Dutch Statement

Read this - then read my post below. Sorry, Ambassador, but I'm going with the people I talk to in Aruba.

Netherlands reassures US public over Holloway case 1 July 2005 AMSTERDAM - The Dutch ambassador has told the American public everything possible is being done to resolve the mystery surrounding the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. "I fully understand and appreciate the feelings of the many Americans who have expressed their legitimate concerns to my Embassy," Ambassador Boudewijn van Eenennaam said in a special statement.

The message posted on the embassy's website continued: "I want to reassure the American people that everything is being done to resolve this tragic case. We are standing together in our efforts and our hope." The 18-year-old vanished on 30 May while holidaying on Aruba with friends to celebrate their graduation from high school. Aruba is a Caribbean island of 71,000 people and an autonomous part of the Kingdom of the Netherlands. Local police suspect Holloway is dead but her body has not been found despite intensive searches over the last four weeks.

Three young men who were the last people seen with Holloway are in custody but they continue to deny any involvement in her disappearance and suspected murder. The main suspect in custody is the teenage son of a Dutch judge who works on the island. The magistrate was briefly detained himself on suspicion of being an accessory to kidnap leading to the victim's death but the judge was released due to lack of evidence.

Aruba's chief prosecutor Karin Janssen, however, has told CNN the judge advised his son that without a body police would have no case. Janssen stressed this is not the case as the authorities can prosecute without a body.

The failure to find Holloway dead or alive has led to extensive coverage of the case in the US media and damaged Aruba's reputation as a safe holiday destination. The ability of the local authorities to resolve the case has also been called into question.

The Aruban government was so concerned about the negative impact on the island's image it asked the government in The Hague to intervene. Ambassador Van Eenennaam's statement on Thursday was an attempt to address the concerns about the case.

He stressed the search and investigation was being carried out by the "Aruban and Netherlands authorities, in close cooperation with United States officials and the citizens of Aruba..." "Much to the dismay of everyone, there has been no sign of her thus far and the pain grows deeper with every passing day. On behalf of the people of the Kingdom of the Netherlands, I want to express my sympathy and support to the family and friends, and to all who are committing their time and efforts to finding Natalee."

He emphasised that the investigation is being conducted according to the rule of law. "The legal system of Aruba is identical to that of the Netherlands, which receives the highest marks from the United States Department of State. It differs from the US system but it is as effective." Several Aruban, Dutch and US agencies as well as a private firm from Texas hired by the missing teenager's family are carrying on the search.

"We are all working closely together. The Royal Netherlands Marines, the Joint Dutch Aruban Investigation Team, the Netherlands Forensic Institute, the Netherlands Coast Guard and Dutch legal experts are assisting the local authorities in Aruba together with US authorities, including the Department of State and the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI)," the statement said.

Question: Is a Dutch Oven similar to a crock pot?

Comments

[Selena]

Now the island is back to 71,000 people again...

[patrickq]

I'm sick of all this bs. I think if I were Jug Twitty and Dave Holloway....well it's time to say fuck you to the Aruba Govt and police. No disrespect to Jug and Dave, two law abiding citzens, but don't put your wife and ex wife out there confronting the suspects. Take care of these punks behind the scenes, when the timing is right. Let the authorities do their job. If they fail, you take care of it 'another way'. Not by sending your wife out to yell at JVDS and chase him around the island, you handle it like a man. Justice must come....give the law on Aruba their chance and shut your mouth. If they fail, you take care of it like a man. You and friends pick up JVDS some months from now and start breaking fingers and cutting off fingers. Call me a lawless, cowboy american or whatever. It's how the italians do it, and how the americans did it in the days before everyone got politically correct. My g-grandpa in kentucky settled some disputes through hangings and always carried a gun on his hip. In kentucky, the law was the mountain people. It's time to say fuck you to these aruban assholes and wait for your moment. TiME To SETTLE THE SCORE.

