More On Miller

People think because I choose a particular topic that I have a particular agenda - maybe sometimes I do. But not when it comes to reporting, or simply stating what I read and believe.

I link other sources for people to read so you can make up your own mind. Any adult debate here which flows from that is fine by me. But individuals who make up Internet names to toss off stupid, or uninformed comments are generally ignored.

Here are some snippets of an extended profile of Miller ... make up your own mind. I'm not sure it paints one picture or another, perhaps that's why many people disagree with one another on this topic. But some of it doesn't lend itself to Miller being the guy I would want doing the looking for my missing child. Yet, I continue to praise him because at least he does step up in whatever manner he does.

I don't think he has evil motives, or is out to profit ... but I also think that when honest, well-meaning people act in a misguided manner, someone needs to be honest enough to point that out.

Tim Miller, whose sixteen-year-old daughter, Laura, was found dead in the killing fields, is so convinced of Abel's guilt that he has left threatening messages on his answering machine, demanding that he confess. "There are many days when I think about driving over there, putting a gun to his head, and pulling the trigger," Miller says. "When I'm near him, I feel like I'm in the presence of evil."

Yet there are problems with the allegations against Abel: Not a shred of physical evidence has ever been found linking him to the four women found dumped in the oil field, no evidence has been uncovered by any police department that can connect him to the murders they have been investigating, and no witness can place him with any of the teenagers or women before they were found dead. What's more, he has never been arrested for any crime, nor is there any known record of a criminal complaint filed against him. "My life has been destroyed, my reputation ruined," Abel told me when I first met him earlier this year. "I didn't kill any of those girls. I wouldn't know how to kill."

Abel is aware that the police and the FBI have studied every inch of his life. Descended from a family that came to Texas seventeen years before the Civil War, Abel was raised on a ranch in Bellville, a tiny town between Houston and Austin. After graduating from Bellville High in 1957, he married his sweetheart, Jane Ross -- they later had a daughter and a son -- and headed off to the University of Texas at Austin, where he earned a degree in aerospace engineering. In February 1962 he took a job at NASA, and in the evenings he attended graduate school -- first at the University of Houston, then at UT-Austin, where he wrote papers with titles like "Analytic Solutions to Interplanetary Transfers."

Still, the damage had been done. Because the affidavit about Abel had been filed in open court, it was available for the public to peruse. Detectives from other agencies, frustrated with their own unsolved murders, began calling the police in League City to ask about Abel. After Tim Miller read the affidavit, he started parking outside Abel's League City home at night. "I wanted him to know that I would never forget what he had done," says Miller, who several times a week had been driving out to the site where Laura's body had been found, standing before a wooden cross he had erected there in her memory. "Every day since 1986 -- every single day -- I had been waking up thinking about the last moments of Laura's life. I wondered if she was on her knees, begging for her life. I wondered if she had the time to call out for me or her mother."

After Laura's death, Miller began drinking heavily; six months later, he and Laura's mother, Jan Miller, divorced. One afternoon in 1994, unable to contain his grief any longer, Miller called Abel and said that he planned to kidnap him, take him to Las Vegas, and bury him alive in a sand dune outside of the city. A few days later Miller claims he showed up at Abel's house, dragged him out in the yard, and held a gun to his head. (Abel denies this ever happened.) "I was about to pull the trigger when I realized that it wouldn't have mattered," Miller told me. "There was nothing on his face -- no fear, no emotion, nothing. He had no conscience."

But there would be no peace. What Abel did not know was that a new investigation was about to begin at the killing fields -- one conducted by Tim Miller. He had tracked down the owner of the 25-acre oil field and persuaded him to lease it for $ 10 a year. The cross he had put up for Laura had been knocked down, and he believed Abel had done it just to spite him. "If I have to, I'll dig up every inch of this property to find some new evidence," Miller told me.

Without informing the League City police department -- "They think I'm a little crazy" -- Miller borrowed a tractor and a backhoe and persuaded the Greater Houston Search Dogs team to join him in his first dig. As Miller drove his tractor past the cross that marked Laura's body, the dogs began to fan out. Whenever any of them stopped in a certain place and "alerted" (that is, barked to signify that they smelled something), Miller would head over there and dig. The whole thing seemed fruitless but understandable -- a way for a father to deal with his grief. I sat on the tailgate of a pickup truck with Miller's construction buddies watching the late-afternoon sun turn red and then a sullen orange before it began to sink beneath the horizon. "I don't think people here realize that ol' Tim will want to keep digging all night," one said with a grin as he popped open a beer.

