Aruba Breaking

4:00 PM Update: It is being supposed that the elder v d Sloot has nothing to hide, hence the earlier waiver. Potentially, if investigators believe he has given them whatever truth he knows, he could be released tonight, barring enough evidence to hold him as a suspect in the case. That does not mean that he will necessarily incriminate Joran in some way by stating what he knows.

3:45 Update: Geraldo's amazing report: Steve Croes voluntarily went to the police and said he saw the boys drop Natalee off at the Holiday Inn - a story from which the boys later backed away. Subsequently, Croes was detained because he apparently showed himself to be willing to lie in support of his friends in this matter. Interesting look at the Dutch justice system: no sign of a recent haircut for Geraldo.

3:37 PM Update: The judge will render his decision as to whether or not Paulus v d Sloot will remain in custory at 8PM tonight. Interesting timing of events, in my opinion. It is at least possible that the elder v d Sloot could offer some information in the next few hours under waiver cited in 3:33 PM update that would secure his release. Otherwise, it is unclear as to why the judge wouldn't simply issue the Paulus v d Sloot ruling now, as he has done in all other suspect hearings today. Geraldo is said to be coming up with some "amazing" discovery ... maybe he finally located a good barber on the island. He's been looking a little ragged. : ) Developing, as they say.

3:33 PM Update: Fox is reporting that Paulus v d Sloot has waived his right to not testify against his son. The ramifications and reasoning for this are not yet known. Developing.

2:30 PM Update: Fox interview with lawyer for one of Kalpoe brothers, attorney seems to be pointing finger at Joran, suggests his changing story that first Deepak and then Satish picked him up at beach is troubing, at best. Kalpoe brothers said to be aware of Joran's changing story line. Lawyer also states he sees no advancement in the procecution's theory or story line and evidence relating to the case since last hearing. Also, only remaining suspect with no known word of hearing result is Paulus v d Sloot - Croes to be freed at 1 PM tomorrow, all others appear to be being held over until next hearing.

2:12 PM Update: From reader / comment -- Court hearings are not normally held on weekends and justice department does not work on weekends. If a hearing should take place on saturday or sunday (when the 24 hours or 8 days terms expires) they move this to the next working day. However because of the importance of the case, they did the courthearing on a weekend, but no official paperwork can be done till the next working day, in this case monday.

1:26 PM Update: As of now, of four cases heard, only Croes to be released. Earlier report stated Joran and Deepak remain in custody. All that was known of Croes connection was an email from Deepak night of disappearance. Croes was not a friend of Joran v d Sloot.

The hurdle for the prosecutor to hold a suspect gets higher over time, the requirements for keeping Croes in custody were higher as a result of his time of incarceration. It's unclear if prosecutors have enough to keep Paulus v d Sloot if he had the same requirements. The shorter term of his detention makes it easier to hold him. The Fox report did not clearly claim the older v d Sloot is being held, but it appears likely.

1:14 PM Update: Fox reporting that Steven Croes, party boat DJ to be released tomorrow, according to his lawyer.

12:50 Update: Fox reporting Joran and Deepak detention extended. Geraldo claimed to have fragmentary reports some of those detained may be released - then he seemed confused suggesting his report meant 'released" from the court house to be returned to jail. As posted yesterday, I've heard unconfirmed rumblings from sources on the island that one, or possibly two of those detained will be released today.

Fox News is reporting that the hearing in Aruba is now over. Hopefully a statement as to the outcome will be coming soon. I'll update this post as appropriate.

12:05 PM-Update: Clarification - only the hearing for Joran v d Sloot is over, additional hearings for the others being held are still to come.

Comments

[joyce]

Hi,

How long have Beth Holloway Twitty and Jug Twitty been married? Do they have any other kids?

How long have David Holloway and his wife Robin been married? I understand they have 2 other daughters together 7 and 4 maybe.

Please help.

Thanks.

joyce :)

[Ispy]

Joyce I think I have seen you post that exact same question several times over several days with no answer. Let's try

I'd have to guess 8th grade you are 14. So let say they're married for 4 years. She has a 16 year old brother. There's also mention of a step brother.

No idea about whether they have kids of their own since being married or how long the father is married to his wife.

http://www.postherald.com/me060605.shtml

""Natalee Holloway moved to Mountain Brook from Mississippi when she was in junior high, about the same time her mother married George "Jug" Twitty.
The highly social young girl found friends and became a standout member of her social group and her class in school, friends say.

