Update And Correction

I'm getting a conflicting story from Aruba as regards the FBI's ability to question Joran Van der Sloot. And that item was not mentioned in tonight's news brief - linked second above. I'll continue to look into this as I know the first source is reliable. I apologize if there has been some miscommunication.

For now, I can only conclude it's up in the air. Developing.

The use of van der Sloot's samples has been blocked because prosecutors failed to clarify what his DNA samples would be compared with.

In the case of van der Sloot's friend, the court said there isn't enough evidence to warrant using the tests. The court said the prosecution could request new DNA samples from van der Sloot if it has documents clarifying what would be used in the comparison.

Additionally, while the judge is said to have ruled that it's legal to transport Joran from the prison to the Police Station for questioning due to a lack of interrogation facilities, including video, at the prison - the suspect is said to be using his right to silence, insisting he has no more to say.

Update: Currently, it's my understanding that while the FBI has been invited in "in full capacity," there may be a ruling next week which could prevent their conclusions being used as evidence in court. Seems like a bit of a mixed bag, but that could also be a workable solution for all.

Comments

[chance]

OK Jossy is clearly messed up. None of what he says makes sense. They have a witness that saw the body being disposed of at the dump. They found the pool that was used to cover the body. The body must be deeper. Why? That makes no sense.

Also, if the guy was able to stand there and watch all this, including the detail of them using a baby pool to cover the body with, why would he not go to the police right away? He was that close and no one said a word?

Jossy - she's in the pond drain it! No she's in the dump dig!

This is a travesty.......

[MrsJimiHendrix]

dan

please get some sleep

[BILLW]

dan

please read my book ; )

[PinkCobrazz]

As long as someone is willing to dig or drain..and
until someone with common sense says STOP!!!
this case is going to take all kinds of twists
and turns..with no results.

The increase in the reward is NOT going to help..its only going to make it worse.
And Jossy Mansur..is selling newspapers left
and right. I'm sure he doesn't want any of
this to ever end.

They are not going to find the body. And the
boys are not going to talk. And its to late
to try and piece this case together.

[shonane]

On one late night news report they said that Joran's request to refuse to be interrogated was denied. That's the answer - that is, if one can believe what is on the news.

[Sarah #1]

I personally think Jossy needs to be kept out of the media... if you are gonna critize the P.I. go ahead and critize Jossy.. He goes from one BS tip to another and none of the turn out.. Remember the nite his sources SAW Natalee riding around in a car and they were following her.. I can't believe the MSM even interviews the crackpot.

[Jessie]

I would say that the boy pretty well has his "I have nothing more to say to you dickheads" down pretty well by this time.
The FBI suits had there chance back in early June and and blew it to hell and back.

[scubajap]

Congratulations to all of you that have finally realized that you can't believe anything that comes from Diario

[seedyrum]

Greed begets greed

Jossy wanted to be "da man."(scoop everyone to get yet more readers)

He is a "clear and present danger" to all readers on Aruba.

If there is a limited number of worthy news outlet, his paper could be breeding ground for propanganda.

Competition is great as well as choices.

Few choices leads to dessemination of false information and thus propanganda.

Almost like keeping the readers illiterate

People with nothing to hide hide nothing

[danielle]

ranting..... I think n.graceless took her meds for the first half of her show. then it was back to CRAZY!T.J Ward was fumbling and seemed edgy.They keep showing the clip with Joran the day he went back to the beach. He comes around to the front of the car, taps his hands on the hood and proceeds to get in the front passanger seat. A cop who is looking at his clip board never looks up but he say's something to Joran that makes him glance quickly at the hidden(iguess not)camera. he closes the door and waits for everyone else and is seated in the back. This kids been riding in the front since day one! Now with this crazy search here no here approach. I think this is the only way arubian authoities will allow Equasearch to look in these spots. They can't just say where they want to look . someone has to say they saw something in order for these searches to happen.

[andy]

well - enough is enough. this has been investigation has been screwed up from the beginning, and we can't blame anyone other than the chief of polis in my opinion.