[Alvaro]

patrick g

Only problem with that is that this is not happening in Alabama or Ky. That would be the worst possible thing they could do. Can you imagine on top of all this, having one or more of Natalee's relatives being arrested for something like that? A "man" has got to think of those left behind, not just the ones who are now gone...

[Mary]

Dan....Question: Is a Dutch Oven similar to a crock pot?
Dan you are a trip.

Aruban goverment is handling this like my crock pot cooks a roast. Slowly slowly. Eventually it gets done. Lets hope this will indeed be the case. Waiting and watching. ;o)
~Have a wonderful 4th ! ~

[Lake]

How can one take seriously a man who would keep the name Jug Twitty? This man needs to get a gip on reality. The FBI, the Dutch Marines, the Dutch Airforce are or have been involved in the case of his missing stepdaughter. Why stop there? The CIA and the airmoble 101 Airbore and the C-bees might like to have some R&R in Aruba.

[annie]

Personally, I am going to reserve judgment on any of this as things come out Monday. I want to see what happens to the boys and what information is released (because the discovery phase can begin then, I believe if I heard correctly) during this next round of detainment so more may be publically disclosed.

I know many people have speculated conspiracies, corruption, etc. While I honestly do believe there is a huge amount of corruption in this world and in that area, I also think this case may or may not necessarily have any bearing on any of that. It may be more simplistic than that.

One thing I think we are forgetting, that even though this has been an excruitiatingly long period of time for the family, from an investigation stance, it really hasn't been very long at all. Even here in the US, for a missing person, this would be considered a very short period of time. Looking at the Groene case, for example, they had been missing for 6 weeks and now is the first break they have had to get somewhere with that case. It hasn't even been 5 weeks for Natalee's disappearance and yet we are expecting so much more from Aruba.

Yes, it is a small island and not near as big as the US for searching purposes. Yes, it has a lot more resources devoted to it. But my experience has been that often "more" leads to less results. Sometimes you stomp all over evidence that way or you end up in more finger pointing incidences than progress. Therefore, more resources doesn't mean faster results necessarily. It just means more people to add to the confusion.

Aruba and Dutch law have their own methodologies and while they are different from ours, it doesn't necessarily make them wrong or ineffective. Do I believe they have botched this case? From my American standpoint, yes. But then again, I don't even know what evidence they really have and where the case is headed yet. I am far from an expert on Aruban law, Dutch law or even US law. I am going off of tons of theories from posts, news reports, etc. and that isn't fact. We only have very few facts in this case:
1. We have a missing American girl.
2. We have three youths that seem to not know the meaning of the word "truth", who were last seen with her.
3. We have a trained legal authority (judge-in-training I believe they keep referring to him as) who has given "legal" advise of "don't talk to anyone", "no body, no case" to the three boys. This has moral and ethical questions, but that may be being addressed by the Aruban authorities. We just don't know yet.
4. We know that the authorities have computerized tracings (emails, instant messages, internet activity) and phone tracings (cell phone, text messages).

Beyond that, everything else seems pure conjecture by all of us (me included). Therefore, I have chosen to wait and see, at this point, versus get riled up until we know more. All the speculating, watching the news people get riled up now and seemingly starting to agitate everyone they are interviewing; the poor Texas team exhausted, beat up and now emotional; and the family totally spent and emotional is draining enough without coming to false conclusions and accusations that we don't necessarily know if they even have any merit.

I personally feel my time could be better spent praying for Natalee and her family. The Lord ultimately knows what has happened and He will get the final judgment on all of this anyway.

The truth always comes out (even if years later, which I pray will not be the case here).

I admire Natalee's families tenacity and patience during such a nightmare and pray that they can find some peace and resolution to this soon.

[Lake]

Annie: Nice post. But if God is going to give the mother the answer as she is fond of saying, she should spend more time praying for the answer and less face time on FOX. The stark truth is that If she is to receive the answer she wants, it is going to be from humans busting their chops to get the answer.