Although he refused to take a police-administered polygraph test about the killing fields murders -- he (Abel) said he didn't trust the League City Police Department as long as Bittner was on the payroll -- he did take two lie detector tests conducted by private examiners, who say he passed. Still, perhaps because no other legitimate suspect ever emerged in the case, Abel never could erase the suspicions about him. Some law enforcement officials said the beta-blockers he took for his high blood pressure could have affected the results of those tests.

Read it all - and make up your own mind.

For those who feel it is never justified to even suggest anything negative about someone who has been a victim of a tragedy at some point in their life - let me say the following. In my opnion, all that does is enable the "victim" to remain a victim, potentially forever. No matter how this ends up, I hope the family of Natalee Holloway is able to pick itself up, put itself back together from an understandable suffering ... and go on. I cannot fathom their staying trapped in this nightmare forever, regardless of the outcome.

In my experience, individual's who do that never wind up healthy, happy, as productive as possible or spiritually complete.

Update: I honestly didn't realize it when I wrote the above - recently another website linked the same article and celebrated the news that Robert Abel was reported to have committed suidice. A google search yielded no confirmation. It was called poetic justice in their view.

Comments

[AkekoaHoAlethia]

Dan,

"honest enough"

Well spoken!

That's all I ask in the end myself....

That's the "missing link" in this entire story!!!

[DennisAOK]

Posted earlier:

I gave money to Texas EquuSearch. I thought Miller's personal story moving, and that the expertise he had gained from past experience in these situations would be invaluable. I still think he is a net plus, but my conviction is not as strong when I hear him tell a reporter, "There's going to be a funeral in Alabama next week", or he has a bead on where Natalee's body is because he has been working with a psychic.

My next donation is going to Dave Holloway.

[SeattleGirl]

One of my cousins was kidnapped and murdered by a serial killer when he was only fifteen. Five years after the fact it was all his mother talked about. I don't believe that I can judge her for being obsessed with her son's death anymore than I can judge Tim Miller for his behavior. It's clearly very difficult for him to be logical when he becomes consumed with how horrible his daughter's last few moments must have been like. There are some experiences that people endure whereby it seems that all you can do in the way of support is just pray for them.

[CancunGirl]

I find it understandable to act beyond reason when the crime of a loved one goes unsolved. Many have turned their tragic stories into positive action in helping others recover a loved one, deal with their tragedy, or help fight for tragedies like theirs not to happen again. Many heroes have emerged like John Walsh. I know Tim Miller means well and like Dan said, is not out for profit or has "evil motives". Yet I have to agree he sounded crazy last night. Hopefully, he can reign himself in and STOP looking foolish and acting unlawfully. That will only make this circus become grander in the eyes of the whole world.

[FloridaPatty]

Dan, one of your better ones. Excellent!

[LePeau]

I have to repeat myself partly: a very good post! From my side no ifs and buts (who would care anyway), just: a very good post, Dan!

[AkekoaHoAlethia]

SeattleGirl

Hello...

That is a horrible thing to have in one's memory, especially concerning a loved one.

I certainly understand and appreciate your comment and experience. And, sadly, this may be another case of a "serial killer," whether just starting out, or perhaps, a history never brought to so much light? I strongly agree with the prayer ideas.

[PinkCobrazz]

I feel Texas equusearch makes Tim Miller feel important and needed. Texas Equusearch is a wonderful organization and provides a great
service. BUT!!!!....Tim Miller needs to learn
where to draw the line. He is not an FBI agent
or an investigator. He is not either..and needs
to only search those areas of interest provided
by the FBI or those with authority..and not go
off on some witch hunt or agenda of his own.

In this case he has clearly crossed the line.

[ashleigh]

Thanks again Dan for being a lone voice in a rough wilderness of misinformation, hyperbole and emotional rhetoric.

Tim Miller is re-enacting his own grief and unresolved anger in these cases. There's a noble cause in assisting families in searching for answers, but, he's a crusader who's a self-styled vigilante, not concerned about breaking the law, himself, or victimizing others, as he sees fit. He has decided that he, alone, is judge and jury, fit to exact vengeance, at any price.

