (evidence); 3 boys drive vic to beach and one boy kisses vic on beach = (admission) testimony (evidence); 3 boys are last to have seen, and been with, vic while alive=fact (evidence); admission and/or confession of suspect that 3 boys all had sex with vic that same night=(admission) testimony (evidence); vic never heard from or seen again after having left bar with boys = fact (evidence).
Of course, if a body were recovered, we would probably also have physical evidence such as semen (3 types? ), DNA (ditto), abrasions and bruises, possible cracking of the skull with a blunt object and/or subhematoma, possible stab wounds etc.

All these types of evidence,THAT ARE ALREADY ESTABLISHED, are valid and admissible in a criminal trial for kidnapping, battery, rape,and possibly murder. (You might want to research the case of the mother and son currently in prison for murdering their wealthy landlord--the point? There was never any body found.) Further, testimony by third party witnesses as to vic's (Natalee's) physical and mental state of mind (i.e. too drunk to walk properly, let alone be able to knowlingly give valid consent) is also "evidence" and admissible.

Let's have a recap:
(1) Forcibly taking physical control of vic w/o vic's consent or moving or transporting vic without vic's consent = kidnapping. Also, refusing to allow vic to leave after initial consent-but change of mind-kidnapping. (Note that kidnapping does not require transport of the vic; meremy holding vic in a locked room with no escape=kidnapping.)
(2) Forcibly detaining, or restraining, vic (w/o consent) so that vic is not free to leave = kidnapping
(3) Consent must be SPOKEN OR WRITTEN and must be freely, knowingly and voluntarily given by the vic, w/o the use of drugs, alcohol, force, coercion, intimidation ("Who would believe you against us? "My dad is a judge...")threats, or abuse (or threats of abuse to vic or vic's family or threats to sully girl's reputation as a "Goody Two Shoes").
(4) Consent only applies to acts/matters that have been consented to within bounds of agreed time frame; i.e."I will have sex with you" does not mean "I will have sex with your friends too" or "I will have sex with you for as long as you want, as many times as you want, any way you want...etc."
(5) Any change in environment, location, specifics, persons involved, number of persons involved, acts or matters outside of or in addition to subject matter of the "first consent", or FRAUD (i.e. "It will just be us baby-and I won't go all the way" etc.), void the prior consent in its entirety, and may, in addition, = additional crimes if acted upon.
(6) Consent, once given, and even after given, may be revoked at option of the vic, at any time and at any place without reason or explanation (i.e. vic can "change her mind") and any such revocation voids the prior "consent" as of that moment.
(7) Once a person intentionally puts another person in a knowingly dangerous situation or leaves a vic in a knowingly unsafe location, that person will be liable for any harm that vic suffers as a result of that abandonment (i.e. vic left naked on cold beach after being raped and subsequently dies from exposure = rape AND murder).

In applying this law to the Boys' action/inaction, let's see what we can come up with:
(1) According to numerous witnesses and the boys, Nat was stumbling drunk as she left Carlos & Charlie's
(2) Joran admits to taking Nat to beach and to "kissing" her
(3) Deepak claims they all had sex with her
(4) Joran claims he left her at beach
(5) Natalee never seen/heard from again.

Some initial points:
(1) If Nat was stumbling drunk in beginning outside bar, Q as to whether she gave legal consent, or could have-as to getting in car, as to driving to beach and not hotel, as to driving to beach and not Joran's house (or vice-versa)
(2) Even if Nat "sober enough" to consent to get in car and/or drive to beach, did she also consent to "making out" with Joran? With other 2 watching and/or there? Did she agree to kissing but nothing more? Did Joran tell her he wanted nothing more? And, even more troubling, did Joran tell Natalee that only he would "make out" with her?