[dolphin]

This is obvious from this story that the Deutch cannot afford to keep law and order in this Island far from their country. This is the result of lack of ressources stemming from a post-colonialist dream. A banana republic might have done better without incompetent people rejected from the "mother" country. In fact the crimes commited in this story are also resulting from this system.
The ambassador can say all these good words, it doesn't change this fact.

[kay]

It is getting late It is clear I am free associating here, but the whole Mafia connection has intrigued me and made me wonder about the island slogan "ARUBA: WHERE HAPPINESS LIVES"
HAPPINESS LIVES spelled backwards becomes: SENIPAH EVIL
We all know what evil means but what does senipah mean?...
Senipah Indonesia is one of the top 10 corrupt countries in the world where the mafia rule and global business transactions with the Italian and Russian mafia are well orchestrated. Indonesia was colonized by the Dutch in the early 17th century and has a legal system based on Roman-Dutch Law.
What is the historical basis that might back up some of the "follow the money" theory? Read below (Business Week) to start thinking about the involvement of the Dutch officials and a past story of corruption and perhaps this Natalee Halloway case is drawing some attention to some associations that would never be made without a glare of light shone upon them:
INTERNATIONAL -- ASIAN BUSINESS

Indonesia: Where Did the Billions Go? (int'l edition)
Investigations are focusing on Bank Indonesia's tangled offshore dealings

At first, it just looked like shoddy bookkeeping. But as auditors pored over Bank Indonesia's books in December, they kept coming across odd entries. According to the records, large sums of ''assistance'' had gone to ''affiliated parties'' of the central bank about two years earlier. As the financial sleuths from KPMG International and the Indonesian government dug deeper, their suspicions grew. At a time when banks at home were in desperate peril, the probe showed that substantial central bank funds had gone to an affiliate in the Netherlands. The Dutch bank then bought securities in Indonesian institutions, raising questions whether central bank funds were used inappropriately. What's more, auditors could not find records for millions in gold deposits at the central bank.

Investigators are still following tortuous paper trails to find out what really happened at Bank Indonesia during the chaotic years before and immediately after the 1998 downfall of President Suharto. Although the Finance Ministry is backing off of earlier suspicions that the central bank is billions of dollars in the hole, audits run by the government and the International Monetary Fund have raised questions about the institution's handling of funds intended to shore up local banks. The Indonesian attorney general is not involved in the probe, and no criminal charges have been filed. But Indonesia's Supreme Audit Board is launching another investigation, and Indonesian President Abdurrahman Wahid is pushing for the central bank governor's resignation.

The investigations are unfolding just as Wahid struggles to cleanse the government of officials close to former president Suharto, stem the power of the army, and lure back foreign investors. A thorough probe of the central bank could assure investors that Wahid is serious about forging a new era of openness. But more ugly revelations also could damage confidence, by exposing the flaws of an institution that many thought had resisted the pull of money politics under Suharto. Such an expose also could show just how monumental a task Wahid faces. As one local banker puts it: ''Indonesia is bankrupt in both the moral and economic sense.'' If Wahid falters in tackling these ills, investors could stay away.

Officials at Bank Indonesia deny anything illegal or improper occurred. ''There are some people who don't understand what the function of a central bank is,'' says Governor Syahril Sabirin of his critics. He adds: ''I think I've done quite a lot during my stay at the bank.'' Sabirin has strengthened the central bank's independence from the Finance Ministry, reduced interest rates, and slowed inflation.

The central bank was set up decades ago by the so-called Berkeley Mafia of respected Indonesian technocrats, many of whom studied at that University of California campus. It has been supervised by what were regarded as the country's most honest civil servants. The bank's defenders blame its difficulties on Suharto's gross mismanagement of the economy, not on any misconduct.

Yet the questions remain. Business Week has not been able to interview the KPMG auditors involved in the probe, and it has not seen two 100-page reports prepared by auditors in December. But over the past two months, the magazine has interviewed officials involved with the audit, people who have seen the reports, and dozens of current and former Indonesian officials, foreign lenders, and businessmen knowledgeable about the bank's inner workings. They all echo concerns over how the bank was run.