His behavior this past week is contemptible, and the Holloways and Twittys are very foolish to allow him to remain on the island and undermine their cause. They are not thinking clearly, because if they were, they'd get rid of this nut.

He was within his rights to request to search Paul van der Sloot's property, but, once he was refused, he has absolutely no right to threaten the man. He stayed true to that threat by searching the next door neighbor's property, and then going back to the van der Sloot property today (according to Scared Monkeys) where all the media outlets were set up and ready to film the showdown. To his great disappointment, Paul was not home. Otherwise, I can see this nut putting a gun to his head, like he threatened the other man with (according to him.)

He is the ugly nutcase American, and I am embarrassed by him, humiliated for the Holloways and Twittys to be represented by such an incredibly vile, hateful and vigilante renegade. He doesn't care about missing people. He wants to hurt people and that's his crusade and cause. He wants to be on television every night spouting his hate-filled words and accusations, imflaming the public and turning this into a 15th Century WITCH HUNT. SHAME ON THAT MAN! I don't care what he suffered 20 years ago. He needs professional care somewhere, and a lawsuit, or arrest for harrassment, unlawful behavior, and illegal acts.

The H/Ts need to wake up and get rid of all these parasites and people from left field who have attached themselves to their high profile case. All of them are using them for their own benefit, and it stinks worse than the dead animal carasses that idiot Tim Miller is digging up in the landfill. SHAME ON HIM! He is no longer the victim. He is the victimizer and he's using bereaved and heartbroken people for his own sick and totally selfish purposes. HE STINKS.

[Rosebud]

Dan, I respect your feelings toward Tim Miller, but until I have walked in that man's shoes, I will not cast the first stone,

Also, until I am out there in a thrash dump working hours through medical waste, maggots, and God knows what else, I will not past judgement on Tim Miller's actions as to why he is doing this. I would much rather focus and remember the families that he has helped.

[Coolbeans]

My sister lost her only child. She is another Tim Miller. She just would not stop. How could I blame her. She brought so much pain to so many people because she was hurting so, so bad. But she destroyed lives nonetheless. If you didnt agree with her, watch out.

People thought she was crazy, what they did not know was my sister worked for the FBI (no not an agent, but in low level mix) for many many years and had connections who caused problems for people.

It was horrible and she still is not the same and I dont think will ever be. It has been almost 10 years. So sad. She has gone from one religion to the next. Some say searching for God. I say searching for Jayson. A name we never mention around her for fear of the tirade. I am patient but It gets exhuasting and old. Therapy was a big fat bust. She probably screwed with him too. lol. (not funny but ya know funny.) She is a mental whirling dervish.

My brother lost his only son about 2 years ago. Devistated but picked himself up dammit and went on. That is what TJ would have wanted. (Tom Jr.). I was in awe. Yeah he still stings. He is so pissed but says you have to go forward, if not for himself, his other children.

It is a fucked up world.

I pray the Holloways go the route of my brother. The other road has is a dead end and will eat them alive.

Coolbeans

[ashleigh]

Wonderful post Coolbeans. I'm so sorry about the tragedy in your family.

All of us sometime in our lives experience loss, or tragedy, maybe not murder, but, none of us are immune to life's misfortunes. We are still accountable for how we behave. If someone steals from me, I'm not justified in stealing from another, or even taking the law into my own hands and exacting revenge on the one who stole from me.

That's why we have laws. Tim Miller is not certified in Law Enforcement, and while many professionals volunteer their services with him, a good number are civilians, and fellow victims, like he is, like Rachel COoke's dad. Instead of turning this cause into a positive thing, it is an unhealthy pit of resentment and vigilante forces, combined to override laws and even showing contempt for LE.

He's a bitter and broken man, but, he has no right to victimize others who have rights to legal search and seizure procedures, via search warrants, and professional law enforcement agents and investigators.

He drove a man to suicide, and there was never any proof that he ever committed a single unlawful act. What right did he have to destroy another person just because he feels he is omniscient and personal tragedy gives him the opportunity to exact vengeance on whomever he picks as his target? He's a sick and vicious man, in my opinion, and Aruba should put him on a plane home this week.