"I've known Natalee since she moved here in eighth grade," said Frances Ellen Byrd,
""

[DeeDee]

Did you see or hear the small segment with Steve Croes mother. I understand she is from Curacao, the next island over. This is also the same island that the Bradley girl was seen last. Could he possibly have transported her to Curacao on such a small tender boat that was used to tranport people from the Marriott beach to the Tatoo party boat? How far is the trip?

[BK]

Who is Frances Ellen Byrd??--I know she graduated with Natalee but who are her parents?--Just thinking about Dan's riddle and the "a little bird told me"

[webweaver]

Fox has reported that Steven Croes atty announced that Steve will be released on Monday at 1 p.m.

[Stumped]

Cnn has:
Kock said Sunday he feels the investigation is moving in the right direction, as police have scrutinized cell phone records and Internet traffic as part of the probe.

Those records, Kock said, show Joran Van Der Sloot called Deepak Kalpoe about 2:40 a.m. on the morning Holloway disappeared. In that call, according to Deepak Kalpoe's statements, Joran Van Der Sloot told him he had left Holloway on the beach and was walking home. About 40 minutes later, Kock said -- about the time it would take him to walk home -- Joran Van Der Sloot text-messaged Deepak Kalpoe to tell him he had arrived.

"I just think this goes to show that the story that Deepak and Satish are telling ... is substantiated by facts," Kock said.

Antonio Carlo, defense attorney for Joran Van Der Sloot, said Sunday prosecutors have asked the judge to extend his client's detention for eight more days. The judge has not yet ruled on that request, he said.

His client, he said, was in good spirits, but was "shocked and disturbed" by his father's arrest.

None of the suspects has been formally charged, and it was unclear when charges might be filed. Defense attorneys for the four younger defendants have said they are innocent; Paul Van Der Sloot's attorneys have not yet commented.

[EJsgal]

would they allow croes to go if he supplied any drug that may have killed natalee?

[Professor]

I suspect that there may be former date-rape victims of Joran van der Sloot lurking on this forum. If you are such a person, then I would advise you to contact the FBI or to send a private message to one of the founders of this forum. As a participant on this forum, I can attest that the founders of this forum are people of integrity and are people whom you can trust. You may wish to work out an agreement with them as to how you want that information to be handled, but I would urge anyone who has been victimized by this man, or who feels that she may have been given a date-rape drug by him, to have your voice heard.

[misty]

My question is, if he (croes) has information in regard to the disappearance, would he not still be charged for not coming forward in the first place?

[ExGman]

Did anyone stop and think that perhaps the story that the three boys are now telling is true. That is J and NH were dropped at the beach near the Marriott around 130. J and NH had a romantic encounter of sorts. They parted ways with NH either being mad and going her own way or being semi-conscious/passed out on the beach. The timeline above fits. Now what happened to her after J left is up in air. Did she take an ill-advised night swim and drown. The currents in that area are certainly capable of carrying her out in the open ocean. Or did she meet up with another group who seized the opportunity to take advantage of an intoxicated,and or drugged young woman? My point is that J and the brothers may not really known what ultimately happened to NH. So many seem so quick to discount this theory, but it is within the realm of possibility. Comments anyone?

[Stumped]

Misty....EJsgal......sheesh...doesn't anyone read my posts...lol. It spells out Croes involvement as per CNN

[bamawings]

Croes' release may actually be good news. If he is supposed to be the one who helped get the body to the ocean, then maybe her body was not taken out to sea. If the water is watched so closely, then it seems that they could tell whether a boat went out. Question is whether they could have made it to the point where the garbage is dumped to feed the sharks. That would probably be a worse case scenario.
If there is any way that Joran is telling the truth and the party boat was near the holiday inn, there is a possibility that someone on that boat might have found Natalee. However, what are the odds that someone who was a friend of Deepak came along and found her? If that e-mail had any incriminating evidence it looks like they would not let him go. It is looking more and more like the father helped him out. I thought that they said last night that he phoned Deepak to come get him and then later sent a text message that he had gotten home.
On the other hand, if he did not want Deepak to get curious about things, he might have called to say he was walking home and then sent an e-mail that he was there to cover his tracks and not arouse suspicion. If this is true, the brothers may not really not what happened to Natalee but just have information regarding the coverup.

[newsjunkiegirl]

if that was the case ExGman, then I wonder why he wouldnt of just told authorities that story to begin with...why make it seem like a cover up? if thats what really happened he could just say "i left her on the beach" to begin with..instead, "we dropped her off at the hotel"

[dolphin]

One thing is not completely clear in this story:
Why would Natlee go with the three individuals? Maybe she was always closely checked by her cousins (maybe even at home) and she felt she had no freedom at all. So she wanted to have her own life for a short amount of time. This would explain the pushing match and that she did not bring her cell phone. This would also explain why Natlee said "Aruba" by the window when the car left as a victory statement toward her cousins.