Sources close to the probe say auditors are investigating whether the central bank used foreign branches of local banks to lend $1.4 billion to the Suharto-linked Texmaco group. They also are scrutinizing dealings with offshore companies controlled by the central bank that could explain how several more billion disappeared. At issue is whether the foreign deals were intended to skirt domestic regulations and redirect funds to politically favored concerns. ''In the financial crisis, all institutions turned out to be bad,'' concedes Mohammad Sadli, 77, himself a Berkeley-educated former Minister of Mines & Energy. ''Supervision by the central bank was completely absent. That's the gripping and traumatic truth of it.'' Yet current central bank officials stoutly defend their record. And no evidence has surfaced that members of the Berkeley Mafia personally profited from any of the dealings examined.

One transaction that has drawn special scrutiny involves Bahana Pembinaan Usaha Indonesia, a holding company for an asset management firm, brokerage, and venture-capital firm cobbled together in 1993 by Ali Wardhana, formerly Suharto's top economic adviser and currently an adviser to Wahid. The firm was backed by Bank Indonesia and the Finance Ministry to pursue the legitimate goal of creating liquid markets in the publicly traded shares of privatized state assets.

After Wardhana became Bahana chairman, PT Artha Investa Argha, a company owned by his longtime friend, Sudjiono Timan, was given the right to take a 40% stake in Bahana. It is unclear whether Wardhana had a stake in Timan's firm. Foreign and Indonesian financiers who dealt with Timan's firm say they were told by company officials that Wardhana was a major shareholder. Bahana executive Utomo Josodirdjo denies this. Wardhana and Timan did not respond to written questions and phone calls.

ON THE BRINK. In 1996, when the economy was flourishing, Bahana issued $322 million in medium-term notes. But by July, 1998, things had turned dark. As the Suharto regime crumbled, the rupiah collapsed and local banks and brokerages were pushed to the brink. Bank Indonesia was authorized to help the banks with emergency loans, but it had no authority to help nonbanks such as Bahana. Nevertheless, some of Bahana's paper was purchased by the ''affiliated parties'' of Bank Indonesia's records.

One of these parties was Indover bank in Amsterdam, which is controlled by Bank Indonesia. Investment bankers who have done business with Bahana say Indover's exposure to Bahana paper was around $50 million. Bahana executives say they are only aware of Indover buying up to $5 million of its notes on the secondary market just as the financial crisis was brewing. In addition, Indover received ''assistance'' from Bank Indonesia, says Sabirin. Indover General Manager D. van Leeuwan says funds were borrowed from the central bank to ''secure East Asian and Indonesian risk assets.'' Van Leeuwan refused to say whether these assets included paper issued by Bahana. He says the loans have been partly repaid. On Feb. 14, the Indonesian paper Kompas quoted documents from the Supreme Audit Board that Bank Indonesia lent a total of $1.2 billion to Indover.

For the central bank to assist Indover is not illegal. But if the intent of the loan to Indover was to bail out a nonbank like Bahana, Indonesian banking experts say that would violate local banking law. Bahana, under pressure from the crisis, would certainly have benefited from having its paper in the hands of friendly investors who would not press for immediate payment.

''HUGE QUESTION.'' The assistance to Indover also raised red flags: It's unclear why the central bank would be sending funds to the Netherlands just when liquidity in Indonesia was so tight even viable manufacturers could not get financing. Yet Sabirin emphatically denies that Bank Indonesia bailed out Bahana. ''There is no such thing as [Bank Indonesia] extending liquidity credits to nonbank companies,'' he says. Officials involved with the audit are unconvinced. ''This poses a huge question over the role of the central bank,'' says one Western economist.

Bahana is now negotiating with the Indonesia Bank Restructuring Agency (IBRA) to restructure some $1.3 billion in debt. One of Bahana's foreign advisers says the firm is now earning enough to pay back some money to investors.