[mariaK]

On top of the anger management problems and inability to accept boundaries, we now find out that Tim is a drinker who admits to holding a gun to someone's head. He needs to be off Aruba and back in the psych ward.

[Richard]

As to the matter of a beta-blocker affecting the memory of Abel so much as to change the result of a polygraph test, I'm familiar with propanolol (a drug used in PTSD and the most likely candidate for a beta-blocker to be used for blocking memories) reducing the hyperarousal associated with traumatic events, in effect separating the emotion of fear from that of the arousal trigger, but I've not heard nor does literature seem to support, a claim that it would erase or diminish memory, making it useful to beat a polygraph test.

In fact, a 1992 study reported in the Journal of Applied Psychology, evaluated the use of antianxiety drugs, including propanolol, as countermeasures in the detection of guilty knowledge. The results showed that drug status had no influence on the outcome of the Guilty Knowledge Test. (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=1556041&dopt=Abstract)

Of course I'm no psychologist, just a immunopharmacology guy - so don't hang your hat on what I have to say should you have the need to beat a polygraph. But I do think you'd have a better chance to take it rip-roaring drunk than counting on a beta-blocker.

Dr Sanity input could probably shed more light on the matter.(http://drsanity.blogspot.com/)

[Nuke Aruba]

How many caring Arubans and Aruban LE are at the dump...???...anybody else from the US volunteered to go to Aruba and do what TES has done...?..thats the bottom line. Tim might be wacko, and that doesnt excuse any character flaws or inappropriate actions...but if he wasnt at the dump..who would be?

[Jessie]

IMO there are some real sickos on the Twitty Team. I might poke fun at them at times, but that does not mean that I don't take them seriously.
I served with this guy in Vietnam who received the bornze star medal, but that kid was crazy as loone.

[Lisa]

Tim Miller's daughter was abducted and murdered back in 1984. After 21 years, I'd hardly think Miller had anything to do with Abel's alledged suicide.

[Coolbeans]

I agree Ashliegh. And thank you for your kind words. Our family calls our luck "Irish Lightning".
////////////////////

I feel the two families who could have helped The Holloways was

Marc Klass-Polly Klass' father and

Ed and lois Smart.- Elizabeth Smarts parents.

and even Mr. Groene. That poor poor man.

Talk about Grace under pressure. Those are two of the finest families I have ever seen. I remember crying nightly for Elizabeth. I never once thought she was dead. I was saying mormon extremist all the way (I swear). I was running around like she was my daughter when she was found.

I am on the fence with Walsh. Whereas I remeber Adam, sometimes I doubt his motives. I also was a little pissed when he said the Dutch forensics was a small office or something to that effect. They are one of the leading forensic labs in Europe.

I hate grandstanding leaches. I dont feel John Walsh is one, but......

I do feel the P.I., Tim and Jossy are.

Coolbeans-thanks for listening

[letsbefair]

Someone needs to put Miller back in his room at the psychiatric ward. Risking diver's lives looking for a "box" at the bottom of the sea. Because some psychic told him that Natalee was talking to her from inside the box. That's when I knew miller was wacked. Planning Natalee's funeral - that was another bizarre incident. Makes for a good TV show to have nuts like him and Jossy on.

[Lesli]

Been out of the loop. What did Tim do that was so horrible?

[dpa]

Interesting... "fool" is now a term of praise.

[In Aruba]

The Aruban Community donated $20,000 to EquuaSearch, plus Meals, Hotel, Water, Drinks, Laundry, (non-alcoholic) although Jossy does own Hooters, for Tim Miller and his crew to be able to stay on Aruba and search for Natalee. Their presense is welcome on Aruba and their search efforts are assisted in anyway possible. They are working on donation of heavy equipment in order to continue the Dump. They can stay forever if they would like. On the other, hand, why would Paul vander Sloot allow a lynch mob on his property that has already been searched by the Local Authorities together with the FBI and Search Dogs on June 11th?

[Coolbeans]

Amazing his search team was on camera looking for Natilee. Did he even call the Groene's to you know, help locate the two small children who could have used his help in those parks.

I am not saying he could have done anything to save them but he could have shared the wealth. And maybe could have flushed out that pig.