[chaser]

This morning's headline.
http://www.awemainta.com/pressdisplay/viewer.aspx
(translated terrorist treath against Aruba)
Apparently a letter from the US has been sent to the Aruban Gov't saying that if NH is not returned home safely, food and water from will be poisoned on the island. Authorities are taken this matter vey seriously.

While thishas nothing to do with the case itself, behaviour like this is unacceptable. Aren't we (US) so proud that we fight terrorism all over the world. I hope we don't get any rednecks that call this an act of patriotism instead of calling it for for it really stands for; Terrorsim.

Hoping that the proper actions are taken against these people(whomever they may be)

Greetings from Aruba

[camel]

If anyone wants Jossy Mansur's real opinion get someone to translate this
http://www.diarioaruba.com/diabierna/noticia/news4.html

From what I can translate it says something to the effect of "is this the thanks (Aruba) is getting?"

Someone should really tranlate this for us because the word senora desgracia is mentioned quite a lot and I think he means Nancy Grace.

Dan, please get someone to translate.

[chica]

Some people are calling Nancy Grace as Nancy Disgrace and this last in Papiamento is desgracia.

[camel]

Why all this hostility against Nancy Grace? I've seen Jossy Mansur on Nancy Grace's program. Why would he turn around and call her Nancy Disgrace? Are we missing something?

[Angela]

Being a U.S. citizen, I am outraged that this case is taking so long to solve. I applaud Natalee's family for remaining on the island and not leaving w/out their daughter.(no matter the outcome) I pray for the very best. Let's put some heat on Joran. He seems to be executing his right not to speak - move him to something like the Terrell Unit here in Texas - I bet he would start talking real quick. I realize every lead must be checked out. Joran knows what happened and he must tell before he makes matters worse. Natalee & her family are in prayer.

[Jessie]

Nancy Grace is always a sclowing, sneering witch.
Makes fun of ever opinion that differs from her's, and apparantly some people just eat in up and love it. The shriller she gets, the more people seem to tune in to her show. Maybe like I do some times, just to see just how ballistic she is going to go. I'll bet she would break 1 million viewers is she would chop the head of a chicken off with a hatchet on the air.

[rabroy]

The criminals continue with their lying games aimed at misleading the investigation. It started with day one(the HI/security gaurd story),the shallow grave, the walk on the marriot beach and now the duct tape and hair. All well calculated lies. I say this lying game is where the solution to Natalee's disappearance lies, be smart and take advantage of these lies you investigators.

[inxs]

Jossy made reference to there being "scent dogs" at the dump on Nancy Grace. She asked him if there were dogs.....He said yes, they went to a shot of three dogs roaming around wild. Ha, she said "NOT THOSE DOGS".

[inxs]

Jossy made reference to there being "scent dogs" at the dump on Nancy Grace. She asked him if there were dogs.....He said yes, they went to a shot of three dogs roaming around wild. Ha, she said "NOT THOSE DOGS".

[chaser]

Word has is it (and you'll remember this on monday) that Anthony Carlo (Van Der Sloot's lawyer) will file against the prosecutor for the release of Joran, being that there is absolutely no evidence of foul play. The only thing they are waiting for is for the pond to be completely searched and nothing will be found. Experts in the Dutch legal system say that the chances that he will be released are very high.

While everything points in Joran's direction, nobody has been able to come up with a shred of evidence. What we have here is a kid who's been lying and may be amongst the very best at it. But the reality is that as in the States, in Aruba lying is not a crime. In the states obstruction of justice (through lying) is punishable, but in aruba it is not.

Nobody has been able to show one piece of evidence that Natalee has been kidnapped or harmed, let alone that these guys did it.

Come monday Joran's walking and I have a feeling that will be the end of this. It will remain a mystery that will have baffled everyone.

Let's see what happens monday.

[Jessie]

Nancy should watch the Greta show so that she can get her facts straight about the case. She apparently comes straight to the set after filling her head with fruit cake. She should spend that time watching the previous nights tape if Greta. A day late would be better that totally wrong and blasting off into empty space.