Perhaps the most troubling allegation was raised in parliamentary hearings last November. Investment Minister Laksamana Sukardi told a panel that the central bank, under Suharto, had funneled $1.4 billion in trade finance loans to Texmaco Group, a conglomerate run by Suharto confidante M. Sinivasan, in early 1998. Bank Indonesia lent the money to offshore branches of a state-owned commercial bank, Bank Negara Indonesia (BNI). Those branches in turn lent the money, in U.S. dollars, to Texmaco, government officials disclosed in parliamentary hearings.

The loans violated legal lending limits and a ban on preshipment trade finance, according to Laksamana. Soedradjat Djiwandono, Bank Indonesia governor at the time, told BUSINESS WEEK that he approved the loans to Texmaco under intense pressure from Suharto. ''I was afraid. I have a family,'' says Djiwandono, who was fired as governor by Suharto in early 1998. Agus Darjanto, the BNI director in charge of corporate loans, denies BNI used offshore branches to pay out those loans. ''BNI did not know [about] the relationship between former President Suharto and Texmaco in this scheme,'' he says. Texmaco did not respond to written questions.

Auditors are examining other actions by the central bank. In 1998, as inflation was beginning to take off, shopkeepers, companies, and consumers needed more notes to keep daily economic life going. Yet the IMF did not want the central bank to risk hyperinflation by increasing the paper money supply.

Bank Indonesia agreed. But several Jakarta bankers assert the central bank periodically ''double-printed'' bank notes with identical serial numbers to meet shortfalls. The extra bills had special ultraviolet markings, the sources say, so they could be easily spotted and taken back out of circulation. But bankers who say they were told of the ''double printing'' by central bank officials argue it almost triggered hyperinflation. Sabirin says he was aware counterfeit notes were in circulation, but denies the central bank was responsible.

That's just one of several issues that emerged in the KPMG audit that now are the focus of a second audit being conducted by the IMF. A senior official involved in the IMF audit says the same issues will be probed later this year by Jakarta's Supreme Audit Board. The auditors will be hunting for $200 million of Bank Indonesia's gold reserves for which KPMG could find no deposit certificates. Sabirin insists the central bank has its gold in the Bank of England and other ''very reputable institutions.'' But the auditors, he asserts, ''don't really understand'' the bank's electronic record-keeping system.

What's clear is that the central bank found itself under heavy pressure in the closing days of the Suharto regime. ''Wise men are politically not strong.'' says Radius Prawiro, who served as central bank governor from 1966 to 1973.

Where the probe is headed next, or whether it will lead to criminal charges, depends largely on what the next audits turn up. Sabirin is resisting Wahid's calls that he resign on the grounds that the central bank is supposed to be free of political influence. At any rate, it will take more than a change of personnel to fix all the damage. ''Rebuilding the domestic bank system is not a question of money,'' says Senior Deputy Governor Anwar Nasution. ''We have to change the domestic corporate culture.'' That could take many, many years.

By Michael Shari in Jakarta

Posted by: kay | July 3, 2005 02:43 AM

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[michele in bham]

To the poster "Lake"...

First of all, it takes a very confident man to keep a childhood nickname.
His brother also uses his nickname. It's very common among Southern males who comes from monied families.

And as to Natalee's mother. She doesn't go out looking for face time on FOX news.

She would much rather be doing something else. And when this first started, she wasn't doing interviews. It was only when the dog and pony show on Aruba started bungling things that she did agree to do interviews.

She is a very kind and humble woman who has worked with children with speech disabilities for 21 years.

She isn't about "face time" as you put it.

[Lake]

The last I heard, the USA has not charged anyone in the Chandra Levey case. And FBI headquarters are just a few miles from the crime scene. And it was a man and his dog collecting turtles that found the body of CL more than a year later, not any search teams. Maybe the DC police should call in the Aruba police and The Dutch criminal investigation team to round up the usual suspects and produce the killer of CL.