This would change nothing concerning the responsability of the ones afterward involved in this dramatic event.

[up_north]

Clarification - only the hearing for Joran v d Sloot is over, additional hearings for the others being held are still to come.
.
If this is the case...how can Croes lawyer say
that he will be released..if only JVDS's hearing
is finished?? Are these things established
before hearing with lawyers in the Aruban legal
system??

[misty]

Stumped, your post on THIS forum doesn't mention croes at all....I read, and reread. If he is involved, why are they releasing him?

[EJsgal]

I think Deepak stayed on the beach as well as NH and JVDS. Satish was called to pick up Deepak not Joran. See deepak did not like to take his car even to work according to the mom. Satish always droped him off and picked him up. Deepak had been very vocal the night they were confronted by NHs family for Joran not to say anything

[caro]

Cnn reports that Steve Croes will be released on monday because of the lack of evidence against him in this case.

[texmom]

Why change their stories several times? Something is up w/these 3.

[EJsgal]

Satish does not want to get his brother in trouble. They are kids and scared.

[ExGman]

At that point they didnt know what had happened to NH and J did not want to admit a possible sexual assault, so the story about dropping off at the HI. Probably elder VS came up with the story. They perhaps figured that NH would show up and wouldnt remember the JVS incident anyway. Just a theory.

[EJsgal]

At this point Satish did not know what happened but the others did.

[Midge]

If J did just leave her on the beach, why would he lie then?

[EJsgal]

Satish has been talking from the start, hes is being used for info not to charge

[EJsgal]

They did not leave her on the beach atleast I see that as unlikley. If he had he would have said that to begin with. There is no crime in letting someone sleep off a drunk.

[EJsgal]

Well

[Stumped]

Misty...lol..I apologize....you are right....I am suffering with BLOGMATISM.....lol..I need a break. I listed the info on Joran's calls to Deepak, someone had stated that Deepak was the caller...lol..this stated that it was Joran calling Deepak.

[ExGman]

Think about it. Why would they lie if J left her on the beach? To avoid admitting a sexual assault. Im not saying thats what happened, Im just saying that its possible, and I can assure you that the authorities have pursued this theory. The evidence must lead the investigation and unfortunately under Dutch law, the public is not allowed to know what the evidence shows until formal charges are lodged. I am surprised at the lack of leaks.

[Stumped]

Misty,
Here's the Croes release info per DAN:

Croes to be released. Earlier report stated Joran and Deepak remain in custody. All that was known of Croes connection was an email from Deepak night of disappearance. Croes was not a friend of Joran v d Sloot.

[EJsgal]

So if you were facing murder and kidnapping charges (and you were 17) instead of the sexual assault that you commited you would keep quiet and not fess up?

[Awryit]

lions, tiger and bears oh my, conspiracy theories run amuck...
Is this like Jimmy Hoffa, JFK, or the epitome of a mindless whodunit "who shot JR."?
Rehashing every iota of "What IF" just emphasizes that we KNOW very little, and the facts do not add up, yet.
I can see why some perpetual readers have migraines. I appreciate all of Dan's (and his very intelligent army of loyal bloggers) hard and unending work but, alas an addiction to this is taking me away from precious time learning how to commit the perfect crime i.e. via reading comic books....

[EJsgal]

Stumped-

It is my understanding that in this forum it is allowed and encouraged to share your thoughts and opinions without the fear of being laughed at. What I said was not funny just an observation. I don't think you know any more than anyone else (hence your name) you just like to sound that way.

[DeeDee]

I too have wondered if they lied because all three boys had sex with her on the beach and all three boys left her there for dead, or to sleep off a drunk as you say. Possible. I believe that the very first arrest did say that all three admitted to having sex with her and then that story was changed saying that the language barrier had caused a misinterpretation. I think these kids know that as long as there is no body that they are almost free. Her body may show up in Panama or on the Veneszula coast from what I have read.

[EJsgal]

I am not so sure Satish is that involved still

[Stumped]

EjsGal....lighten up...no one is laughing at you. If you read it again, maybe you can see I am laughing at myself for listing info on Deepak to address questions on Croes....hence...BLOGMATISM. I do not, or ever did I claim to know more that anyone else, don't know where you would pick that up from. I had simply copied an article from CNN for that clip of info. BTW...my name is supposed to be a joke, but then again...if you have no sense of humor, you might not realize that.