[P in S.E. Asia]

Chaser,

We have a drink on ur hypothesis aiight?

I'LL BE LOOKIN OUT FOR U as soon as it happens.

Your comments are my sentiments exactly, no evidence to prove Joran has harmed the young lady.

[P in S.E. Asia]

Chaser,

We have a drink on ur hypothesis aiight?

I'LL BE LOOKIN OUT FOR U as soon as it happens.

Your comments are my sentiments exactly, no evidence to prove Joran has harmed the young lady.

[chaser]

Jessie, you are so right about Nancy Grace.

I can give you an example of someone just like Nancy. Geraldo Riviera. He came to Aruba and had no real problem with the way the investigation was going because he saw people searching, volunteers working, posters up all over the place, prosecuters going after anybody that said anything (thus arresting even innocent people) etc. I would bet money that if Geraldo saw anything that was a little bit off he would jump on it and would be kicking down doors all over the place.

And then we have Nancy. I saw her make fun of the pump they are using to drain the pond, saying that it was some kind of bicycle pump.(apparently the water wasn't moving quick enough)

Anyone living on the island know that these kind of ponds have small holes that filter through sea water maintaining the level always at sea level. They had to cover these holes and separately drain the water which took time. But the dumb ass reporters that walk around here think they know everything and never ask anybody how this works. It's small stupid stuff like this that get people all bend out of shape.

Here's an island doing its upmost to try and find Natalee and help the family with everything you can imagine. And along comes Nancy Grace with he whining.

I think that Nancy herself should come to Aruba. The problem is that the Aruban people would probably treat her nice instead of giving her the kick in her frustrated ass she so much deserved.

[Jessie]

Thank you chaser. I hope Grace reads your post so she will be well prepared to go totally off the walls Monday evening.

[mc]

There will be no peace for any of this suspects for as long as the four are alive. Welcome to Hell on Earth. There are lots of crazier people than they are in the world with an axe to grind.
Further, this whole incident has exposed many issues in the world such as; Women's rights, racisium, differences in the justice systems throughout the world, today's attitudes toward Americans, toward women, toward the press and the unbelievable lack of commpassion that so many people seem to possess. I believe that the last mentioned is exacerbated by the nature of the Internet. People alone in their own privacies; their own controlled worlds, able to say absolutly anything with no remorse and no social penalties. Never having to look into the eyes of their target audience. It has been a true litmus test of the world's current attitudes. I am not happy with all the results thus far, but I see that the paper isn't dry quite yet....

[bhamsteph]

ok, just woke up and a little foggy, so excuse me if this question is stupid (but i learned the only stupid question is one that is never asked)...

is there any way we can extradite joran to the united states? get him out of his comfort zone? when someone changes their story multiple times (i've lost count at this point) something is up. i want him here in the u.s. being questioned.

[inxs]

Jossy made reference to there being "scent dogs" at the dump on Nancy Grace. She asked him if there were dogs.....He said yes, they went to a shot of three dogs roaming around wild. Ha, she said "NOT THOSE DOGS".

[Jessie]

bhamsteph: You were correct. That is stupid.
The only heavy thinkers here this morning seem to be mc and chaser.

[chaser]

Extradition to the US is very possible if a crime has been commited on US soil or against the US in a certain matter. The local agencies, nor the FBI can find any foul play in this case. For the sake of argument, if evidence is found implicating f.e. Joran, he will be prosecuted by the Aruban (dutch) system and will serve his time in Aruba. Extradition will be out of the question and thank god for that. It would be completely inappropriate for the US to start extraditing people without evidence of any kind.

I believe we have a bad situation in a decent country. Do we have to hold a whole country and its people accountable for the act of one person who happened to (may) have done something terrible?

As an "outraged" american, I too, feel frustrated with the situation, but the police, investigators, search team, red cross, volunteers, etc are being blamed now for not doing enough. That I find remarkably unfair.