I will say it. Natilee was 18 and should have known better.(not that she deserved it, cause she did not) These two were babies in need and in a poorer community. I just think he could have sent some of his volunteer troops there as well. Not as glamorous or news worthy, but a needed cause.

Man, I am on the soap box tonight!!

Coolbeans-wishes all the little lambs could go home. Safely.

[In Aruba]

How many caring Arubans and Aruban LE are at the dump...???...anybody else from the US volunteered to go to Aruba and do what TES has done...?..thats the bottom line. Tim might be wacko, and that doesnt excuse any character flaws or inappropriate actions...but if he wasnt at the dump..who would be?

Posted by: Nuke Aruba | August 1, 2005 08:05 PM

The Dump was already searched and the Cadaver dogs were there more than a month ago. The employee at the gate takes the number plate of each car and the time it entered as well as collects the fee. HE did not see the blonde girl in the plastic bag. There are 4 other employees that work at the dumping dock who also didn't see anything. Why didn't this witness tell any of the employees 1st. The employees could have lifted the baby pool up and checked out the blond hair that moment and saved this poor family from 8 grueling weeks of worry. It still would have been devastating to everyone, but those responsible would be punished and the family could begin to mourn.
EVERY PERSON ON THIS island knew a blond girl was missing. A poster was on every window on Aruba. Don't you think that the Dump witness is just making a gamble that she might be there, (since she doesn't seem to be anywhere else) and win the $100,000 prize?
We are thankful that Tim and his crew are ruling out the Dump, so the family doesn't have to worry about what if?

[DeeDee]

Rosebud and Nuke Aruba, I totally agree with your post. Until we have walked in another persons shoes, lost a child to a horrific crime, we should not even begin to think we can judge their actions. We certainly won't have to answer for them either. I think Mr Miller may not be a very educated man but he does have the resources and the determination to endure what appears to be some very unreasonable circumstances. Lord help him. If we can't be part of the solution for heavens sake don't be part of the problem. These people, all who have lost close family to such morbid violations, deserve our grace.

[Mickey]

I think Miller forgot to take his meds with him to Aruba. Perhaps Deepak can fix him up with something to tie him over.

[Balance]

So Tim may be a little wacky. Let's give the guy the benefit of the doubt here. Working on this case is obvioulsy bringing back memories of years past, and yes, Tim may be be getting overly emotional at times. There's nothing wrong with that.

When a child is taken/murdered/abused, parental reaction can vary great deal. Some parents may go into a shell and become distant, others may exact vigilante justice on the perpetrator. Eye for an eye, as they say.

What you people have to understand before you flame Tim is that he's there, he's involved in the investigation, and he's privvy to information that most of us, even Dan, are not. I can't count the times I've seen blog participants question and show undying frustration at Mr. Van der Sloot's unwillingness to allow his property to be thoroughly searched.
It must be doubly frustrating for Tim. He just wants answers, like everyone else. What does Paul have to hide? Why drag his family through all of this? Why not just get it over with and eliminate himself from the suspect pool? Ahh, you see..There's your answer. Clearly Paul is hiding something and it frustrates Tim to the point of near-unprofessionalism.

Mr. Miller may be walking a fine line, but IMO he hasn't crossed it yet. An innocent person doesn't act as Paulus acts.

Please, quit nit-picking Mr. Millers actions. He may be re-living his daughters investigation in a sense, but maybe that's what this case needs right now. Someone needs to keep the fire under Paul's ass.

[birmingham dog]

Just saw an EquSearch guy on Hanity and Colms, he sure knows how to spin. This EquSearch guy made it seem like the VD Sloot property has Not been searched, while in all honesty the FBI and Aruban plice have searched this property on NUMEROUS occasions.
I am loosing repect for Fox News, you can take that "Fair and Balanced" Moniker and throw it out the window. I see no balance and what we are TOLD is not FAIR to all parties involved.
As I have been saying all along, no matter if Joran is guilty or not, this situation will never be solved and Justice will never ben dealt out. The Lynch Mob mentality has made it seem to a Number of people that there is a posse that wants a person to blame. it seems this person is guilty, but are you sure? No matter hang him anyway, while the REAL perpatraitor might be getting away with a crime, because no-one wanted to be sure they just wanted to see a noose on someones neck.
Hypocrisy is abundant, I for one want closure just as much as the next person, but n my case I am willing to wait to make 100% (or as close as you can) to having No Reasonable Doubt that the accused is the REAL assaulter/murderer/etc. if it means3 more months then so be it, if it means 3 more years so be it. I want JUSTICE, and I want to be satisfied that ALL of the people involved receive the punishment that is deserved.