Even though we only have THEIR side(s) of the story, part of that story involves Deepak's admission that alll 3 had sex with Natalee, which raises some very troubling questions:

(1) If we believe the suspects' position that Nat was lucid and could and did give legal consent to get in car and/or go to beach, don't we also have to believe that Nat could and did give legal consent to having sex with all three of the boys?? (In order to find Deepak credible.) and
(2) If we believe the boys' story that Nat was lucid at the beach, we must also believe that absent more liquor or drugs administered at the beach, Natalee made a knowing and consensual decision to have sex with three different boys. It seems to me that this is really where the boys' lies break down. Nat supposedly had expressesd some level of interest in Joran on previous occasions; there is NO EVIDENCE of her ever having expressed such interest in the two Kalpoe brothers or any type of interest in boys like the Kalpoes. And the reason is obvious-they weren't her type! Joran was tall, white, clean cut, athletic, smart, cosmopolitan; the Kalpoe Bros. were dark, small and somewhat "gangsta" looking.
Even if Nat was sober enough to willingly consent to getting in that car, even if she was sober enough to willingly consent to being driven to the beach, even if she was sober enough to have willingly consented to "making out" with Joran on the beach-and possibly even to "going all the way" WITH JORAN- there is NO WAY that she would have then willingly consented to being slobbered over, groped, pulled at and f----d by two boys that she had no interest in, probably looked down on and never would have even had as friends; they were not at her level physically, economically or academically. The ONLY way "all of ...[the boys would have] had sex with Natalee" would have been if Joran and one of the brothers held her down while the other raped her OR if she had been unconscious due to a date rape drug or severe intoxication rendering her powerless to defend herself. The Kalpoe brothers are scrawny, sweaty, swarthy, sleezy, low-lifes that Natalee wouldn't have looked twice at or given the time of day to. To suggest that she would have willingly consented while sober and lucid to making love with either of them is outrageous, absurd and defies common sense.

Can anyone still logically believe that the boys "did nothing?" That Paulus did nothing? Hmmm, ever hear of obstruction of justice? Destruction of evidence? Do you know what happens to American lawyers that counsel their clients to hide or destroy evidence, hide or "get rid of" witnesses, lie on the stand or even let them testify knowing they will lie? They are disbarred. Let's hope that the Beth Bashers and JoranDP Fan Club out there are as sympathetic to all the many "boys" out there when they see their mother, sister, daughter, cousin or girlfriend/wife, half-naked, bloody and lifeless at the morgue after getting a ride home from 3 men that "did nothing wrong." Maybe 007 can get Santa on the case...

[jen]

So no post since 2005 what is the latest anyone headr anything?

[kangonow]

I found the below post on a forum, and thought it very interesting and truthfully it makes sense to me. What a twisted story. Natalee had NO business out drunk and climbing into cars in the wee hours of the morning...where was Mom then.

I tried to do more research on these details of her actions for 10 hours but could not find.

This is it: (not my post)

BETH slut- TWITTY
The ‘slut-mother’ of missing whore NATALEE HOLLOWAY is back on the breaking news accounts on Tuesday June 5th for Beth’s documented indiscretions regarding her actions including having more “relationships” with people she should probably have no contact with. Perhaps Ramsey is not yet aware of the travesty involved in the case of Beth’s still-missing daughter Natalee, and the reasons why Beth has any interest at all at ever finding Natalee. An un-educated person may say that Beth is only a mother looking for her missing child where the child displayed a high propensity of illegal and unethical conduct within hours of her disappearance. IE: suspected prostitution, confirmed drug possession, and confirmed drug and abusive-alcohol misconduct, confirmed multi-sexual (at least 8 within the last several hours according to the Aruban authorities) partners, just to mention a few items. But, the educated and informed realize that Beth is only looking to hopefully find a dead body, not an alive Natalee, so that Beth may be able to cash in on that multi-million dollar life insurance policy Beth took out on Natalee just several months before the trip to Aruba. Personally, I know of no other high-school-student that has an active multi-million dollar life insurance on any student, do you? Beth’s only obstacle to securing the multi-millions of dollars is confirmation of Natalie’s death by means other than by suicide, hence an expected lump-sum insurance payoff to Beth. Natalee was a proclaimed “whore” by the Aruban authorities by Natalee’s documented and verifiable conduct just within the last several days and hours of her disappearance, including the investigation substantiating Natalee having sex with no less then eight different people within only hours of her last known sighting. Maybe slut-Beth should go back on Nancy’s show so Beth can publicly document her continued wrong and actual illegal conduct she has already established, and to further allow Nancy Grace to stick her foot back into Nancy’s mouth once again since both appear to be so ill-informed and unaware to the actual facts of the case involving the disappearance of Natalee Holloway, as well as to the facts documented in the continuing search for the missing whore.