[Ari]

patrickq:

If this happens, it will be Joran's family turn to "settle the score" in a similar fashion, and according to your philosophy they have all the right to, and so on. What a great way for humanity to function!

[michele in bham]

Lake, the dog and pony show in Aruba that calls itself law enforcement and the DC police have a lot in common.

[JustMe]

Michele in Bham:

Can you answer a question for me? How did the Twitty brothers get their nicknames?

Jug and Jar sound more like hillbilly moonshiners than monied southerners.

And before you unload on me, although probably not as "monied" as the Twittys I am a southern male who was tagged with a nickname while still in diapers. I hated it. I never use it myself and allow very few people to address me that way now that I am an adult.

[Lake]

bham: I understand all that. I think the mom is one determined female. But I just think the stepdad acts like a JugHead. He is a loose cannon that should be defesed IHO.

[Cmoney]

Annie...fantastic post! Standing ovation, here. I totally agree.

[The Truth]

I DO NOT BELIEVE ANYTHING THAT THE ARUBIANS SAY...EXCEPT THEIR FAMOUS "WE CAN NOT GIVE OUT THAT INFORMATION", I SAY BULL MANURE TO THOSE WORDS...THIS ENTIRE DISPLAY BY THE ARUBIAN GOVERNMENT IS NOTHING MORE THAN A TIME BUYER AND A COVER UP...THEIR WORDS ARE POWERLESS...WE SIMPLY WANT NATALEE AND WE WANT HER NOW...THAT STATEMENT CARRIES MORE POWER THAN THE LAW ALLOWS IN ARUBA

ARUBA IS NOW EXPOSED...NO LONGER CAN THEY KEEP SECRET HOW SORRY THEIR GOVERNMENT IS OPERATED AND IN EVENT OF A LEGAL PROBLEM IN ARUBA AS TO HOW UN PROTECTED A TOURIST IS.

IT IS MY REGRET HOWEVER THAT NATALEE BECAME THE VICTIM...OF ARUBA

I HAVE NO FAITH, NO CONFIDENCE AND NO RESPECT FOR
THE ARUBAIN GOVERNMENT. AND I DON'T CARE HOW "NICE' ARUBIANS APPREAR TO BE...HEY THEY ARE ONLY AS NICE AS THEY ALLOW THEIR GOVERNMENT AND ITS LAWS TO BE...

BOYCOTT ARUBA, BOYCOTT ARUBA, BOYCOTT ARUBA...

[JustMe]

Lake:

Beth Twitty is from Pine Bluff, Arkansas. David Holloway is from Jonesboro, Arkansas, which is not far from where my mother grew up.

I word of advice based on personal experience - don't mess with a girl from Arkansas unless you want to get steamrolled.

[Cmoney]

The Truth....bah.

JustMe...are you going to tell us your nick name?

[JustMe]

Cmoney:

It will be a cold day in hell before you ever hear me repeat my nickname.

[michele in bham]

Just Me, just because you object to your nickname doesn't mean that Jug and Jar Twitty must reject theirs.

I believe that they are twins and that may have something to do with it.

Also, the nickname came from their mom, who is deceased. It is probably a way to keep family memories alive as well.

It just is not uncommon for people to keep their nicknames. Many people hate their names so the nickname is used.

I personaly know a guy named "Norman Elvis" but his nickname is "Tip." He's over 50 now and you can bet everyone who knows him knows him as Tip.

Jug is outspoken, and he is a man who is accustomed to getting things done. He is accomplished and well educated and there is no reason for people to keep bashing him.

MOst people I see bashing him are homosexuals or feminist. They just can't deal with stong men.

[Lake]

Americans boycot Aruba or close down C&C? Not a chance. You would have about as much success as you would if you tried to bring prohibition back in the good old USA. We have too many people who are proud of names like Jug and Jar.