Imagine us saying that the NYPD and NYFD have not done enough on 911? That would hurt any american because we saw what happened and know that was not the case. Nancy Grace and her followers are doing exactely that to the people of Aruba. It's a good thing that most americans know that despite this tragic incident Aruba is still a safer place than most of our own cities.

[color]

Someone is and has been orchetrating this whole thing from the very beginning. I posted on here before they even drained the pond. I can just see whomever it is sitting around saying OK lets see if they go for this one. I knew her body wasn't there, they are playing LE like some kind of major chess game. Ofcourse Joran is not going to talk, and I agree with Chaser he is going to walk. Joran knew this from the very beginning and he has played the game well. This is not your normal insecure scared 17yr old, and whomever is moving the game pieces here knows that. Although I am not sure I bought into this theory before, I do now. This is not just simply a missing person case.....
London caught 4 terrorists in 3 weeks who tried to blow up there subway. 2 in London. 1 in Italy,
1 in Belgium. Aruba a tiny Island can't find one body or who killed her in 8 weeks and are still chasing their tails.

[Jessie]

Thank god there still some people in this world that can write like chaser.

Me, I just want Jug Twitty, Jossy Mansur and TJ Ward to appear on Nancy Grace dessed in drag and sing that ever popular hymn "We Are The Fruit Cake Investigation Team." That would draw a larger rateing for Grace than a live shot of her chopping the head off a chicken made up to look like Joran Van Der Sloot.

[mariaK]

Color:This situation isn't unique to Aruba. Missing person casing somethimes aren't solved, no matter where they occur. The most obvious case is Chandra Levy. If a citizen hadn't stumbled upon her body the case would still be unsolved. Remember, at that time everyone was certain who did it and why. No one even thinks of her anymore (except family and friends). I don't remember anyone calling fo a boycott of Washington, DC, even though the DC police were accused of blowing that case. They had even searched the park where Chandra herself tipped them to go (by her computer records). Her remains were found exactly where she said she was going and where the police clearly missed evidence. So don't read too much into the conspiracy of the Aruba case. Sometimes a case just isn't solvable.

[Paulo]

Top o' the morning to you all,

Nancy Grace as far as I am concerned is just a broken down drug-taking alcoholic. Sorry if I am offending anyone, but if we look back to 1993-1996 we find that she's the only substitute in response to the popularity and fame gained by Greta van Sustern in the Simpson case. On the one hand we have Greta, grad of Georgetown Law, practice, and adjunct professor to boot. So Geraldo and his mates invite Nancy Grace on to debate with the good ol' boys from DC and NY and with Ann Coulter.

As Nancy fell behind in her debate position, she would begin to get hysterical to the point of mania. I am sure I am missing some news vis-a-vie those segments gathered by Grace's people; however, and I am sorry, but I just can't stand her and will not afford my viewing and information gathering with the likes of this crazed person.

Another point: No, Joran cannot be extadited (sp?) to the US. However, he can be accepted at Central Florida University and then he is fair game.

chaser: You're hot this morning. Keep rollin' baby!

Jessie, you too! Great writing!!

Angela: What on earth does your being an American citizen have to do with procedings going on in Aruba? If there is one good thing about all of this rubbish is that maybe some American's will realize how good we really have it. Furthermore, it seems like you have some inside knowledge on our penal system.

I understand your outrage! The British have managed to do what so many other organizations and nations have never been able to do--catch the bad guys.

Like it or not folks, when Geraldo Rivera went to Aruba and saw the "reality" of the matter, upon his return interview he laughed and made the comment about van der Stratten and van der Sloot in the commissioner's office. Personally, as filthy as this case is, even the slitherin' Rivera won't go there.

Paulo

[Paulo]

Oops!

Extradited, extradition there we go.