GWD

[////CroSSBronXXPreSS////]

Good job balance !!!!

Everyone should type a little less and read that a few times before you grab your bats and jump on the wagon ... what a joke people are sometimes ... damn!!

[pk]

What Tim Miller did to Abel with no physical evidence available was wrong no doubt about it, however, he is trying to help Dave Holloway and Beth Twitty find their daughter and should not leave in my opinion. They are in the middle of a living hell need all the help they can get to find Natalee. He just needs to think before he speaks sometimes as some of the things he has said during interviews with Beth and/or Dave are cruel.

Tim Miller's organization has helped find many kids and should be thanked for that.

I will never judge anyone that has lost a child as it is hell on earth. I know from the death of my own daughter, the punched in the gut feeling is just as strong today as it was 14 years ago. I do think each person deals with things differently, thank god I had a son that needed me each and every day to keep me going and a mother with big strong arms to hold up.

[DeeDee]

Birmingham Dog: Beth Holloway Twitty said that Van Der Sloot over saw the search on his property by the Arubian police with FBI shadowing and he only allowed them to access certain areas. He did not give them full access to his total properties!!!!!!

[birmingham dog]

DD, is this the same Beth Twity that said Natalee Didn't have a boyfriend? That Natalee's room Didnt open to the beach?

Dont believe everything you hear from her. Do you really think the FBI would accept being GIDED on their search? I think NOT....

Wake up, she is a media hog and will say anything to make her case....Now if Dave Holloway said it then I would listen. but those Twitys IMH can NOT be Trusted, just like those mtn brook kids..

GWD

[sandyst99]

When did we stop blaming the Aruban autorities, and target the people that ARE helping Natalee family??

When John Walsh (America's Most Wanted)was on Hannity and Colmes (sp?), he said that it was time to demand some answers. If Tim wants to take on that role, so be it. We're not getting anywhere the way we're playing the game now!

[Maria]

BD,

The FBI does not have the same authority in Aruba as it does in the US. It can't just go in and search a property like it would in the US. Everyone knows that PVDS and Van Stratten are close friends, I don't think that it's too big of a stretch to say that maybe the search wasn't that thorough.

And what do you mean that the Mtn Brook kids can't be trusted? Why do you say that? I myself live near there and I've never had any negative experiences with them.

[Maria]

Sandy,

Amen to that! Keep the focus on the people doing the real damage to the case. Tim may be a bit out there, but his heart and his intentions are good.

People need to remember that this family is suffering and the only way that they can keep this case in the public eye is to be a "media hog" - in the world where there's so many new stories breaking, you HAVE to act certain ways to continue to hold the media's interest. Sad, but true.

[Sam]

I am so glad to see some of the considerate post on Tim Miller and the Twitty's and Holloways.

I know that the majority of us coming here to read would love to see this case solved. No matter what the outcome. We come here to read because we are unable to be an active part of the search. I so admire all of the volunteers that make up Texas Equisearch and that includes Tim Miller.

So he gets a little carried away sometimes. I believe it is because he cares so much.JMHO
Sam

[k.jeanne]

If we can't be part of the solution for heavens sake don't be part of the problem. These people, all who have lost close family to such morbid violations, deserve our grace.
Posted by: DeeDee | August 1, 2005 08:59 PM

DeeDee, very well said!!!

[westcoast]

This man, Tim Miller is an old has been drunk. Dan, this story is very sad about Tim Miller and his daughter but my first reservation is...why did his marriage end only 6 months after such a travesty? I would really like to know what his wife thinks. For him to go on such a rampage with threatening the person he felt responsible for his daughters death is one thing. But this doesn't make sense at all, not for someone to have a clean record like that. I'd like to know why he felt so strongly this person was the one responsible. Was it his alcoholism taking over and reality didn't exist anymore? Or was he so overwhelmed by his failed marriage and the loss of his daughter that he needed to pin it on someone/anyone?