[I hate the South]

Probably something like "doopee" or some illiterate shit like that. I've heard Southerners call their grandmothers "mee-maw", "boo-boo", "baw-baw", and "moo-moo", and I swear to God they are among the most stunningly ignorant people on the face of the earth.

All that aside, it's time to land US troops and do a Grenada on the Arubans. There is nothing that will put a fire under someone's ass like the old "you get them or we'll get you" treatment.

If the lead prosecutor's family were "taken into custody" by the US Marines, I bet we'd get some answers pretty damn quick.

For my Dutch friends:
The Netherlands is turning into a weak sop of a nation, and that is why Pim would have won had he lived, and that is why you will see the real Dutch have your asses soon. You've let too many lazy wailing monkeys in, and you have forgotten how to be men. Old Dutch would have settled this straight away.

[proudredneck]

Lake has an axe to grind, is either an oppressed woman or a woman oppressor. Not sure which, but you can sure pick them out in a crowd.

They stick out like a sore thumb (sore person).

[oyster catcher]

To all you Aruba and Dutch bashers:
At the time of the Chandra Levy drama it was reported by the media that there were 141 unresolved missing-person cases in Washington D.C. alone!
The Chandra Levy case was never solved, it was a private citizen walking his dog who found the body, not the D.C. police or F.B.I. The media and all their gullable viewers/followers knew all along that it was congressman Garry Condit who was the culprit. Wrong!

[oyster catcher]

To all you Aruba and Dutch bashers:
At the time of the Chandra Levy drama it was reported by the media that there were 141 unresolved missing-person cases in Washington D.C. alone!
The Chandra Levy case was never solved, it was a private citizen walking his dog who found the body, not the D.C. police or F.B.I. The media and all their gullable viewers/followers knew all along that it was congressman Garry Condit who was the culprit. Wrong!

[michele in bham]

To "I hate the South" why are you such a bigot???

[JustMe]

Michele in Bham - If my name were Norman Elvis then I too would go by "Tip."

I Hate the South - What do you call your grandmother other than her true name of Xaviera Hollander?

[me too]

Amen, Hate the South. My uncle was called Pissnuts, and everyone thought it was a great damn uproarious joke. Stupid hillbillies.

I also roomed once with a guy from Arkansas, 25 yrs. old, who would not ever flush the toilet. As God is my witness, this is a true story, and as our cabin slept four guys, this idiot's total lack of human behavior became a constant point of conflict.

I got the hell out of that place (N. Carolina), and I will never go back.

[Cmoney]

michele -- I think that if Jug can dish out the bashing, he can surely take it. As a matter of fact, I'm positive he could care less what I think of the way he's handling himself in the media. JMO -- and no, I'm not a feminist, homosexual, nor do I hate strong men.

There's strong...and then, there's something else. :)

[Lake]

I hate the south: Damn, that was funny. I can't stop laughing, even tho I am from NC and my grandmother was called MeMow. But heck, she was born in 1867 and 70% of the population was probably illiterate back then.

[michele in bham]

More bigots that hate the South based on a few people.

You people are such racists.

[michele in bham]

Cmoney, Jug is bashing who? People who raped and killed his stepdaughter?

And you and others are bashing Jug because why????

YOu don't like the fact that a white guy has the guts to stand up and say that Aruba has screwed up this investigation???

[Cmoney]

michele -- I've been spending so much time reading blogs, don't tell me that I missed the trial! The 3 boys were convicted of "raping and killing" his step-daughter??!!?? What evidence did they have on the 3?

I won't dignify your last question with an answer. Jug's color has nothing to do with anything, imo.

[proudredneck]

Michele, I personally have not heard Jug bash anyone (yet). If speaking the truth is bashing, then perhaps.

However, there is a lot of bashing right here on this board from some very bigoted people who are trying to insert some kind of class warfare.

[michele in bham]

The point Cmoney is that Jug is rightfully been critical of the bumbling of the Aruba PD.

And you all are bashing Jug for what?

Answer the question please.

Do you not believe that he and Beth have valid complaints?