[chaser]

Top o' the morning to you Paulo! Glad you can join us.
Excuse my spelling, my fault. My sincere apologies.
However, van der Stratten is spelled van der Straaten.
And as per your comment on Joran going to Florida:
I think not. And even if he would go, the juristiction would be in place and they would not be able to proceed with a complaint, because the crime would have been commited on foreign soil.
In any case Van Der Sloot's would be out of their minds if they went to the US.(which is a fact that in of itself is ironic)

[Kat_Gram]

The FBI was never going to be able to interogate Joran or anyone else. They are there in an advisory / consult / observer role to the Aruban authorities.
Here in Canada, the FBI has been consulted in investigations ie profiling, but the Canadians run the show. I don't think that the Dutch system is bad, it's just that nothing was done for the first ten days regarding the people who were seen with her last. And the pull of Paulus in their system.
Increasing the reward for information is probably not a good thing. Before Bernardo / Homolka were even suspects, the chief of the investigation and task force went on TV and made an announcement of a large reward. Every nut case phoned the tip line. There were a couple of good tips, but they had to waste their time going thru the tips from the nut cases.
In the end the ten million dollar task force came up with squat.
Karla came forward after Paul had smacked her around. She knew the end was coming and she ratted him out and made a deal. Turned out, she was just as guilty and in fact initiated some of the kidnappimgs / murders herself. It all came down to her trying to save her own skin.. her survival instincts.
In this case, unless someone talks, and I am thinking Satish nothing is going to happen.
Assuming that Natalee is dead and they find the body and Joran's semen, so what, he had consentual sex with her. Prove otherwise at this point in time. Deepak's DNA could be there also, but she was in his car and could have picked up a hair or something.
Paulus is the puppet master of the legal moves that are going on presently. Given his history in Holland, he will be in this forever. In Holland, he kept a road from being constructed on his property for 12 years by appeals and injunctions. The road was finally built, but somewhere else.
There just has been too much bs, misdirection, lost time to ever find the truth as it has been
obscured by events.
Satish seems to be the most vulnerable on an emotional level. He might crack under pressure.

Well, that's my therapy for the day. Dan should charge by the word !

[chaser]

Paulo, are you saying that Geraldo found this case too dirty and left? Are we talking about the same person?

[chaser]

I'm heading off to see what is happening at the landfill.

Will post later.

[kescah]

Remember that it is Jossy's job to dig up stories and report them. It is the PRIVATE Investigator's job to investigate and turn the information over to the Holloways and/or the polis/FBI. It would be nice if reporters had more information from the polis to feed us, but they don't and so they have to grab at whatever they can get. If they want to sell stories. And that is what they are paid to do. So Jossy can't really be criticized for what he is doing, but Ward.....

[Grandma]

If they let Joran walk Monday, Aruba might as well kiss US tourism good-bye. The only reason tourism is up right now is because of this case. When it goes "cold", it won't be interesting to tourists anymore. Just my opinion.

[kescah]

"Why all this hostility against Nancy Grace? I've seen Jossy Mansur on Nancy Grace's program. Why would he turn around and call her Nancy Disgrace? Are we missing something?"

Nancy Grace decides who is guilty and who is innocent for herself. She does not allow the jury to decide. If the jury goes against her (after carefully listening to all the evidence for days or weeks, which she has no access to) she sarcastically lambasts their decision. She interrupts people she's interviewing if they say something that does not go along with her point of view and humiliates them. She is condescending, and thank goodness, is not in charge of who goes to jail and who does not. I'm sorry her fiance was murdered, but suppose they had wrongly made her the chief suspect in the case? Then what? Someone should go on and on for months on their own daily TV show sarcastically pointing the finger at her and calling her names? Judging her guilty? And then suppose it had gone to court, the jury carefully weighed the evidence, and she was pronounced innocent. Then people all over the States and further should be led to despise her? She would feel terrible for that. But she can do that to others. How does she, or we, know who is guilty. In this Aruba case, we can certainly see who lies, who is protecting people from the law, and who is keeping important information away from grieving parents. But what we do not know is who drugged Natalee, who raped Natalee, who murdered her, or even if anyone did these things. Let's not Disgrace ourselves by being judge and jury without all the information.

I applaud the Holloways and Twittys for their nonjudgemental, mature dealings with all involved, and for not wishing bad upon the innocent people of Aruba.

[kescah]

And I think that their mature way of dealing with this situation is what has made us want to watch the situation and offer help. Because we respect them.