All I know, is he makes absolutely no sense in any media conversations. He sounds quite frankly like an old has been drunk with depleted brain cells and can't function with normal question/answer capabilities.

I feel sorry for him, but not to the point of what he is doing right now with the media. He isn't doing the family and service other than digging in the garbage dump. I know, I know, flame me for saying that but he shouldn't be there any longer.

I still feel Natalee is out to sea, never to be found. This search is heading no where with this group and they know it. So why are they still there and going back time again? For media coverage, to keep this case at the top of the news with Fox tv.

[clintcarter]

Now That's what you call a Source!

I don't know if he's a fool; better men have loved the cameras, and I don't know about his work, but he's gotta be a little unhinged, understandably.
People suffering mental trauma shouldn't make decisions involving lots of people.

And I'm now officially tired of the Relatives of the victims at the WTC. Some deserve the positions they've attained through their hard work but most of them should call up someone in Oklahoma City or a cop's widow or a dead soldier's family and pass some of that largess along. In the spirit of it's giving, of course.

[clintcarter]

Tell Tim Miller that Abel was an analytical mind who was treating the case the way we do on this blog. And that fantastic pictures can be painted by people eager to believe; later to sift off our screens. Abel had found a Natalee Holloway. He's one of US.

Tell Miller to look at this blog and the certainty with which people will make wrong decisions. It may free him somewhat to realize this guy likely isn't the killer (point out that Both women recanted their previous, possibly frenzied statements).

[(((AG)))]

Posted by: joetwopoles | August 1, 2005 07:47 PM

Okay, Joe, I'm back online. Had an 11 hour drive today -- 2 1/2 hours of which were three different traffic slowups thru NC on I-95 South.

Trying to catch up. Just finished reading the previous forum, starting this one. Sure learned a lot about rock hounds!! LOL

[Jane]

Thank you so much, Dan, for your comments about victims and victim thinking.

[kredsocks]

Anyone that beats animals like that deserves what they get. I guess in this case you have to decide who you believe and I choose to believe the women who said Abel beat horses. Also, were any bones of horses or decomposing horses found on his property? The women would have no reason to make that up and go forward on their own. He then lied about it. Also, his behavior was scary in general. Some of the most famous serial killers were people you would not expect. Bottom line is you never truly know a person for sure. Abel was guilty, and he got rid of the forensic evidence over the years.

[VR]

The information I get here is excellent -- at times, biased, but hell, who isn't ? aren't
we all ?

BUT:

Get back to basic's when you criticize someone's
actions --- MOST of the statements regarding
"facts" I have researched (only about 10 or 12)
have 2 sides to the story -- some sounded "severe" and matter of fact, yet when
I researched one "indictment" -- seems like the
severe charges involved a new form that wasn't
submitted properly.

So.....let's not always go by what the press
presentations allude to -- afterall, incomplete
paperwork on a new form was not a big "paper
seller" --- not near as good as the lengthy
description of the formal charge involved.

I read comments in this and other forums that
quote reports, etc. -- I have learned to research
extensively, before directly quoting most of them. Invariably, there are more aspects involved.

Also, keep in mind, PUT YOURSELF IN THE PERSON
YOU ARE CRITICIZING'S SHOES -- HOW would you
act after having a daughter killed or missing --
Every nut in the woodwork calls you, writes you,
offers information ALONG WITH THE WELL MEANING
PEOPLE WHO HELP YOU --- Nightmares, maybe ? Hope ? Coming and going and THEN TO WORK WITH
THE NEAR HOPELESS SITUATIONS SIMILIAR that open
up wounds consistently ? Maybe my reactions
to some of the "I don't give a damn" attitudes
and non-caring people and the negative results
I had to deal with (even though many are positive) ---- HOW DO I KNOW HOW I WOULD ACT
OR REACT ----- I lean toward this justification,
based on an experience I had as a young woman.
I was thrown into social circumstances with a
person I did not care to be around -- she seemed
to "snap" at people, was abrubpt and just
generally not pleasant -- One day, someone else
told me of THE PAY CUT SHE TOOK (which was hidden
from her professional studen husband who would
have objected) TO CONTINUE WORKING (she was
a degreed professional) WITH CRITICALLY ILL AND/
OR HORRIBLY CRIPPLED CHILDREN ALL DAY EVERY DAY
-- WHEN she could have opted for more money, a
fabulous facility with all the latest equipment,
shorter hours, etc. --- I thought about it a
while and finally decided:

I CERTAINLY CANNOT DO WHAT SHE IS DOING ! She
deals with hoplessness, sadness, sometimes
'hardened' people who have calloused themselves
to 'feelings' as their way of dealing ----
Certainly, my being subjected to her somewhat
'strange' demeanor was little price to pay,
considering HER EMPLOYMENT and THE GOOD SHE
ACCOMPLISHED... and like I said, I
CERTAINLY COULD NOT HANDLE 'WHAT' SHE WAS
DOING ! I could do absolutely nothing for the
hundreds of children and their families she
helped !

So, take a breath, lighten up a little on
your critism unless you are willing to give up
your current lifestyle, put in hours and
effort, and accomplish what the person you
are criticising is doing -- There may be some
negatives associated with that person and way
of "doing" BUT, IF THE POSITIVES ARE THERE ----

It really is easy to sit back, speculate and
condemn -- until you've been there, done that
at least be fair.

[Sam]

great post VR.

[Fifth Generation Houstonian]

Texas Monthly??? Best friend of Dan Rather and home of Molly Ivins? Dan - Perhaps only Native Texans like myself know exactly how desperate one must be to quote a 6 year old artifact from Texas Monthly. :-)

Having lived in the Houston vicinity all my life, I am quite aware of the suspicions surrounding Robert Abel. The faces of the I-45 killing fields victims are as fresh in my mind, and in most Houstonians minds, as those of any family member. In addition to having had first hand exposure to the media coverage of these cases and the allegations against Robert Abel, I also have the advantage of having an immediate family member who is a Houston based federal agent & who was privvy to the facts of these cases. He remains convinced that Robert Abel is the person responsible for these killings, as do the other law enforcement agencies who worked the cases. This is not a case of one officer in League City and a bereaved father tilting at windmills. And this is not a case of 'poor, maligned Robert Abels who was driven to suicide by Tim Miller'. In fact, it makes me feel ill to see how easily some can be misguided into actually defending Robert Abel. People need to realize that the Robert Abel case is very similar to the Joran Van der Sloot case, where the culprit is so plainly obvious as to convince all with a logical mind. Like Joran Van der Sloot, Robert Abel had the same narcissistic sense of intellectual superiority and the same confidence and arrogance needed to play 'gotcha games' with law enforcement. Let's all pray both cases don't have the same ending.

[Let Free Ring]

Okay here are the facts on Robert Abels Death. The Man did not kill himself. He was killed acrossing the railroad track on his golf cart that he used daily to go and check his mail for out in the country many folks use golf carts. Robert Abel was happy he had a little girl that he adored and would take her with him almost anywhere. He had made some friends and even joined a fitness center. I choose to believe that Robert Abel was not guilty of any murder for no DNA was ever linked to him.

[Let Freedom Ring]

Another note about Robert Abel when you read things about the ex-wife well most of the time an ex rarely has something good to say. I think both Mr. Miller and Mr. Abel have both suffer. Mr. Miller lost a child and Mr. Abel life was ruined by accusation without a shed of proof and its sad that its me to the point where it seems one is guily till proven innocent. I do not believe that Mr. Miller ever went after Mr. Abel what I do think is its likely in the past when Mr Miller had a drinking problem he likely dreamed that he went after this man.

[Lisa]

You guys need to talk to someone who actually witnessed the death of Robert Abel, and that knows what the family had to say. First it was not a "golf cart" It was a "mule" the 4 wheel drive type. He actually stopped on the railroad tracks. He heard and saw the train coming. It's all very simple. He didn't want to live the life he had been dealt. An easy way out was to get hit by a train, quick and painless. Can not prove if it was an accident or not. Insurance still gets paid. That's assumingly.. However as the engineers wife that went through this and lived off of calder rd in League City.. Odd isn't it.. My husband is the one that hit him with the train, and we lived off Calder Rd..

No one ever mentions "The Crew" that was on the train. What did they go through knowing the kild someone, then to find out he was supposively a "Serial Killer"

Mr Miller has tried to do right for the society.. What do most people even do for their own family? Muchless the community?