And yet for voicing them he gets slammed for his name, his accent, and other things that have nothing to do with the case at hand.

Bashing Mr. Twitty for those things makes all of you look so trite. Or worse.

[websleuth2]

Thank you Dan

I finally started my first blog! And linked to this spot.

Here it is

boycottboth.blogspot.com

[michele in bham]

Thanks for weighing in Proud Redneck!!!

[michele in bham]

Oh, I forgot. A photo of Steve Croes and Joran, together.

http://img251.echo.cx/img251/5235/x1pnprgmi5o51c53k3wlvbvxjd5i8j.jpg

[Cmoney]

michele, I've heard Jug speak out against more than the investigation. Just the other night, he called the 3 boys, "predators" -- just an example there. No proof...just bluster.

Is it bashing him to say that I don't care for the way he's using the media to vent at the suspects? For all of his strong words about the VDS's...it hasn't brought Natalee any closer to home. It may feel good to vent and lash out on camera, but I'm not sure that it's getting him closer to getting what it is that he really wants. JMO

[proudredneck]

Jug knows more about Joran's predator nature based on what he has witnessed than anyone else here. It will be proven that he was/is, in fact, a predator. There are taped conversations, telephone messages, E-mails and video tapes that will shock even the most biased haters of the Holloway-Twitty family. or maybe not.

[Lake]

bham: If that is the Tatoo Steve Croes in that picture, I am Robert E. Lee and the year is 1865.

[effra]

When are we gonna get to see clips from the gangbang tape that Joran did?

[Lake]

effra: I hear Fox has the rights to that and they will be showing clips pretty soon on either H&C or Greta's show. Stay tuned.

[Cmoney]

proudredneck, maybe. Inside info or are you hoping outloud, there? We'll have to see what the evidence is once (or if) the 3 get to trial, right?

[duh duh buddy]

Hay... kin y'all hep me pull 'is corn cob out muh ayse? It's bin givin me a hurt sum'um TER-bul!

Yor fren,
Duh Duh Buddy
Mobile, AL

[Lake]

Hey PRN: IMO the 3 guys propably did prey on vunerable young female tourists and something went badly wrong with NH. Maybe a bad reaction to a drug, it does not take an IQ above room temperature to figure that one out. It is all this other crap that some are tossing out that turns me off.

[BillyBob]

All this talk about nicknames so what, it has no bearing on this case. I live down south and I don't have a nickname but I know plenty of folks that do have them. So what if people have nicknames, if thats what they want to be called let them be.

Billy Bob

[Mary]

Just got through listening to an interview on TV. I had missed it earlier tonite. There is a lot to be read between the lines of this interview as well as a lot of the other interviews i have heard in the past weeks.
I think that this whole case comes down to big time orginized crime all the way from the top down in the ARUBAN goverment. The are all involved in drugs and other crimes.
I noticed tonite that George Twitty said "we know a lot that the WORLD and the USA does not know yet." I suspect that if the corrupt goverment of ARUBA does not come clean no matter who is in danger there of getting their throats slashed that the TWITTY'S are expose everything that they have found out and I am sure that have a big story of a Huge ring of orginaized crime to tell us all about. You can bet on that.
The whole justice department is involved. Most Everyone in the justice department is involved. A complete and totally corrupt government. You can bet that the DAD is a part of it. Everyone is adding everyone pockets. Thats ususally the way it works.
DRUGS, GAMBLING, SEX TRADE, PROSTITUTION..
MONEY MONEY MONEY...ITS all about the money.
Whether Natalle is still alvie or not , we just do not know.
She got caught up in something much bigger than what it seems. Something did happen. I would not be surprised if the father set up his own son.
Its surprising what people will do for money.!!!

(I feel badly for good people (citizens~ of ARUBA.)
When th elections come around lets hope they do a lot of house cleaning for the sake of the residents there. They deserve better !!!

[michele in bham]

Hey Lake, it's Steve and Joran in the photo, so read it and weep.