[Awryit]

hence why perhaps explaining your name won't help, either
geesh

[DennisAOK]

DeeDee,

Original story did not say all three "had sex" with her, only Joran. Confusion was over the translation of "having sex". The Dutch word they used suggested kissing and fondling, but not intercourse.

[Stumped]

good point Awryit, lol.

[joyce]

Thank you "Ispy" for the info on children of the Holloway Twitty families. I tried to email you back to thank you personally, but it came returned as "undeliverable."

joyce :)

[curious]

I was hoping that one of the Kalpoe boys would be released too, I donot think they are involved, they are also being used to pressure Van to release more info....,

I think both are getting used and screwed, by the Joran and their lawyers and Aruba's prosecutors.

[willo]

DennisAOK, I do remember the very first reports say there was sexual activity with all 3--and people thought that was highly unlikely on a consensual basis.

[Stumped]

DennisAok and Willo, I remember that as well, I think it was listed at http://www.legendgames.net/blognews.asp or http://www.scaredmonkey.com

[Hopeful]

MAYBE.. Joran told the brothers to cover for him and say that they dropped her off at the HI. When that didn't work, Joran wanted to still keep the brothers close by, since Joran probably bragged to them what happened and didn't want them to turn on him and since they were part of the story he has them close by. I think that maybe the boys dropped him off at his house and this murder happened there. Papa helped dispose of the body and told the brothers to keep with the story of them dropping NH off anywhere but his house.

[Hopeful]

FOX is reporting that PVDS is going back to jail.

[SunnyOne]

FOX just announced that Paul v d s is heading back to the jail. Not being released.

[Stumped]

DennisAok, Willo & DeeDee, here is the link to which you refer to: http://www.legendgames.net/showstory.asp?page=blognews/stories/WN0000183.txt

[sassy]

Although at various points in this case I have thought that JVDS was guilty, I am starting to agree with Gman. It does not take very long to get a confession out of someone, and the length of time these boys have been in jail leads me to believe that they don't know what happened. The idea of the boys having administered her a date rape drug would be difficult to work into the timeline. She was not overly intoxicated when she left the club, at 1:00 and we know the entire evening had ended when JDVS called his buddy at two fourty. What I think could have happened, and I have read several accounts of this happening, is that one patron in a bar or club goer will wait for some attractive women to leave their drinks for a moment(restroom, dancing) and then put something in the drink. Often times that person just waits until the opportunity presents itself and then takes advantage of the woman. I also know that if the drug they put in her drink was GHB, that could have had some serious consequences. I have personal experience with the dangers of GHB and alcohol. A few years back I went to this party, and there was a small framed girl, who was taken away in the ambulance. She had taken some GHB and for her size, it made her sick. She refused to stick her finger down her throat and get it out of her stomach. She went back into the party and she was laying down, she started to choke on her own vomit. Because of the position that she was laying in, it was very dangerous. Luckily they were able to save her, but she almost died. My point in telling this story is that perhaps JDVS and natalee were on the beach and then they had a parting of ways, and he walks home. What if he started to feel bad for leaving her there and asks his dad to give him a ride back to the beach. Maybe at this point they go and find she is not breathing. The father perhaps assumes JDVS has done this to her, and it was really a conseqence of the drug. Or when he came back, maybe she was gone. I just have a strong suspicion that JDVS is not guilty of murder.

[DennisAOK]

I stand corrected.

Meanwhile:

Article in De Telegraaf (Sunday): In a recent full-page article in De Telegraaf (biggest newspaper in The Netherlands), they dedicated attention to the Natelee Holloway’s disappearance and the suspected involvement of the Dutch judge-in-training Paul van der Sloot and his son Joran. The article covered mostly all the events since the disappearance of Natalee but there were also a few statements that were not (broadly/publicly) reported before.

What happened to Natalee?
According to the article, the detectives believe strongly that Natalee was taken to the light house located at the Northern part of Aruba by the 3 young suspects. Once they were there it is believed that these suspects tried to engage in sexual activity with the Natalee, but she most likely refused and tried to fight them off. She was consequently murdered (during the struggle) and her body was then dumped somewhere on the island or in the sea.

I feel pretty sick inside.

[brian]

well if croes is being released you can pretty much throw out the theory of him breaking into the hut that contained anchors and duct tape and using a boat to conceal her body in the ocean. thats more good news than bad.

[Midge]

I think due to first lie, they knwo something. I am just saying people only lie when there is somthing to cover up.

So I don't think J is innocent.