Too bad for Nancy Grace.

[sbw]

Natalee (according to Jossy) is somewhere on (or around) that island. The three "boys" probably could not have had the forsight to plan a murder and have a boat ready to transport a body out far enough into the ocean so that it didn't wash back up on shore without being seen by SOMEONE. My thoughts? They gang-raped her, got scared that she would report them and killed her...OR they used the date rape drug and she died from that, which would also scare the heck out of the three of them. They then took her to the best/closest place they could find to dispose of her, then came back and did a thorough cleaning of the car. (Reported seen by a witness, the Kalpoes were vigorously cleaning their car inside and out.) My question...if she is found after a few months (or more), and IF she was raped, will DNA still be present and viable for testing?

[kescah]

Thinking of Nancy Grace, who feels that she is the prosecutor on many of these cases, I got to thinking of what a problem is in the judicial systems of many countries. The prosecutor, like Nancy Grace, has the job of proving a person guilty, whether they feel that they are innocent or guilty. They just overlook anything that seems to prove innocence and go on to hopefully win the battle. The defender has to do the opposite, unless they manage to step out from under a case. They have to prove a person innocent, regardless of what they know. So really, it is just a battle between lawyers. Who can produce the best "evidence". Mix in a little corruption, and evidence can be invented. And this is called the justice system? A man was just found to be innocent 10 years after his execution. He declared his innocence down to the end. If Nancy Grace had been airing a show about him 12 years ago, she'd have been sarcastically sleezing about his cries of innocence and calling him a cold blooded killer. Many people have been found innocent after doing long years of time. How do their prosecutors feel? How did their defenders feel when they could not save them? How did their mothers feel? And what became of the lives of their wives and children? You'd have to be without a conscience to prosecute an innocent person.

How does this apply to Natalee's case? Well, none of us knows who is guilty of what, unless someone who does is reading this. But we can see who is lying and changing stories, etc. I'm sorry for Joran if he is innocent and received bad advice on how to handle this mess. I'm sorry for Satish if he was dragged into this when he'd done nothing wrong. (The Bible says, "Bad association spoils useful habits." It can also ruin lives.) I'm very sorry for the security guards! Too bad they can't win financial compensation for what happened to them. But we cannot play judge and jury without the facts, and neither can Nancy Grace.

[sleuth]

I only know one thing: After Natalee no longer makes the news at Nancy Grace's show, I will no longer have a valid reason for watching her. I find her vulgar and very mean spirited, opinionated and kind of like O'Reilly, except he is not vulgar.

[kescah]

"Jossy - she's in the pond drain it! No she's in the dump dig!

This is a travesty......."

You said it. But the real travesty is if she is in the dump! Anyone who has given birth to a child and held them in their arms for 2 minutes has become aware and awed by the value of that little person. They are precious and priceless. Imagine Beth's feelings when she looked at little Natalee. And all her joy while she watched her grow and develop. She became more precious as she spent time learning and doing nice things for others. She was a dear friend to her mother, and likely her father. She went on to earn a full scholarship for premed studies. Whether that had happened or she struggled to get her GED, she only increased in worth as she lived her life. She had much ahead of her in doing what she would come to do in her career and for her future personal life. She would be the mother of Beth's grandchildren, and a good one for sure.

Now imagine how Beth will feel if this priceless young woman has been thrown in a dump to rot like so much trash! It's bad enough to put our loved ones in a beautiful coffin for a burial. I hope that if anyone killed Natalee, on purpose or by accident, that they would at least have had the decency to find her a better resting place than that! And they could let her parents know where to find her so that her remains could be given a decent burial. If they had any remorse, they would at least do that!

[a-nony-mouse]

If you don't like Nancy Grace, don't watch her. The TV Guide will tell you when she on in your area. Personally, I find it refreshing to hear someone that is not afraid to speak their mind, which, the last time I looked, was everyone's constitutional right.

[kescah]

People DON'T have the right to speak their mind when it is slander or libel, and I hope she gets sued by someone for that!